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Originally Posted by alltunes
The nature of these solos is explicitly identified in the preface to the book. So the reason you don't hear the melody is because you are not supposed to. It's not there.
That also explains why the tune titles are truncated and no copyright notices appear. These are basically chord-melody contrafacts based on the changes to each tune.
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01-29-2018 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by PaulW10
John
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Hi everyone
Having had the Joe Pass Chord Solos book for ages, i started working through "Wine and Roses" which is 3 complete choruses of chord-melody improvisation based on the changes to our tune.
I numbered each "stack" chord on the notation and created a sheet of block diagrams to go with it. I can't distribute the page of notation, unfortunately, but I'm happy to post here page 1 (mm. 1-16) of my block diagrams. If you work with the notation, you can probably figure out what block diagram goes with what stack of notes. I also don't repeat a diagram, so that will need attention in a few places.
I'd love some feedback on this from anyone who tries to use it. Maybe there are better grips? I might have erred in my reading of the notation? Hopefully this will encourage our improvisational aspect of learning this standard.
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Originally Posted by sunnysideup
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So this isn't a radically new approach, though I have a few more nice voicings in there; but I was working today on my old DeArmond Guitar Mike and the Gibson L50, the latter is also the same age as me! I was checking the newly refurbished (by me) pickup system and playing around with this tune; thought I'd post this clip to keep representing the "it's okay to play this as a medium swing using simpler chords" position!
Seriously, working with this 56 year old tune, on a 63 year old guitar with a 60 year old frizzy pickup with it's clicks, gaps, pops and buzzes... not to mention the brain-cell outages of the 63 year old player... is just FUN.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
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And guys... this isn't strictly solo guitar, but our own forum member "Fred Archtop" has a wonderful chord-melody performance of this tune here. He has bass/drums backing, but the chordal devices are all excellent and worth appropriating for our own nefarious solo guitar purposes!
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Great performance and great tone.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
Last edited by pkirk; 01-29-2018 at 10:36 PM.
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Here is my version
Chord Melody
Here is my explanation of the Chord Melody
Chord Melody Explained
Tell me what you think
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Originally Posted by pkirk
The Joe Pass book would make good reading practice with all those stacked chords.
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I had a few minutes to spare, so here's a quick explanation of how I approached this version (gee, maybe I should do all 12 keys ... NOT).
Comments, critiques, and questions welcome.
John
Originally Posted by John A.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
It IS fun to hear as well! Nice chord changes and that guitar sounds great in this clip.
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Originally Posted by Doublea A
Thanks for the video (really nice) and the explanations (very helpful). I like your idea of finding an intro from the middle measures. I've never thought to try that. Also many of your substitutions were tritone subs, right? I've been trying to use them more and more as I've learned how to spot them on the guitar on the fly.
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Originally Posted by John A.
Thanks for taking the time to explain it John! I really like the dissonant chords you're able to find and apply. They make it sound very hip!
Also I believe you've mentioned that the key of C was not correct and that F was used in the movie version? That raises one question I've always had and I remember some discussions in the past. How do we determine what key is right in an iconic song? And does it really matter to a lot of people what the key is (other than singers of course)?
I know Lawson posted Henry Mancini doing it and I suppose he probably knew the song pretty well!! I didn't check what key he used in that recording. Whatever key the composer used, I have a feeling each vocalist over the years tweaked each song's key to make it right for them. For me, I typically read each melody line up an octave when playing from music, so if the melody goes much higher than G, meaning I'm now at the 15th fret on the high E string, I'm probably going to take the key down to where it's comfortable.
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Originally Posted by PaulW10
Some of my substitutions are harmonic substitutions.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Originally Posted by PaulW10
Originally Posted by PaulW10
Originally Posted by PaulW10
As far as octaves are concerned, guitar is a transposing instrument; what we see notated as middle C in a score specifically written for guitar is actually an octave below a piano's middle C. So transposing up an octave from a score not specifically written for guitar is the correct move, but I find myself shifting octaves up and down a lot just to fit within the guitar's range and am not strict about playing in the written octave.
John
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Originally Posted by John A.
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Originally Posted by pkirk
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Originally Posted by PaulW10
John
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Originally Posted by John A.
Very interesting John. I never stopped to consider jazz in this context. A universal language. Makes a lot of sense.
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Guys
This is mainly to vent a little and possibly ask for advice, if there is any to give. I found an arrangement of DOWAR that was created mainly to give a "work out" on various chord grips, using 7b5 voicings where ever possible. I've never really done my 7b5 grips, so I thought this would be fun. It has been, except for one problem.
Below are 3 chord "grips" that you see everywhere. I'm focusing here more on the shapes than on the actual chords, so stay with me.
I love that Cmaj9 grip because if you pop the bass note to the 6th string, you get a X6 chord. If you hope the whole grip over one string (shape 2) you have a X9 chord, in this example, F9. Same shape, just hop it over. Cool. I have always been able to grab shapes 1 and 2 on the fly without fail, for over 20 years. Boom. Got it.
So then I start learning these 7b5 grips, and 3 above is super useful. 7b5 chords to me typically sound very muddy, but this grip sounds wonderful so I've been drilling on it. You will notice it's identical to the shape of 1 and 2 except the 2 inner strings are switched.
So now, I can grab this 7b5 shape pretty well, but I HAVE TOTALLY LOST GRIPS 1 & 2!! Seriously. I can't grab those shapes for love or money. Even if I stop and look... they don't come. It's like learning that 7b5 grip has erased or replaced my muscle memory for the other shapes!
Has this happened to you? What did you do to fix it? Just drill on them all? Or is there some "Jazz Guitar Jedi Mind Trick" I could use?
I will post the 7b5 heavy arrangement here as soon as I can play it decently... which may be a while.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Grip 3 is particulary useful in bar 3. There is potentially a lot of dissonance in bars 3 and 4. The Dexter Gordon version exploits dissonance progressively throughout the tune. There's an excellent closeup of his entire solo played on guitar by a Japanese guitarist (googling Dexter Gordon DOWAR transcription should bring it up). Wes also has a dissonant lick at this point in his solo, but he plays it so Wes-ly that it sounds more sweet than dissonant. Johnny Smith does something really crazy at this point in his solo - it sounds to me more like a static electricity explosion than music - really great!
Grip 2 for F tonic (F base note the A string) is a good way to close DOWAR, and many other songs; 1 or 2 posters have already done this for DOWAR. Or in a latin feel it's very common.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
I like to connect less familiar voicings with more familiar ones anyway, but this should help firm up the old as well.
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Hey Guys,
Since some are talking about the next tune I thought I'd do one more of Wine and Roses. Here is a rather spontaneous counterpoint-ish version with lots of give and take with the time. There are a few places where I stopped and pondered a phrase so the form is loose as well. I hope you enjoy it and maybe find the approach pleasing or at least interesting.
all the best
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