Jazzin' up old Blues Tunes

[mr. beaumont]

Still very much the blues, in my book. A lot of these extensions, the flat 5, the #9...maybe they weren't in the accompanist's chords, but they sure could be in the melody.

There's so many styles and subsets...and a blues needn't be i IV V or 12 bars or none of that. And in fact, a lot of the earlier stuff wasn't. Blues, like jazz, is a how, not just a what. (Although there certainly are "blues" what's too, I just find them less important than the how)

Being from Chicago really just means that I can go around and hear both the best blues on the planet and the worst

Joel's story is quite poignant for me. There's a lot of curation in the blues community...a lot of gate keeping...playing the wrong kind of blues can definitely turn some eyebrows. But sometimes the sweep from an electric, West Side kinda of blues to a more jazz like "uptown" approach isn't such a stretch. Bend through those chromatics instead of playing them as 8th notes, for example

Incidentally, it's blues week over at Jam of the Week on Facebook...gonna have a go at "Away All the Time," thanks for turning me on to that one, y'all...great tune. And gotta love Lonnie.

[joelf]

Did you see that post by joelf up there? It's a blues gig and he was playing bop stuff over it and got the chop.

Not exactly, but whatever it was was not what was needed. Pomus had definite ideas about what was blues and what wasn't. And he was the boss.

And everybody in the business has to get fired at least once. Rite of passage...

[ragman1]

Jeff -

Absolutely.

Being from Chicago really just means that I can go around and hear both the best blues on the planet and the worst

I bet :-)

Glad you like that Away tune. Me too, very nice

[ragman1]

Not exactly, but whatever it was was not what was needed. Pomus had definite ideas about what was blues and what wasn't. And he was the boss.

And everybody in the business has to get fired at least once. Rite of passage...

Way it goes. I've been fired too (once) :-)

when I wasn't doing the firing...

[joelf]

Way it goes. I've been fired too (once) :-)

when I wasn't doing the firing...

Let's don't even talk about 'regular' jobs.

Oi vay...

[ragman1]

Oh, I've walked out of more 'proper' jobs than most people have had pancakes for breakfast

Never without due cause, though.

[mr. beaumont]

Here's a 2 chorus blow on "Away all the Time. Tried to throw in some $10 chords

Great tune, thanks again for turning me on to it.

[joelf]

Here's a 2 chorus blow on "Away all the Time. Tried to throw in some $10 chords

Great tune, thanks again for turning me on to it.

You have a real feel for this stuff, Jeff---especially the time feel. Please keep it up. Really enjoying you...

[ragman1]

throw in some $10 chords

See, I told you he wasn't cheap

[crusoe]

I'm absolutely baffled...you're all wonderful players.

Here's a video by Duved Dunayevsky in a blues-style I really love.
I'd call it : "Pre-Django Eddie Lang"

[ruger9]

Still very much the blues, in my book. A lot of these extensions, the flat 5, the #9...maybe they weren't in the accompanist's chords, but they sure could be in the melody.

.

So this comment made me wonder.... what's the difference in "jazzing up a blues tune", and a jazz player playing "a blues"? I've heard jazz players use that phrase a lot.... what makes it "a blues" to them? That's it's 12-bar? That's it's I-IV-V? What?

FWIW, some of my all-time favorite jazz playing is very VERY bluesy... the OLD Louis Armstrong stuff (before the "Bing Years" lol). In my ear, you can't really separate the blues from the jazz on those tunes.... nor would I want to...

[ragman1]

There's a big difference. Jazzing a blues is just putting in extended chords like 9ths and 13ths, etc, and playing extended lines that outline those chords. And it generally sounds like a blues should but with more subtle sounds. But the progressions don't have to be 12 bars, they could be 8 or 16, and so forth.

Jazz players playing blues is like this. Sandu is just a straightforward jazz-blues 12-bar progression, nothing fancy, but the playing style isn't at all straightforward!

[ragman1]

crusoe -

Were you going to do something with 'Four Until Late'?

[grahambop]

So this comment made me wonder.... what's the difference in "jazzing up a blues tune", and a jazz player playing "a blues"? I've heard jazz players use that phrase a lot.... what makes it "a blues" to them? That's it's 12-bar? That's it's I-IV-V? What?

