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The way it works for me is that I memorize a chorus so it is under my fingers - then I start analyzing it in terms of: (example) "this here is a Dm7 arpeggio followed by an altered G7 arp (or scale) plus approach notes" - if I do understand what I'm playing it's much easier for me to memorize and relate it to a chord /chord progression and then be able to use it in a different tune...
Originally Posted by Doublea A
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02-23-2017 03:04 PM
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Finally made it. Here's etude #1:
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After much time wasting I clicked the buy button - I'm in, book due 3rd march but I reckon I can screen grab the first few pages from the 'look inside' feature on amazon so wish me luck while I try & catch up...
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Welcome! Originally Posted by dot75
Looking forward to your contributions!
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Forgot to check - does the book come with audio - ie backing tracks, some people seem to be playing to a metronome ?
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Older versions have a CD included, more recent ones come with access to online audio files. For each track Frank plays the etude and then a couple of choruses of (excellent) backing. Some of us (including me) make their own backing tracks with BiaB. Originally Posted by dot75
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Yes, a CD comes with the book. (In some editions, one can download audio files from the Internet.) Originally Posted by dot75
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Checked again....it says online audio in too small lettering...
BiaB sits unused on my laptop
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Still don't have the sound figured out. Tried and tried. Failed and failed. The playing on the recording is spotty but I had to get this over with. ;o) Tomorrow is another day.
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Looks like you used an entirely different fingering for the B-section there, Mark...
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I did! I found Frank's fingering for that passage confusing. I couldn't make sense of where I was. So I came up with this one. Originally Posted by TOMMO
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I find it quite impractical myself so I changed it a bit, too - at least for the phrase over D7. Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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It's one of those cases where I wonder, "What was he thinking?" But it may be more accurate to wonder, "What was the Tab Guy thinking?" (I don't think Frank writes tab.) Originally Posted by TOMMO
More and more, I'm working from the Herb Ellis shapes and Jimmy Bruno's "five fingerings." I know them and they work fine. I like Frank's lines and most of his fingerings make immediate sense to be. But those for the bridge did not. As I've said before--and jasaco said the same thing, IIRC---sometimes Frank shifts up with a pinky for a note that I would rather play by shiting back with my index on the next (lower) string. I think that comes from shifting back to play the 6th in Charlie Christian lines, but that's another story.
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Yes: I think that somebody else wrote the tabs. I've just been revisiting some of the etudes in volume 3 and there are quite a few impractical fingerings as well... Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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Originally Posted by TOMMO
I think each of us must find convenient, consistent fingerings and stick with them. Though I have not worked through William Leavitt's Modern Method for Guitar, a big part of that trilogy is devoted to learn how to read music ON GUITAR. The guitar is a hard instrument to read on because the same pitch may be sounded in two or three places.
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FWIW I don't read tab and find it distracting. I know lot's of people do, but I wish that it was just notation. If there is a particular fingering Frank wanted he could call it out on the notation. OTOH, I did the first few exercises an octave higher than intended. I wouldn't have made that mistake on the first one if I had been looking at the tab.
Still, I avoid the tab if I can.
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I'm still working on Etude #3. It takes me hours to work one of these out, and I'm finding I'm reaching a bit of a saturation point. But I also see how useful it is. I am learning a lot about phrasing from these exercises. Coming from a typical blues/rock background (as least for improvising) I am finding these long runs of swung eighths to be very new for my ears and fingers. I know it will stretch both by working though it, so I'm still plugging away.
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If one has learned to read on the guitar, that's the best way to go. I like the tab in Herb Ellis's books because he was careful to indicate the fingerings he used. He is teaching you a way to play as well as some first-rate lines. I don't think Frank Vignola is thinking about it that way. Indeed, Frank encourages students to finger the lines many different ways and in different positions. Originally Posted by rlrhett
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Okay. I will give my synopsis of Frank's Basic Rhythm Changes 1 through 5 as a Junior College Professor would.
1. Frank approaches these exercises one of two ways. Both ways resemble a bassists approach. Either he approaches the chords like an arpeggio ( see the first 8 bars of Basics 1 ) or he takes a minimal movement approach ( see the first 8 bars of Basics 2 ) where the notes move as subtly as possible.
2. He has clear and distinct 8 bar phrases. Each 8 bar phrase has a distinct characteristic. It could be melodic ( see the last 8 bars of Basics 3. His line moves subtly but constantly upwards ) or rhythmic ( see the last 8 bars of Basics 4 ).
