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Originally Posted by PaulD
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12-29-2015 09:39 AM
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Irez87, Jay & lawson-stone, thanks a lot for the nice remarks!
Irez87, I’m definitely not deep, still just trying to learn & improve like everyone else. Not sure about the double-time advice...I think for me maybe it was a matter of being able to do it away from the guitar at first, just scatting along to the solos of my favorite players to get the feel more than the notes. Once I could feel it naturally, then it became easier to incorporate into my playing.
Jay, I’m playing my ES-175 straight into a UR-22 interface (Christmas present from my son ). I recorded it using Audacity, adding just a little reverb after the fact. The backing track is BIAB using a slow jazz ballad style and muting the piano so it’s just bass & drums.
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Originally Posted by PaulD
Thanks for posting this.
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I'm just searching my iTunes library for guitarists playing this tune
Chuck Wayne has a great solo over this
Howard Alden has a great solo
Jimmy Raney has a great solo
Joe Pass has a great solo
Jimmy Bruno
We could share transcriptions and figure out how the masters navigate this chestnut.
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Originally Posted by PaulD
wiz (Howie)
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Originally Posted by wizard3739
Paul
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Originally Posted by PaulD
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Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Yeeeeowzaaaaahh
He makes that tune sing and those lines are so geeeeoooddahhh
Not fair!
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Very cool, 55bar. I like the little break into a swing....it left me wanting more.
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Originally Posted by Irez87
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Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
The audience started to come into the theatre so had to keep it short #ranoutofideas
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Seriously good, 55bar!
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My favorite Jimmy Raney version. The other solos are great too....especially got into the Phil Woods solo.
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Originally Posted by srlank
wiz (Howie)
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Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Guitar sounds lovely too. Happy new year!
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Pkirk...man, I'd buy a record of you/bass duets in a heartbeat.
Fuzz...nice ideas and space...just work on that time.
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Originally Posted by fuzzthebee
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PKirk - excellent vibe and interesting note choices.
Mike - great to have you here. I liked the octaves for the Head. Lots of good things going on in there.
Jazzguy100 - some good harmonies in there!
Keep it up, chaps!Last edited by Rob MacKillop; 01-02-2016 at 04:17 AM.
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Kudos to everyone that posted. They all sound great to me.
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I will post an example of my studies into orchestral comping later this weekend. I am trying to uncover what Ed Bickert said when he meant "comping like an orchestra". I think I am getting a little closer to that understanding, but I am just at the tip of the iceberg. For modern reharm ideas for standards, I listen to Bill Holman, Oliver Nelson, Gunther Schuller, and George Russell. Any other suggestions? I could turn this into another thread, but it would be interesting to post modern big band arrangements of Stella here. I already posted Bill Holman's eerily beautiful arrangement a couple of posts back.
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Impressive. But how does this help you? What does it give you other than singing the song, or playing the melody while singing it on the guitar? No criticism, just curious.
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Destiny, do it against a drone, Bb.
Good question, Rob.
The exercise helps you by recontextualizing the song in Bb and hearing melody and harmony as a series of tension and release around the home key (Bb)
In effect, your ear teaches you how your lines should cadence in regards to how the notes orbit around the key.
For instance, with a Bb drone you have the following line for the 3rds of each chord:
Em7b5 A7b9 Cm7 F7 Fm7 Bb7 Ebmaj7 Ab7 Bb7
Instead of thinking purely chord to chord, think of everything relating to Bbmajor
Check this out (in 3rds)
La (G of Em7b5 --> 6th of Bb major)
May (C# of A7b9 --> b3rd of Bb major)
Fa (Eb of Cm7 --> 4th of Bb Major)
Ti (A of F7 --> 7th of Bb major)
Tay (Ab of Fm7 --> b7th of Bb major)
Me (D of Bb7 --> 3rd of Bb major)
La (G of Ebmaj7 --> 6th of Bb major)
Re (C of Ab7 --> 2nd of Bb major)
Me (3rd of Bbmaj)
To write out in a linear fashion, you have the following in Bbmajor in scale degrees
6 -- b3 -- 4 -- 7 -- b7 -- 3 -- 6 -- 2 -- 3
I could include how this looks on a musical staff to show, visually how the notes work.
The larger concept behind all this is to show how the harmonies create inner melodies within the key center in a similar fashion to how the melody operates with in a key center.
Why sing this exercise? Your ear will teach you how to navigate the tune more than your eye and your mind. You memorize the sound of the tune instead of relying purely on visual and mental maths (you can still use them in tandem, but use your ear as the foundation).
George Van Eps always spoke of harmonies being more like intertwined horizontal melodies. This is what he was talking about. I happened upon this after years of studying the Banacos method through Bruce Arnold.
My idea of comping like an orchestra will be based off the idea of multiple melodies creating tension and release within the home key. If you are interested, PM me and I can direct you to the courses I am still using as well as the thought process behind the ear guiding the hand (instead of the brain and the eye).
Miles was hip to this as well.
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Interesting, but I learn the sounds available within a given key by working them into my ears, hands, eyes and mind at the same time through practicing scales.
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Originally Posted by boatheelmusic
Just a different approach. Granted, getting this approach to work requires a lot of singing solfege. However, you will figure out how your inner ear works more so by singing than by theorizing every last drop of music. At the end of the day the audience will always respond "Yeah... So? Does it sound good?"
This method is about sound not mental math or the physicality of the instrument. Of course you need to know the fret board and the physical nature of the instrument, but you don't have to be fettered by its confines.
I could continue this on that ear training blog thing I started. I still have to see if Bruce Arnold could actually lend some of his expertise. Maybe we could get Barbra Banacos or Gary Dial to chime in? That would be crazy kool
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01-02-2016, 01:29 PM #125destinytot GuestOriginally Posted by Rob MacKillop
The benefits, as I see them, apply to all instruments (including the voice) because they put the musician in the driver's seat.
I call this kind of ear training 'independent listening' (I borrow the term from language teaching methodology). If you prepare tunes this way, you get to 'know' their harmony - intuitively, with musical connaissance de cause - as you know your mother tongue well enough to tell a story; you can make adjustments to suit your your audience and purpose, with no 'half-guessing'. (Like the man said, "If you can't hear it, you can't play it.")
This kind of ear training does wonders for intonation (obviously important for singers - wind and brass, too), and I'm just beginning to appreciate the value of improved intonation when bending notes. (I've just begun thinking of 'blue notes' as more than just flattened diatonic scale degrees.)
But what I call 'independent listening' is (part of) a foundation for improved group/ensemble performance, involving what I call 'interactive listening'. I'm starting to appreciate how using chromatic solfège to learn tunes can help with groove.Last edited by destinytot; 01-02-2016 at 01:58 PM. Reason: spelling
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