FWIW, some of my all-time favorite jazz playing is very VERY bluesy... the OLD Louis Armstrong stuff (before the "Bing Years" lol). In my ear, you can't really separate the blues from the jazz on those tunes.... nor would I want to...

Jazz players still use the 12-bar blues form, but they make it more complex by adding passing chords, or prefacing some of the chords with a ii-V, etc. Something like this for example:

[christianm77]

So this comment made me wonder.... what's the difference in "jazzing up a blues tune", and a jazz player playing "a blues"? I've heard jazz players use that phrase a lot.... what makes it "a blues" to them? That's it's 12-bar? That's it's I-IV-V? What?

FWIW, some of my all-time favorite jazz playing is very VERY bluesy... the OLD Louis Armstrong stuff (before the "Bing Years" lol). In my ear, you can't really separate the blues from the jazz on those tunes.... nor would I want to...

sure, Lonnie Johnson (on some the Louis sides), Bessie Smith, Bechet with Josh White, old WC Handy songs. That kind of thing. Never get old....

[christianm77]

There's a big difference. Jazzing a blues is just putting in extended chords like 9ths and 13ths, etc, and playing extended lines that outline those chords. And it generally sounds like a blues should but with more subtle sounds. But the progressions don't have to be 12 bars, they could be 8 or 16, and so forth.

Jazz players playing blues is like this. Sandu is just a straightforward jazz-blues 12-bar progression, nothing fancy, but the playing style isn't at all straightforward!

I have to say the contrast between Peter and Gilad’s take on soloing on a blues is very marked. I find GH’s approach to be very clever.

[christianm77]

I'm absolutely baffled...you're all wonderful players.

Here's a video by Duved Dunayevsky in a blues-style I really love.
I'd call it : "Pre-Django Eddie Lang"

interesting. I heard this playing as extremely faithful to Django’s mid 30s style.

listening to it again - yes I can hear the eddie Lang influence. But as the clip goes on there’s some very Django stuff that no one else plays. Like that deft little picked glissando between melody notes. Django played that all the time c1935. No one else does it. They all do the monster J’attendrai/Montaigne st Genevieve lick, but not these more subtle little things.

Duved’s playing kind of underlines that modern gypsy jazz style players don’t really sound like Django.

TBH you can play anything on that type of guitar and people will say it sounds like Django. It doesn’t mean it does. People react to tone colour and the tone colour of the Selmer guitar is very reified, like the banjo.

Which can be fun if you subvert it.

[mr. beaumont]

I've seen that Duved video before...I actually think it's one of the most "Django" sounding recordings I've ever heard by one of the "new guard" guys...I absolutely love it.

I think I'll transcribe it.

[mr. beaumont]

You have a real feel for this stuff, Jeff---especially the time feel. Please keep it up. Really enjoying you...

Thanks Joel...I really like playing in this style. Bend a few strings, bash out some chords...it's very "guitar."

[christianm77]

I've seen that Duved video before...I actually think it's one of the most "Django" sounding recordings I've ever heard by one of the "new guard" guys...I absolutely love it.

I think I'll transcribe it.

why not just transcribe Django?

[crusoe]

crusoe -

Were you going to do something with 'Four Until Late'?

...just crying over it (from four until late...)
Serious: No, it was just a "balloon". What shall we do next ?

[crusoe]

I've seen that Duved video before...I actually think it's one of the most "Django" sounding recordings I've ever heard by one of the "new guard" guys...I absolutely love it.

I think I'll transcribe it.

YES YES YES...please start at once

[ragman1]

What shall we do next ?

Well, I'm game. Let's choose something with a really strong melody, something that'll stand up without lyrics (because presumably we're not going to sing it).

Also, do you want to try some soloing? If you use that Audacity program you can put down the backing and play over it. Way to go.

[mr. beaumont]

YES YES YES...please start at once

I probably will start today, but don't expect anything written out nicely. That's like school. I spend my whole life in school, I don't need to be in it at home too

When I say "transcribe," I really mean scribble down some stuff so I remember as I steal all the parts I like.

[mr. beaumont]

Well, I'm game. Let's choose something with a really strong melody, something that'll stand up without lyrics (because presumably we're not going to sing it).

Also, do you want to try some soloing? If you use that Audacity program you can put down the backing and play over it. Way to go.

"Nobody Knows You When You're Down and Out" would be a good one.