3. He has 3 ways of approaching the bridge. Either he appegiates the chords ( Basics 2 ) or there is minimal movement ( Basics 3 ) or it is directional ( Basics 1 ).
4. Chords. Once again he has divided his phrases into 8 bars. Look at Basics 1. First 8 bars the chords are straight ahead. Bars 8 through 16 he introduces C#dim, G7b9 and F#dim which opens the door for an Ab in the melody and an Eb in the melody ( He could have used a C# but he didn't). In Basics 2 he kept the chords the same for each A section.
Comparing The first 8 bars of Basics 3 and 4, you can see 2 very different approaches to the same chord progression.
Basics 3 : Bb Bdim Cm7 F7 Bb Bdim Cm7 F7 Bb Bb7 Eb Ebm Bb F7
Basics 4 : Bb G7b9 Cm7 F7b9 Bb G7b9 Cm7 F7b9 Bb Bb7#5 Eb Edim Bb F7
Each progression opens up different possibilities melodically.
The bridges of Basics 3 and Basics 4 are also interesting. Basics 3 has the standard cycle 5 bridge, but in Basics 4, Frank adds a IIm chord to approach each dominant chord. Once again, this opens up melodic possibilities.
5. Basics 5 is finally starting to sound like music. The first 8 bars have a 2 bar phrase, followed by a 3 bar phrase and then another 3 bar phrase. Bars 8 through 16 feature a more common 4 bar phrase followed by another 4 bar phrase and ends with a cute arpeggiated ending. That cute arpeggiated ending forshadows the arpeggios in the bridge. The last 8 bars feature a 2 bar phrase followed by a 2 bar phrase followed by a 4 bar phrase. He ends it with same cute ending he used in bars 15 and 16. Like putting a bow on a present.
Those are my thoughts on Frank's Basics. I am interested to see how all of this applies to the solos.
Please feel free to to comment on my comments.
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Thanks for your analysis - very interesting.
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Nice one - This'll keep me occupied while I wait for the book to arrive....I can grab screen shots for Basics 1,3.4 & 5 & Etude # 1 so I'll try & get those down before I get too far behind....
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Well done! I will return to this later (while at the music stand, so I can look over the basics---off the top of my head, I don't recall which is which.) Originally Posted by Doublea A
What jumped out at me here was "8 bar phrases." I think that is right and something for budding improvisers to keep in mind. In Herb Ellis' book on rhythm changes ("Rhythm Shapes") he has a few dozen 8 bar phrases for the A section and about a third as many for the B section. It helps to think of these as 8 bar sections. (Thinking 'chord to chord' is maddening.) Frank's etudes have nice contours. They hang together.
(By the way, he has a book out on bass lines for standard chord progressions. I haven't seen it but it is clear he is aware of bass-line movements. Barney Kessel used to stress learning the bass line first. It helps you keep your place and makes you want to play lines that fit the root movement.)
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K...
My attempt at Etude # 1, gotta say I enjoyed playing it, he writes nice lines that don't sound like exercises so I'm looking forward to the book...
Frank Vignola Rhythm Changes Etude #1 - Video Dailymotion
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Well done dot75 !! Originally Posted by dot75
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What do y'all say if we focus on Etudes #1 and/or #2 for the month of March ?
I was thinking that we structure our learning like this :
March - Etudes #1 and 2
April - Etudes #3 and 4
May - Etudes #5 and 6
June - Etudes # 7and 8
July - Etudes #9 and 10
August - Etudes #11and 12
September - Etudes #13 and 14
October - Etudes #15 and 16
I am planning on studying some other books by Frank Vignola books after that, namely, his "Jazz solos" series.
Your thoughts ?
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That's two per month - not too much of a task I think but I can't speak for others who may not have enough practice time put aside for this (maybe working on other stuff at the same time).
I'm still working on #2 - I can play it but still making too many mistakes, part of that are the (to me) awkward finger stretches in the first couple of frets. It's a good exercise for the pinky but I haven't succeeded to produce a clam-free clip yet...
Meanwhile I have transposed #2 to the key of Bb, mostly for the reason that I'm more familiar with RCs in that key and that way I can relate those phrases much better to what I have already learned until now so it makes more sense to me and I may be able to use parts of it at random or modify them in "improvisation" later on.
But it also was a great exercise in transcribing and notation because I didn't just copy the etude in the book and lower each note a whole step but I wrote it down from the top of my head - I have the phrases memorized pretty good and used standard notation before I filled in the tab part. The fingerings that I chose are much easier to play also.
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