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  1. #1

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    This month we expand on what we learned in the previous chapter about how to approach dominant chords. In this chapter, Garrison provides us with a treasure trove of examples in the styles of Wes, Benson, Martino, Hall, and others.

    Finally, we get another standard to practice over: This time it is Wes Montgomery's classic,West Coast Blues (cleverly disguised as East Ghost Blues).

    Let's do this.
    Fewell's Melodic Approach - Ch. 5 (Stylistic Interpretation)-spck-thumb-nicholas-c-png

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    I'm in! Thanks for keeping this going Jay.

  4. #3

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    How about that George Benson lick, eh? After some time I gave up trying to play it like the tab shows, and just slid into the double stop instead of hammering on.

  5. #4

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    I was looking at the Benson lick today as well. A month of drilling Chapter 4 made all the difference. I finally had a real aha! moment.

    GF has given me a way of thinking about and internalizing something I’ve heard but not understood for years. I worked through this book a few years ago, but without the discipline that sticking to a study group format has imposed. I liked it, but it didn’t move the dial much. This time through I’m definitely moving the dial!


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  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    How about that George Benson lick, eh? After some time I gave up trying to play it like the tab shows, and just slid into the double stop instead of hammering on.
    Tough one getting your fingers sorted....

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Tough one getting your fingers sorted....
    Exactly! Which is why after like 45mins of trying, I gave up and tried something else. GF's lick sounds *so* good tho, it's not the same the way I'm playing it.

  8. #7

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    Aside from the gymnastics, I have two observations I would like to share about that lick and to see if anyone agrees:

    1) I feel like the chord symbols don't reflect what GB is thinking in bar 3. It seems pretty obvious to me that he is thinking Bb7 for the first two measures and F6 for the next. The chords symbols seem to reflect what you might see in a Real Book, but don't seem to match the lines.

    2) A lot of these "minor" licks seem to start on the b7 of the dominant cord, not the 5. They really feel very "major" to my ears. I suspect GF is trying to keep things simple and not overwhelm with options, but it really is a different lick if you emphasize the "minor" of the 5th, the "diminished" of the 3rd, or the "major" of the 7th. I am sure there is even more to come, but I am noticing the different moods each triad/arp brings to the dominant chord. Anyone else hearing a big difference between licks using these different triads?

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    1) I feel like the chord symbols don't reflect what GB is thinking in bar 3. It seems pretty obvious to me that he is thinking Bb7 for the first two measures and F6 for the next. The chords symbols seem to reflect what you might see in a Real Book, but don't seem to match the lines.
    If we are talking about the George Benson lick, the chord symbols are simply that: the chords he's playing in the background.

    The first two bars are Gminor licks. That second bar is one he introduced almost right away (Ch 2?). I really don't know what bar 3 is, other than it's simply what I call a "Charlie Christian" lick. It's certainly a standard little blues lick, but I'm uncertain how it relates to his teachings thus far.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    If we are talking about the George Benson lick, the chord symbols are simply that: the chords he's playing in the background.
    Yes, that's what I'm referring to. For example, he never actually plays that D7. We get what might be called a Ab13 followed by a G-9 (or Bb^7) anticipating the G-/C7 by just a half beat*. D7 is a common substitution for a vi chord, by why write it into this example? It is not what he plays and doesn't advance the teaching any. Or am I missing a lesson here? Usually, if you want to emphasize that substitution you would play an F# somewhere in the lick. But he doesn't. Nor does he play a lick based on an A- triad. So is that a lazy editor or is there a lesson there I am missing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    I really don't know what bar 3 is, other than it's simply what I call a "Charlie Christian" lick. It's certainly a standard little blues lick, but I'm uncertain how it relates to his teachings thus far.
    If we were to change the D to an Eb it would be one of those dim chords from the 3rd. Again, I don't know if GF means to teach us something by using the D. I agree that, at least this far, that is a move that hasn't been explained.

    None of this is me complaining. It actually makes me want to go out and get some of those "lick libraries" from TrueFire and others. GF has given me new eyes to see these licks over dominants differently and I am chomping at the bit to see more examples. I'm just trying to make sure I'm not glossing over some nugget.




