Jazz Guitarist's Who Use Light Strings?

**Section Player** · 08-04-2012, 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by Double 07

I'm kinda new here, is this just a straight ahead only forum or?

.

Double Oh.......this is a jazz forum, but I don't understand your question. Could you elaborate on that? What do you mean by "straight ahead"?

**paulkogut** · 08-04-2012, 01:51 AM

I remember Jim Hall using .011 and a plain G back in the 80's-90's. He said the lighter tension let him use different kinds of vibrato that he learned from studying classical guitar.

**Spirit59** · 08-04-2012, 03:47 AM

Originally Posted by Sandor

One thing that drives me crazy is players who use thin strings and pick very lightly, and then turn up the amp to compensate. This is a huge disservice to the audience as it increases pick noise and produces a sound that seems very timid and uncomfortable to listen too.

Guess you don't dig Jim Hall then because that's exactly what he does. In fact, a lot of jazz guys (and others) use this approach even using heavier strings. Using this approach, you get an evenness in note-to-note volume without having to resort to using a compressor. You also don't get that annoying "plinky" transient on the note (unless you want it). That's how Adam Rogers gets his straight-ahead tone, but he's much more percussive when playing with Chris Potter's Underground (fusion).

**docbop** · 08-04-2012, 11:37 AM

Have to remember so go lighter with age as the hands start to wear out. First time I heard of hands wearing out was with legendary bassist Ray Brown. Ted Greene mentions later going to lighter strings his hands couldn't take the heavy strings anymore. I've heard it mention by other musicians over time having to change the reeds, mouthpieces and etc as they grow older to adjust for muscles weakening or can't stretch like they used to.

**Space Pickle** · 08-04-2012, 09:43 PM

Originally Posted by Section Player

Double Oh.......this is a jazz forum, but I don't understand your question. Could you elaborate on that? What do you mean by "straight ahead"?

007 made that post nearly two years ago. I don't think he's coming back.

I'm so sorry.

**Spirit59** · 08-05-2012, 01:11 AM

Originally Posted by Section Player

Double Oh.......this is a jazz forum, but I don't understand your question. Could you elaborate on that? What do you mean by "straight ahead"?

Surely you've heard the term "straight ahead jazz"?

Straight-ahead jazz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

**ecj** · 08-06-2012, 01:11 PM

People I've heard of that use 9s:

Abercrombie
Hall

and the educator Jody Fisher. He has a bunch of sound clips online. I think light strings can be really pretty, but they are very different.

I don't understand how Jim Hall gets such a huge tone with such skinny strings. He's the exception in my book.

I use 14s.

**Section Player** · 08-06-2012, 09:13 PM

Originally Posted by Spirit59

Surely you've heard the term "straight ahead jazz"?

Straight-ahead jazz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Many times. But some people have different understandings of it.

**Section Player** · 08-06-2012, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by ecj

People I've heard of that use 9s:

Abercrombie
Hall

and the educator Jody Fisher. He has a bunch of sound clips online. I think light strings can be really pretty, but they are very different.

I don't understand how Jim Hall gets such a huge tone with such skinny strings. He's the exception in my book.

I use 14s.

I've seen Hall live a couple of times in club settings and he's better than his reputation. You can get a great jazz tone with lighter strings, but you have to tweak your pickups, get the amp settings right, and not use too heavy an attack on the strings. I guess you get used to whatever you're using. 14s would feel like lamp cord to me! But I'm no way critical of anyone who likes something a little heavier.

**=DK=** · 08-06-2012, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo

I read an interview with someone who'd played on the same bill as B.B.King a few times, and B.B. had told him to use strings that allow you to articulate with the level of feeling you needed without having to fight with the strings. Your best tone would come from that. I very much agree. Even though heavier strings have better tone potential, my tone is better on a set that allows me to comfortably express myself. That's why they say tone is in the fingers.

Gumbo, usually your posts are silly, but this one is concise and very true.

**Klatu** · 08-15-2012, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by shoome

John Stowell uses .10s - 0.38s on his höfner.

Wow. I'm surprised to hear that his set is so light, especially in the lower strings.

**tego** · 12-24-2012, 10:55 AM

I'm one of those getting older - Been playing with a 10 on high e and just put on a set flatwounds with a 13 -- Have to go back to the 10 (or get a hand transplant).

**JensL** · 12-24-2012, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by tego

I'm one of those getting older - Been playing with a 10 on high e and just put on a set flatwounds with a 13 -- Have to go back to the 10 (or get a hand transplant).

Hope you don't mind me asking, but why is it that much harder? Do you bend the strings?
Besides that I would not expect too much of a difference unless the neck is not set up for heavier strings.

