the Jazz Rule of the Octave

[Christian Miller]

Interesting!

This is an idea I've been thinking about since I found out about ROTOs over a decade ago... But this is in Dariusz Terefenko's Jazz Theory book which I don't think is a new book exactly, but didn't know about it.

Which I must now get.... it is unfortunately priced very much in the academic textbook range...

Some students of mine might notice a similarity with the way I teach things like 'Confirmation' though...

[mr. beaumont]

Jazz needs more rules.

[Christian Miller]

Jazz needs more rules.

well rule may be a misnomer

It's more like a suggestion for pre-baked chords that go with a given scale bass or in this case melody line.

Actually it's somewhat similar to something I remember Reg talking about... We all have to have our own rules of the octave to harmonise lead lines and so on when comping - we don't call them that ....

You probably have some rules of the octave that you use when working on solo arrangements etc. the Barry Harris drop 2/mechanical voicing stuff is a form of ROTO.

[mr. beaumont]

I'm being a smartass mostly...

I just can't believe that video went on that long without a single audio example.

[pauln]

I'd never heard of the rule of the octave as a name for harmonizing scales, but it sounds just like my 1925 Lutheran Hymnal I keep in the piano bench.

I found this site where examples are playable - I like the way you may click on the measures to sound them in any order including backwards.

[Christian Miller]

I'd never heard of the rule of the octave as a name for harmonizing scales, but it sounds just like my 1925 Lutheran Hymnal I keep in the piano bench.

Yes, it would.

[Christian Miller]

I'm being a smartass mostly...

I just can't believe that video went on that long without a single audio example.

A but of actual music would certainly have enlivened the video. I’ll steal the video idea as soon as I’ve read the relevant material, and do it with some, y’know, playing.

[Tal_175]

I don't know if that's related but I remember reading a rule concerning chromatically ascending or descending bass lines.
The rule is any bass note can be used to harmonize any melody note as long as the bass is moving towards a target chord. Any inner voice combination works to fill the space between the bass and the melody as long as it sounds good.

I don't know why would anyone call such a lawless, godless notion a "rule".

[mr. beaumont]

A but of actual music would certainly have enlivened the video. I’ll steal the video idea as soon as I’ve read the relevant material, and do it with some, y’know, playing.

Now that I'll watch

[pauln]

I just can't believe that video went on that long without a single audio example.

I just can't believe that video went on that long without stating the rule. I had to look it up; and why is it called that? I don't think he said the word "octave" throughout the whole video after his fist sentence repeating the title rule, did he?

[starjasmine]

Any inner voice combination works to fill the space between the bass and the melody as long as it sounds good.

Seems similar to the piano-playing instruction "All you have to do is press the right keys at the right time."

[Christian Miller]

I don't know if that's related but I remember reading a rule concerning chromatically ascending or descending bass lines.

That would be a variant of the concept.

The rule is any bass note can be used to harmonize any melody note as long as the bass is moving towards a target chord. Any inner voice combination works to fill the space between the bass and the melody as long as it sounds good.

I think the example in the video was 'inverted' so the harmonisation is based on the melody rather than the bass and the bass moves around. Quite useful...

I don't know why would anyone call such a lawless, godless notion a "rule".

Francois Campion "règle des octaves". Presumably it made sense at the time.

But then we use the term 'rule of thumb' - so it's not that crazy?

[Christian Miller]

Terefenko writes

"During the Baroque Era [also the Classical era], the “Rule of the Octave” was a practical tool that enabled musicians to gain harmonic flexibility at the keyboard. The rule prescribed how to harmonize a scale in the bass using stylistic tonal progressions. In jazz, a similar rule can also be developed. Instead of placing the scale in the bass, the major scale is placed in the soprano voice. The jazz rule of the octave explains how to harmonize a descending major scale with idiomatic jazz progressions. By examining different harmonic outcomes, the relationship of melodies to chords and chords to melodies becomes clear. The jazz rule of the octave also helps us to realize the harmonic potential of different melodic segments and examines their behavior in the context of underlying chord progressions." Jazz Theory, p454

[CliffR]

Terefenko writes

"During the Baroque Era [also the Classical era], the “Rule of the Octave” was a practical tool that enabled musicians to gain harmonic flexibility at the keyboard. The rule prescribed how to harmonize a scale in the bass using stylistic tonal progressions. In jazz, a similar rule can also be developed. Instead of placing the scale in the bass, the major scale is placed in the soprano voice. The jazz rule of the octave explains how to harmonize a descending major scale with idiomatic jazz progressions. By examining different harmonic outcomes, the relationship of melodies to chords and chords to melodies becomes clear. The jazz rule of the octave also helps us to realize the harmonic potential of different melodic segments and examines their behavior in the context of underlying chord progressions." Jazz Theory, p454

Ah, that explains why I didn't spot the Confirmation connection. I'm still stuck on page 399

[djg]

Terefenko writes

"During the Baroque Era [also the Classical era], the “Rule of the Octave” was a practical tool that enabled musicians to gain harmonic flexibility at the keyboard. The rule prescribed how to harmonize a scale in the bass using stylistic tonal progressions. In jazz, a similar rule can also be developed. Instead of placing the scale in the bass, the major scale is placed in the soprano voice. The jazz rule of the octave explains how to harmonize a descending major scale with idiomatic jazz progressions. By examining different harmonic outcomes, the relationship of melodies to chords and chords to melodies becomes clear. The jazz rule of the octave also helps us to realize the harmonic potential of different melodic segments and examines their behavior in the context of underlying chord progressions." Jazz Theory, p454

he's a tad too flexible on the keyboard for my taste

[frabarmus]

Ooctaves banned from any chord/parallel motion of octaves not allowed.
Is that the ROTO (in Classical music)?

[garybaldy]

Can't find the exploding brain emoji

[Tal_175]

I apologize it looks like I made up the rule I stated above (although there is enough structure in that rule that it still works I think). The actual rule is called the rule of oblique motion. The rule is basically if the melody is a pedal note and bass note works.
It's from Paul Musso's fingerstyle chord melody book. I'll post the relevant pages as I think it's fair use:

[Christian Miller]

Yep that’ll work

[Christian Miller]

Ooctaves banned from any chord/parallel motion of octaves not allowed.
Is that the ROTO (in Classical music)?

no, confusingly that’s something else completely.

rule of the octave is a set of stock chords you use to harmonise a bassline. It’s often used in continuo playing for example (many basses don’t have figures esp in earlier baroque music) and is also a resource for improvisation and composition.

[pauln]

Here's my theory...

"The Rule of the Octave" is:

- not about the interval of an octave
- not about the notes within a particular octave
- not about any arbitrary instance of the multiple octaves
- not even about octaves per se
- not a single rule (prescribed direction)
- not even a rule (prescribed direction)

That is why this thing is confusing...

The word "rule" is being used in the sense of governing power like a king over his subjects within his realm or domain.
The king here is Tonal Music and his realm is the musical pitches and their tonal harmonic interaction, which derive more fundamentally from pitch class than specific instance of pitch. The king's subjects being ruled are the pitch classes. Since all the pitches' pitch classes are contained in "the octave" (any and every octave), the word "octave" is being used by King Tonal Music to describe his subjects (pitch classes) residing within his realm (all pitches in all octaves).

[BigDaddyLoveHandles]

What a great thread!!