    *To be fair, I don't think GF is thinking A13 to G- when he is comping. Throughout the example, he seems to be basically playing the 3/7 of the underlying dominant with one top note for color. Either the 13th or the #9. The brief move up a minor third from F7 to Ab7 before the G-/C7 is a common enough device that doesn't really change the thinking from F7.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    Yes, that's what I'm referring to. For example, he never actually plays that D7. We get what might be called a Ab13 followed by a G-9 (or Bb^7) anticipating the G-/C7 by just a half beat*. D7 is a common substitution for a vi chord, by why write it into this example? It is not what he plays and doesn't advance the teaching any. Or am I missing a lesson here? Usually, if you want to emphasize that substitution you would play an F# somewhere in the lick. But he doesn't. Nor does he play a lick based on an A- triad. So is that a lazy editor or is there a lesson there I am missing?
    I think you are over analyzing it. It's simply the turnaround/last 4 bars of a blues. He might be playing some sort of subs or altereds for the chords he's actually playing, but the chart is just keeping it simple.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    How about that George Benson lick, eh? After some time I gave up trying to play it like the tab shows, and just slid into the double stop instead of hammering on.
    Yeah, I really dig this one, it's one of my favourites of the chapter. That little double-stop is definitely tricky, but pretty cool once you get it under your fingers. Do you mean that you slide the whole double-stop?

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    Aside from the gymnastics, I have two observations I would like to share about that lick and to see if anyone agrees:

    1) I feel like the chord symbols don't reflect what GB is thinking in bar 3. It seems pretty obvious to me that he is thinking Bb7 for the first two measures and F6 for the next. The chords symbols seem to reflect what you might see in a Real Book, but don't seem to match the lines.
    No, as Bahnzo mentioned, the chords symbols are just laying down what the harmony is doing. He's showing us that you can simplify the whole thing by just playing Gm+ext over the first two bars and Cm/F7 over the whole 2-bar turnaround.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    *To be fair, I don't think GF is thinking A13 to G- when he is comping. Throughout the example, he seems to be basically playing the 3/7 of the underlying dominant with one top note for color. Either the 13th or the #9. The brief move up a minor third from F7 to Ab7 before the G-/C7 is a common enough device that doesn't really change the thinking from F7.
    Yep, you nailed it -- that's exactly what he's doing, and he teaches us how to do it ourselves in Ch. 7! (And that Ab13 you're seeing is a D7#9.)

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jehu
    Yeah, I really dig this one, it's one of my favourites of the chapter. That little double-stop is definitely tricky, but pretty cool once you get it under your fingers. Do you mean that you slide the whole double-stop?
    Yeah, I just slide into it. It's not the same, but I just can't get the grip fast enough to get that hammer on and then the slide.

    I also think the TAB is wrong there. It shows holding the double stop for a beat, but I hear it as holding the slide for a beat instead. Am I crazy?

  16. #15

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    Yeah, I find the notated rhythms to be approximations at best. I think it really helps to play along with Fewell and try to get the timings and articulations as close to his as possible. He also has a lot of subtle slides and things that don't make it into the notation.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jehu
    Yeah, I find the notated rhythms to be approximations at best. I think it really helps to play along with Fewell and try to get the timings and articulations as close to his as possible. He also has a lot of subtle slides and things that don't make it into the notation.
    If you could notate jazz correctly with all the minute details it would be impossible to read...

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Tough one getting your fingers sorted....
    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    Exactly! Which is why after like 45mins of trying, I gave up and tried something else. GF's lick sounds *so* good tho, it's not the same the way I'm playing it.
    I changed the fingering for the second part of the phrase: I use my pinky for the Bb on the b string and my ringfinger for the D on the 1st string and it works well that way- try it.
    Last edited by TOMMO; 05-06-2020 at 02:47 PM.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo

    I also think the TAB is wrong there. It shows holding the double stop for a beat, but I hear it as holding the slide for a beat instead. Am I crazy?
    Just listened to it. What I seem to hear is a combined hammer-on / pull-off (g to g# and g# back to g) before sliding down from g to f.

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Just listened to it. What I seem to hear is a combined hammer-on / pull-off (g to g# and g# back to g) before sliding down from g to f.
    Ok, that's what I was hearing as well. I still can't play it that way, tho

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jehu
    Cm/F7 over the whole 2-bar turnaround.
    I'm actually seeming that last part as a Gm now. It's the Bb maj triad of the Gm. Ex 2.9 shows it. It's "hidden" because he's using the approach notes to outline it.

    I still think of it as a "Charlie Christian" lick.

  22. #21

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    Hey! I don't have a webcam, but I figured I could use my phone + reaper. After some experimentation, I now know why they use those "clapper boards" when they shoot video.

    The "George Benson" lick. With some bonus improv. I've never recorded myself on video, I'm equal parts amused and horrified at the faces I make.


