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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
If you’re looking for the inside sounds, the tune would be a pretty decent place to start. Be a bit dull if it ended there too.
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04-08-2024 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
But it’s interesting - in many ways I feel jazz has become more inside over time. If by inside we mean ‘playing in the key.’
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
Aside from the big old A13 arps in the key of Dm and particularly stuck by the way he pays an honest to god A dominant scale line. He plays a couple of scalic things in fact… but he was just a chord shapes guy, right? ;-)
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
Ive been working on Grant Greens What is This Thing lately, and I can absolutely say that he uses the 7b9b13 over almost every single dominant chord, but that’s probably not an accurate description of what’s going on …. He’s playing C minor scale crap, then Cmaj7 (or 6) over resolution.
EDIT — another one is Coltrane over Softly. But the whole first chorus is pretty much just C D Eb F and G (if I remember right). So I don’t really think he is making a Harmonic Statement over the G7 chord every other measure.
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Sorry to do a Ragman, but here’s a Stitt solo
Quite interesting - the first time dominant scale on the III7, later he mixes it up.
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
Why can’t there be rules Christian? WHY?
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
The jazz tendency to analyse things by chord tends to make this diatonic minor options look ore complicated then they are. Actually Reg commented on the fact that when he was getting started there was a dominant scale that looked like a Phrygian mixed with a Phrygian dominant. When you bear in mind the only thing you need to do to get from there to a Jazz Nerds International (tm) altered scale is to flat the 5.. well there you are.
And add to that the fact that Gary Burton thinks of altered as having a natural 5 too... yeah, it's interesting.
I mean take this as a line and apply to a bop II-V-I say (from Carulli)
:
If you put that all over an E7, you'd get a "#9". This is the sort of thing that may well happen if you are improvising and less careful about the vertical aspect. It probably happened back in the Baroque era when people were improvising together.
As a Everything Music Nerd I think I can hear the roots of the altered scale in the Neapolitan sixth - that enclosure Bb-G#-A you get in Am for example from
Bb/D E7 Am
You just crunch it into the V7. The sound is another VERY BEBOP THING. Segment springs to mind. (But also that Brahms 4 finale theme.)
Altered is very much out of the tonic minor to my ears. Darkened with a Phrygian note and a spot of blues.
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
You could obviously talk about the harmonic options in that part of the tune, based on what Sonny Stitt plays there, but it seems secondary to what is actually happening.
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
And are you talking about mystical frequency stuff here?
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
And are you talking about mystical frequency stuff here?
Old Italian solfeggio in so much as I understand it was an adaptation of Guido's original hexachordal system - apparently it makes sight singing from weird clefs super easy and so on. I don't really understand that bit.
But the hexachordal aspect of it means that the half steps are usually given by the syllables mi and fa. So you sing the major scale
DO RE MI FA SOL RE MI FA
If I descend using a b7 to 6, I sing the b7 as mi and 6 as fa. And so on. (This is what Bach meant by the motto FA MI, et MI FA est tota Musica: Fa Mi and Mi Fa are the whole music" Also his name BACH in German notes is Bb A C B is also FA MI MI FA. It's a whole thing. Also it's the cross.)
(It's also the melodic structure of the quiecenza - C C7 F/C G7/C C - which come to think of Bach uses a lot in his music.)
LOOK Bach gets stupid, OK. Let's not talk about Bach. We'll be here until the heat death of the universe. Let's talk about something simple - such as any other musician.
The bit that's more relevant is you learn to embellish simple patterns such as scales with other notes improvisationally. So a simple melodic figure like LA SOL FA MI can become complicated melodic sequences and so on, but still sung to the syllables, La Sol Fa Mi. In fact, many jazz standards melodies like Autumn leaves would fit this kind of logic - anything on a cycle 4.) There's also puns you can do on the hexachords. Nicholas Baragwanath has a book. I don't understand it. But it seems like it was a central part of baroque and classical compositional and improvisational technique.
Here's a demonstration and explanation.
The hat and bow tie - I'm not sure that's optional. These is very much a Special Interest.
Dariusz Terefenko's adaptation of the Rule of the Octave to Jazz seems to have a sniff of this approach.
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You know, I'm not fully convinced Bach was actually a person.
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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Originally Posted by Christian Miller
got a degree in this or something?
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Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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The Autumn of Solo Guitar 2024
Yesterday, 12:42 PM in Chord-Melody