Hippest guitar players over the years

[Doctor Jeff]

Re' the recent thread: I started thinking about how my ideas of "hip" or "cool" guitarists, at least the ones I listened to and wished I could play like, has changed over the years. This is the list I came up with:

Mid 60's: Luther Perkins, George Harrison

Mid 70's: Steve Howe, Jimi Hendrix

Late 70's: Allen Holdsworth, Steve Morse, Jeff "Skunk" Baxter, Al Dimeola, John McLaughlin

Early 80's: Robert Fripp, Frank Zappa, Pat Metheny, Doc Watson

Mid-80's: Tom Verlaine, James "Blood" Ulmer, Joe Pass--plus a reappreciation for Eric Clapton

1990's: Stanley Jordan, Brian Setzer

2000's: John Scofield, Wes Montgomery, Kenny Burrell

2010's: Dave Rawlings, Blake Mills, Doug Pettibone, Nels Cline, Ben Monder, Grant Green

A couple of observations: obviously I knew of a lot of these cats before I started digging them, but that was when I started listening to them most heavily and they became more of an influence on me.

I still admire all of the guitarists who appear on the list, but I no longer want to (or think I could ever) play like Holdsworth or Dimeola or Stanley Jordan, among others. Blinding speed and unusual techniques are just not something I'm interested in at the moment.

There was a long dry spell from the late 80's to early 2000's when I didn't play or listen to much guitar. I probably listened to more classical and opera during that time, plus more pop-oriented jazz like Diane Krall.

The last 7-8 years though, with easy access to all kinds of music, I have been listening to as much stuff as I can in all genres, and appreciating guitarists in all genres. Except opera. No guitar in that.

And, I would have to say, the hippest jazz guitarists who are still influential to me at present (in no particular order) are Joe, Wes, Kenny and Grant.

[Cunamara]

Hmmm. Hippest guitar player... how does one make that determination? What are the criteria for "hip?" I had no problem proclaiming Monk the hippest jazz musician in the universe but it's harder picking the hippest jazz guitarist. Sooooo.....

Probably Wes.

Among modern, living players... Pete Bernstein, maybe.

[christianm77]

I kind of think that Grant Green is hipper than Wes.... Not sure why, but you can't explain hip....

Peter Bernstein is indeed the hippest living guitar player IMO.

[srlank]

There are too many worthy candidates to state who is the hippest for my own mind. But Lenny and Scofield would definitely be top contenders for me, in addition to those already stated. And that would indeed include Jimi Hendrix if it is inclusive of multiple genres.

[christianm77]

I don't think 'hip' for me is the same thing as 'someone I like to play like.'

For me 'hip' has a lot to do with the way a musician plays stuff. You can be a great player IMO and not be at all hip. It's hard to describe, but it has to do with rhythm, style, coolness. Not so much earnestness, chops, passion, complexity although that can be in there.

[Doctor Jeff]

I don't think 'hip' for me is the same thing as 'someone I like to play like.'

For me 'hip' has a lot to do with the way a musician plays stuff. You can be a great player IMO and not be at all hip. It's hard to describe, but it has to do with rhythm, style, coolness. Not so much earnestness, chops, passion, complexity although that can be in there.

Agreed, but in the 70's for instance I thought Al Dimeola was really hip. It took a few decades of wisdom for me to come back to Wes and Grant as being infinitely hipper.

[jasaco]

But what is hip?

[destinytot]

Judging by the remarkable audio at Ted Greene and Emily Remler - Jammin' , Emily gets my vote.

[Doctor Jeff]

Yeah, Emily was special. I will have to listen to more of her.

I think anyone who can pull off a white suit is pretty hip, and by that standard plus the hair and glasses Al Dimeola gets special mention.

[wolflen]

Weldon Young...guitarist on the tune "high heel sneakers" by tommy tucker..some very hip riffs..

[pingu]

Probably get shot down for this but ....

Pat Metheny is pretty damn Hip to me when he reharmonises a standard or pop tune like 'Don't know why'
or 'and I love her' also the Song X type playing is mighty Hip to me

Hip to me is like out-there but still in contact with the tune

Peter Bernstein too absolutely ............

But then again , Ed Bickert is totally Hip and is inside most of the time
but can paint the colours of the tune like no one else

So I give up , soz

[cmajor9]

I'd say there's a fundamental problem here... as Yogi Berra might say, "Hip, by definition, can't be defined."

Its a completely subjective measure, and you might change your own idea of who is "hippest" over time.

Regarding your original list:

Mid 60s: Was George Harrison hipper than Eric Clapton?