  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    I'm actually seeming that last part as a Gm now. It's the Bb maj triad of the Gm. Ex 2.9 shows it. It's "hidden" because he's using the approach notes to outline it.

    I still think of it as a "Charlie Christian" lick.
    To me it's an F major pentatonic lick starting with an enclosure of the major third - yes: something that CC often employed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    Hey! I don't have a webcam, but I figured I could use my phone + reaper. After some experimentation, I now know why they use those "clapper boards" when they shoot video.

    The "George Benson" lick. With some bonus improv. I've never recorded myself on video, I'm equal parts amused and horrified at the faces I make.

    Very good! Thanks!

  24. #23

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    So how are you guys getting on with this stuff?

    I'm not sure whether I'll have a chance to record anything before the month is out, but I'm definitely still spending time each day working on this. There is a lot of material here, and I see this chapter as one to revisit as we continue through the book -- a well to come back to.

    It's interesting that after giving us so much material in 4/4, he has us apply it to a tune in 3/4. I feel like the lesson here is that we should be messing around with and adapting these lines to different situations, rather than just seeing them as examples to (possibly) memorize.

  25. #24

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    Very excited to stumble upon this group, having picked up this GF book again recently. I'm currently working through Ch. 3, which is as far as I ever got before, and looking forward to finally following through this time!

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by CaseyW
    Very excited to stumble upon this group, having picked up this GF book again recently. I'm currently working through Ch. 3, which is as far as I ever got before, and looking forward to finally following through this time!
    Welcome to the group!

    As for me: Lately I have been a little bit unmotivated re: playing the guitar but I still tried to get a grasp on the benson lick every now and then. I'll be back in the game though....

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Welcome to the group!

    As for me: Lately I have been a little bit unmotivated re: playing the guitar but I still tried to get a grasp on the benson lick every now and then. I'll be back in the game though....
    I feel a little the same. I've been doing some chord melody work. But I love the Grant Green lick...it's very....Grant Green-y.

  28. #27

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    Ch 5 is less rewarding than the others for me, but I’m still trying to drill the material. In the other chapters we got new method. This one is a series of licks.

    Good licks, but it is hard not to just play them through a couple of times, go “huh, that’s cool” and move on. Not sure what the end of the month video should be.


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  29. #28

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    Interesting that we're probably all drawn to different licks in this chapter. There are some that I'll keep, some that I won't, and many times it will just be an interesting fragment that I'll try to work into my playing (like that altered E7 --> Eb7 move in the first GG lick).

    Welcome aboard, CaseyW!

  30. #29

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    The Johnny Smith lick is very cool. That kind of line in the first bar is something I've seemingly transcribed a number of times from horn players. It's also interesting to see how you can simply use the Gminor lines over an entire I-vi-ii-V line like that.

    I've been really slow with this chapter, simply because it's summer now and it's just not a good time for me to sit inside and learn guitar. Lots of other things I'd rather be doing, ya know?

    I saw there's a couple more players and then some sort of song at the end, so kinda looking forward to that and moving on.

  31. #30

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    Yeah, I've been a bit slow with this chapter for other reasons (kind of milking the end of summer down here, plus absolutely swamped with work), but I'm looking forward to moving on as well. A full chapter of lines isn't the most motivating thing in the world, but I'll definitely keep working on some of this material over the coming months.

    Some sort of song at the end indeed...

  32. #31

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    By the way, after going through this book the first time, I've always meant to revisit some of Wes's solos to see how well the lines fit the GF approach. A lot of his lines definitely have that sound (listen to the above, and e.g., D Natural Blues), and Fewell was clearly very influenced by Wes.

    Ah well, maybe someday. (When my kids grow up...)

  33. #32

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    Ahh, I didn't really look. So it's a Wes tune eh?

    I've been a big fan of Wes for many more years than I care to admit now. Probably 30+ by now I guess. A friend played me Smokin' at the Half Note, and I was hooked. There's plenty other great guitarists, but they don't approach Wes in my book. And yeah, I hear a ton of Wes in the way GF approaches a lot of this.

  34. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jehu
    Yeah, I've been a bit slow with this chapter for other reasons (kind of milking the end of summer down here, plus absolutely swamped with work), but I'm looking forward to moving on as well. A full chapter of lines isn't the most motivating thing in the world, but I'll definitely keep working on some of this material over the coming months.
    I've also been incredibly busy but continue to work on Chapter 5 as time allows. I actually find learning the jazz lines in this chapter very beneficial. I am pretty light on jazz vocabulary, so learning these lines is helping me connect sounds to fretboard. I will continue to press on. Regards, Joe

  35. #34

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    Ok, My East Ghost Blues. I thought initially this would be simple. Just knock out a blues, right? Not quite.