Jens

**fumblefingers** · 12-25-2012, 12:19 AM

my premature guess? arthritis (good old Arthur Itus).

anything stessful feels like shit.

**Moonray** · 12-25-2012, 01:26 AM

I have another take on the value of light strings, along the lines of an anecdote told by Cosmic Gumbo way upstream in this thread...

Basically... don't make it harder to express yourself than needs be.

My take is that aside from any physical ailment, it seems to me from 50+
years of playing that there is a speed of thought/sound which can be sped
up by not having to have the almost infintesimal gap between the impulse
and the physical response.
Because we're talking string gauge here, I'm linking this to the left hand
only and its quickness to hit the target intended at the intended time.

I have one instrument strung with 10-46 [Tele style] and one Gibson 24/34
scale with either 13-52 or 15-52.
My experience has been that there can be a micro pause when playing
the heavier set up [with a sweet low action] compared to playing the 10-46 which feels more instantaneous.
I put this down to a kind of synapse-firing scenario.

Particularly noticable for me when playing chordal sequences.

This is purely anecdotal, non-scientific; but something I've observed over
years playing and teaching.

I note that many of the modern chord masters use light strings....Tim Miller,
Mick Goodrick etc
Does anyone else out there think that there may be a thought/impulse
gap when wrangling the heavier gauges?

**trap** · 01-02-2013, 12:49 PM

I wouldn't just take the question of light strings in a vacuum. It's related to scale length, body size and type, and of course action height, touch, pick thickness. When I was younger and played arch tops I used a high stiff action because that's what I was told was the standard for jazz arch tops. Later I got smart and fit my action to my style and touch so I ended up with low and light. Much better for me.
Sometimes it's just a macho thing too .

**pingu** · 01-02-2013, 03:51 PM

Also I think the lighter the strings ....... the more delicate control the player has to have
and you can't play really hard with light strings and maintain the jazz sound
they start to sound more country
(jim Hall , Ed Bickert etc have this kinda touch/sound)
with big strings and a highish action you can really lay into the guitar
and keep a clean sound (like Benson)

So its a matter of taste ... horses for courses

I don't have any delicate touchleft or right hand ......
I can't play a light string guitar in tune !
so its lucky I like the fat sound (TI benson 14's at the mo)

It was a real revelation for me when I first put on fat flats
I was suddenly in-tune .... heaven !

**trap** · 01-02-2013, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by pingu

Also I think the lighter the strings ....... the more delicate control the player has to have
and you can't play really hard with light strings and maintain the jazz sound
they start to sound more country
(jim Hall , Ed Bickert etc have this kinda touch/sound)
with big strings and a highish action you can really lay into the guitar
and keep a clean sound (like Benson)

So its a matter of taste ... horses for courses

I don't have any delicate touchleft or right hand ......
I can't play a light string guitar in tune !
so its lucky I like the fat sound (TI benson 14's at the mo)

It was a real revelation for me when I first put on fat flats
I was suddenly in-tune .... heaven !

I always thought Benson played with a lower action. Now Pat Martino, I was at the Starbright session and saw his old Koontz and that action was absurdly high.

**jmac** · 01-02-2013, 06:00 PM

I play jazz and jump jive/swing rock and roll. I used to switch strings, from flat wound 11's to round round 9's but now I just play jazz using the round wound 9's.

I play better on the lighter strings.

**jazzman1021** · 01-02-2013, 11:20 PM

Hi everyone. I personally use .011-.014-.020w-.030-.040-.050 gauges on my Straocaster.

JM

**cubistguitar** · 01-07-2013, 11:19 AM

I hear Billy Gibbons said he was telling BB KIng years ago how he used the biggest strings he could stand to get the biggest loudest tones he could. BB laughed and said, I just turn the amp up. Billy said he felt like a fool and started changing his mind on string gauges ever since, now that hes getting up there in age himself, he uses.007 gauge for live playing now.

I'm comfortable with the sound and feel of 10s on a strat.

**fritz jones** · 11-23-2013, 02:32 AM

Originally Posted by saponsky

Ed Bickert used 09s nickel roundwound on his tele.

I have heard people say this and I think its not true.
I heard him say at a clinic in 1997 or so that he used .13 for some time and got stiffness then settled on .12.
that's what I think I heard anyway. I was actually the kid that asked "what strings do you use".

**larry graves** · 11-23-2013, 05:11 AM

Ed Bickert used 10-52 hybreds.... I use 9-46 hybreds, after a lifetime of using 13 plus flats...Aging hands told me either that or pack in playing the guitar. Hey,you get used to them,.......L...