Mid 70s: Was Steve Howe hipper than Larry Carlton?

2000s: Were Wes and Kenny hipper than any guitarists actually recording then?

With due respect, seems like a bit of a slippery slope on a rainy day :>)

[Doctor Jeff]

I'd say there's a fundamental problem here... as Yogi Berra might say, "Hip, by definition, can't be defined."

Its a completely subjective measure, and you might change your own idea of who is "hippest" over time.

Regarding your original list:

Mid 60s: Was George Harrison hipper than Eric Clapton?

Well in the mid-60's I was 6-7 years old and didn't know who Eric Clapton was, but I sure as heck knew who George was. The guitar riffs from Folsum Prison Blues and ticket to Ride (among others) are why I begged my parents for a guitar for my birthday, and got rewarded with a Teico special.

Mid 70s: Was Steve Howe hipper than Larry Carlton?

In the middle of the 70's Yes was one of my favorite groups, so Steve Howe was the hippest to me at that time, but by '79-80 I had moved on to Steely Dan and other purveyors of sardonic understatement, so all the Dan guitarists were hipper. Special mention to Mark Knopfler for Sultans of Swing--definitely hip.

2000s: Were Wes and Kenny hipper than any guitarists actually recording then?

Wes and Kenny and Grant had always existed in the background for me--I had had a couple of Wes albums since the early 80's--but they hadn't really made that big an impact until I started playing more and listening more to their stuff over the last decade. Then I realized how influential they have been, and ultimately how hip they were and are.

So yes, hip is indefinable, but we kind of know it when we see it. I think it takes a little age and perspective to finally put it all together.

[christianm77]

George Harrison def. hipper than Clapton in my book. What's hipper than being the perfect session guitarist (effectively) always playing perfectly for the song in one of the greatest bands ever? Not Eric I reckon. Within the Beatles discography I find his playing on While My Guitar Gently Weeps rather ponderous and leaden compared with the airy and inventive pop solos George seemed to be able to churn out to order.

Cream were great, but the tracks I really couldn't be without of theirs would comfortably fit onto one LP (if not one side!).

Larry Carlton for similar reasons, he has such style in his playing. Steve Howe? Prog is many things, but I wouldn't call it hip.

Wes and Kenny (and Grant!) are hipper than anyone playing guitar at any time. IMHO. Although Bernstein is up there IMO.

Monder? Kurt? Lage? Heckselman etc? Great musicians, exciting players. Not hip to my sensibility. Not like Mark Guiliana is hip in any case.

[christianm77]

I'm thinking that my conception of 'hip' is not completely unlike the 18th century idea of 'gallant' in fact (although not based so much on aristocratic values.) In this sense, I regard Mozart and Haydn as hipper than Bach and Beethoven say.

[joe2758]

I'm thinking that my conception of 'hip' is not completely unlike the 18th century idea of 'gallant' in fact (although not based so much on aristocratic values.) In this sense, I regard Mozart and Haydn as hipper than Bach and Beethoven say.

hahaha omg this killed me!!

[OldGuitarPlayer]

The hippest guitar player? This man.

[nick1994]

if we're talking any genre then richie was the hippest rock guitar player of the 70s without doubt

[Robertkoa]

Re' the recent thread: I started thinking about how my ideas of "hip" or "cool" guitarists, at least the ones I listened to and wished I could play like, has changed over the years. This is the list I came up with:

Mid 60's: Luther Perkins, George Harrison

Mid 70's: Steve Howe, Jimi Hendrix

Late 70's: Allen Holdsworth, Steve Morse, Jeff "Skunk" Baxter, Al Dimeola, John McLaughlin

Early 80's: Robert Fripp, Frank Zappa, Pat Metheny, Doc Watson

Mid-80's: Tom Verlaine, James "Blood" Ulmer, Joe Pass--plus a reappreciation for Eric Clapton

1990's: Stanley Jordan, Brian Setzer

2000's: John Scofield, Wes Montgomery, Kenny Burrell

2010's: Dave Rawlings, Blake Mills, Doug Pettibone, Nels Cline, Ben Monder, Grant Green

A couple of observations: obviously I knew of a lot of these cats before I started digging them, but that was when I started listening to them most heavily and they became more of an influence on me.

I still admire all of the guitarists who appear on the list, but I no longer want to (or think I could ever) play like Holdsworth or Dimeola or Stanley Jordan, among others. Blinding speed and unusual techniques are just not something I'm interested in at the moment.

There was a long dry spell from the late 80's to early 2000's when I didn't play or listen to much guitar. I probably listened to more classical and opera during that time, plus more pop-oriented jazz like Diane Krall.