    I tried to use some of the licks we learned in the chapter when I could. Struggled a little with the Dm to Dbm. Etc.


  36. #35

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    Sounds cool! Looks I overlooked that EGB is already in chapter five - I owe you one...

  37. #36

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    I have to admit I have not given this chapter its due. Only now, at the end of the month, have I begun to give it the work it deserves. One key for me is not to play the licks in isolation, but attempt to string two or three together. For eg, taking the Benson lick and appending last lick from Wes. That is stretching my brain and fingers in a very positive way. I should have been working this with more intention all month, and now I feel I'm not really ready for Chapter 6.

    Also, I had one of those moments where something obvious becomes obvious. I was fighting the fact that Fewell keeps stressing these "minor" lines. But my ear was not hearing them as minor at all. In fact, Fewell was patently "wrong" in my mind. Most of these lines seemed built on the b7 as major 7 lines. Then I realized that the minor 5 and the major b7 are essentially the same thing. Just like Barry Harris says it's impossible to play the minor 2 and then the dominant 5 as if they are different things. It took playing the example in 5.14 (where does the Gb^ end and the Eb- begin?) to have a small breakthrough and stop fighting myself.

  38. #37

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    Here is my final video. Only three weeks late ;-). Just three quick choruses over EGB. I don't know that I used any of the licks from the chapter verbatim, but I know my playing evolved because I practiced those licks.

    Anyhow, time to move on to Chapter 6 and try to catch up!


  39. #38

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    Very bluesy!

  40. #39

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    Here's my take on "East Ghost Blues". I actually played the tune including the head and a version of the outro. Three choruses of improv, warts and all...




  41. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    Here is my final video. Only three weeks late ;-). Just three quick choruses over EGB. I don't know that I used any of the licks from the chapter verbatim, but I know my playing evolved because I practiced those licks.
    Great job rlrhett! I too feel that my playing is evolving as I continue to work (and rework) on this material. Thanks.

  42. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Here's my take on "East Ghost Blues". I actually played the tune including the head and a version of the outro. Three choruses of improv, warts and all...
    Wow! That's the way to bring everything together Tommo. Inspiration for me to keep work at it. Cheers.

  43. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by losaltosjoe
    Wow! That's the way to bring everything together Tommo. Inspiration for me to keep work at it. Cheers.
    Thanks!

  44. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Here's my take on "East Ghost Blues". I actually played the tune including the head and a version of the outro. Three choruses of improv, warts and all...
    Very nice Tommo!

  45. #44

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    Hello there!!

    I recorded this video and I used in some parts what we're studying in these books.
    It's not only focused on the book, but I think that it can give and idea of it.

    I've Found a New Baby - Cassias Guitars + Bugera V5 + Jr. Barnyard

    I forgot to link the video here

    Last edited by clebergf; 07-07-2020 at 01:08 PM.

  46. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnzo
    If we are talking about the George Benson lick, the chord symbols are simply that: the chords he's playing in the background.

    The first two bars are Gminor licks. That second bar is one he introduced almost right away (Ch 2?). I really don't know what bar 3 is, other than it's simply what I call a "Charlie Christian" lick. It's certainly a standard little blues lick, but I'm uncertain how it relates to his teachings thus far.
    I'm thinking bar three is F7 and/or D7. If you expand the blues scale to include both the minor 3rd and the major 3rd (which is definitely what a lot of players do), almost every one of the notes is in the F7 blues and D7 blues scales. You can hear it either way.

    I don't think a lot of what is in this chapter relates to Fewell's teachings so far. I think the idea is look/listen at these lines and see that what we have been learning is included as part of the line. As such, I think we are to check it out and move on. Understanding and getting all of this chapter in our vocabulary is not my goal as far as this chapter goes. At least that is how I'm interpreting it...

    He doesn't explain this really well but if you read the first sentence of the chapter....

    Now that you have practiced playing triads and melodic extensions over minor, major, and dominant chords, the next step is to see (and hear!) how some of the masters of jazz guitar have used this approach in their playing.

  47. #46

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    Not flowing the way I would like it over the chord changes. Especially the chromatic ii Vs, sound a bit forced. I'm sure the 3/4 time signature didn't help. Still, I'm moving on.