The last 7-8 years though, with easy access to all kinds of music, I have been listening to as much stuff as I can in all genres, and appreciating guitarists in all genres. Except opera. No guitar in that.

And, I would have to say, the hippest jazz guitarists who are still influential to me at present (in no particular order) are Joe, Wes, Kenny and Grant.

Interesting to see your ' influences ' change over the years.

And to think of mine over many years...although the "core" of what I do or am trying to do has not changed much especially the better parts ...

The best thing about this Thread is remembering what my "Core" is or was and 'growing' that rather than wandering too much or endless woodshedding for thousands more hours versus creating some Music.

[Robertkoa]

George Harrison def. hipper than Clapton in my book. What's hipper than being the perfect session guitarist (effectively) always playing perfectly for the song in one of the greatest bands ever? Not Eric I reckon. Within the Beatles discography I find his playing on While My Guitar Gently Weeps rather ponderous and leaden compared with the airy and inventive pop solos George seemed to be able to churn out to order.

Cream were great, but the tracks I really couldn't be without of theirs would comfortably fit onto one LP (if not one side!).

Larry Carlton for similar reasons, he has such style in his playing. Steve Howe? Prog is many things, but I wouldn't call it hip.

Wes and Kenny (and Grant!) are hipper than anyone playing guitar at any time. IMHO. Although Bernstein is up there IMO.

Monder? Kurt? Lage? Heckselman etc? Great musicians, exciting players. Not hip to my sensibility. Not like Mark Guiliana is hip in any case.

George Harrison is a great one.
I saw a Video where it looked like he was playing the totally Jazz Solo in 'Till There Was You' .
I always assumed George Martin brought some Jazz Guy for that..was it really George who came up with that..?
Sheer Genius - as the Beatles were of course.

Anyway...one thing to remember about Clapton is he was one of the first Huge Guitar Stars on Earth..

Where average every day people went to see him to hear him play Guitar !

You Jazz Guys ultimately want the 'Johnny B Goode ' effect- 'people will come from miles around to hear you play your Music when the sun goes down.'

At least some do....
nothing wrong with that either...

Clapton and Hendrix embodied that to the World more than anyone before had in terms of reaching the Public.
People went to see Clapton and Hendrix because they were perceived as the 'Ultimate ' bad ass Guitar Players.

I remember as a kid being totally knocked out by Clapton's Vibrato ..
I used to read Time Magazine as a Teen for the Science stuff..and Time Magazine wrote about Clapton as a Virtuoso- they never wrote even wrote about Rock then(!)

And they said ' his vibrato quivering like an arrow that struck it's mark' or something very close to that..and I was thinking holy ____ even Time Magazine a bunch of old Fogeys noticed his Vibrato !
That really amazed me that they noticed this .

The 'Clapton is God ' signs in England ...were cool..are any still there?

I never thought of them as hip..Geniuses at what they did maybe..hip was a Jazz term ..right?

Hip implies a bit obscure...
So Benson in 1966 with in many ways more skill and chops would have been more 'Hip' as not a household name...

Jazz Guys often want some Guy who is unbelievable but kind of unknown by the Public. obscure, eccentric playing stuff over most people's heads ..lol..(.some Rock fans and Music Critics were like that)- to be the 'Hippest '.

Of course what was once new or exceptional..just becomes part of the Vocabulary...

Like Eric Johnson or Holdsworth. DiMeola..it's much more common vocabulary now..
Where was unprecedented originally.
The Hyper fast Fusion Players forced us to woodshed more...but I never found the Music itself compelling...

[lammie200]

...I never thought of them as hip..Geniuses at what they did maybe..hip was a Jazz term ..right?...

Hip = Jazz term
Groovy = Rock term

IMHO

Also, Clapton was captivating and the spot light always seemed to find him. However, a guy like Pete Ham was probably just as good a guitarist on the pop level as Clapton and a heckuva songwriter.

[monk]

George Harrison is a great one.
I saw a Video where it looked like he was playing the totally Jazz Solo in 'Till There Was You' .
I always assumed George Martin brought some Jazz Guy for that..was it really George who came up with that..?
Sheer Genius - as the Beatles were of course.

The story has it that Paul McCartney brought the song into The Beatles' repertoire and taught the solo to Harrison for live performances. Given his recorded worked at the time, Harrison was still playing fairly rudimentary rock and roll guitar in 1962-1963 and didn't hit his creative stride until the band's middle years.

[Robertkoa]

Hip = Jazz term
Groovy = Rock term

IMHO

Also, Clapton was captivating and the spot light always seemed to find him. However, a guy like Pete Ham was probably just as good a guitarist on the pop level as Clapton and a heckuva songwriter.

Now there is a PERFECT example of the 'Hip' thing- lol.
I didn't say Clapton or Hendrix were the best- I said they were huge Stars- and Stars that people came to see primarily for their Guitar Playing..which was a 'first'- drawing huge Crowds to see a Guitarist play Guitar.


And you brought up some 'hip' obscure or relatively obscure Guy who was as good etc.= Hip.

Pat Metheny is too well known..and rich to be' Hip'.

Metheny Probably the closest thing to a 'Jazz' Hendrix other than Benson.

And of course many come to see/hear Benson sing..
so Metheny so far is the closest to the' Johnny B Goode' Guitar Superstar of Jazz ..

Both too famous to be 'Hip' -lol.

OK - IF your 'hippest' Guitar Player suddenly became really famous outside of Jazz
Circles..and was featured on Network TV etc..like a Pop Star but playing Jazz Guitar- would he still be 'hip'?

So my vote is for Benson and Metheny...they both played Jazz Guitar their own way and got Rich and Famous doing it.

Metheny deserves extra credit for improving his chops a lot over the years - I admit I am not extremely familiar with much his Work but I remember in the early years he seemed to slur his way along when he played- always great Musical mind but he sounds like he has improved his Technique to be much more fluid and sure footed etc over the Years.
I recently saw a Seminar Video of him where he plays 7 or 8 minutes of really creative lines and intervallic stuff in nearly perfect time- not speed but really interesting cool stuff way more unique than speed..

But my real vote for hippest Jazz Guitarist over many years is Benson..
My real vote for hippest Modern Jazz Player is Kriesberg due to his amazing technical skills to play legato or Rhythmically..effortless speed which he does not even use that much because he is usually doing more creative things like Melodies and Rhythms with Melodies.
Great Harmonic ability ...great solo Guitar...and Tone .great live performances
Also was a cool really good Fusion Rocker in his teens..and with about 3 or 4 other' younger' Players seems to be at the forefront of Modern Jazz..expanding it...

But again I may be ignoring the 'Hip' esoteric eccentric thing...'cause Benson and Kriesberg are Great ...IMO more than 'Hip'.

Maybe I am not getting the 'Hip ' part..lol.

[christianm77]

Now there is a PERFECT example of the 'Hip' thing- lol.
I didn't say Clapton or Hendrix were the best- I said they were huge Stars- and Stars that people came to see primarily for their Guitar Playing..which was a 'first'- drawing huge Crowds to see a Guitarist play Guitar.


And you brought up some 'hip' obscure or relatively obscure Guy who was as good etc.= Hip.

Pat Metheny is too well known..and rich to be' Hip'.

Metheny Probably the closest thing to a 'Jazz' Hendrix other than Benson.

And of course many come to see/hear Benson sing..
so Metheny so far is the closest to the' Johnny B Goode' Guitar Superstar of Jazz ..

Both too famous to be 'Hip' -lol.

OK - IF your 'hippest' Guitar Player suddenly became really famous outside of Jazz
Circles..and was featured on Network TV etc..like a Pop Star but playing Jazz Guitar- would he still be 'hip'?


So my vote is for Benson and Metheny...they both played Jazz Guitar their own way and got Rich and Famous doing it.

Metheny deserves extra credit for improving his chops a lot over the years - I admit I am not extremely familiar with much his Work but I remember in the early years he seemed to slur his way along when he played- always great Musical mind but he sounds like he has improved his Technique to be much more fluid and sure footed etc over the Years.
I recently saw a Seminar Video of him where he plays 7 or 8 minutes of really creative lines and intervallic stuff in nearly perfect time- not speed but really interesting cool stuff way more unique than speed...

Jimi Hendrix was the nearest thing to a rock Charlie Christian. :-)

Nah I'm not sure if Pat Metheny is 'hip' to me exactly. I mean it's not a jazz snob thing ... I think tons of famous musicians are hip. George Benson is a good example.

It's a slyness, a playfulness, a streetwiseness, a snap to the rhythm perhaps.

Metheny is great, but to me 'hip' is not the same thing as good. 'Hip' is like a feeling. The feeling in Metheny's music is different. To me, the reason why modern jazz guitar has gone the way it has is basically down to Metheny, and the way it has moved away from that Grant Green style hipness is down to that, IMO.

But Peter Bernstein and Adam Rogers to me are pretty hip. Famous guys... John Scofield? Dunno, not as famous as Pat obv.