Which is better, metronome or BIAB?

[smokinguit]

Do any of you guys find that you're more expressive/creative playing with a metronome as you improvise, adding the chord stabs in between, instead of playing along with BIAB or a backing track like Aebersold. I'm finding that a metronome is all I need when I'm not playing with someone. I feel more loose. I'm wondering what others feel about this.

[rcpj]

Metronome much better IMO..those play along tracks just feel so artificial and stiff..especially if you like to play with a chordal and melodic approach simultaneously..

[jordanklemons]

Yeah, I use a play along sometimes (iRealB, not BIAB)... but it's pretty rare, and it's usually just when a tune is totally brand new to me, and I'm struggling to feel the form.

But I usually try and avoid it. It's like playing with a group that doesn't swing. Which makes it really difficult to feel good. I feel like I'm training myself to not swing when I play with it.

Sometimes I'll go on youtube and look up play along videos of tunes, especially well known standards. They can be decent. Though you have no control over tempo and what not. But that's not necessarily a bad thing.

[matt.guitarteacher]

In between options as well... Mute instruments in BIAB...

Drum genius is getting a lot of buzz from real players and teachers as well.

[Mark Kleinhaut]

I never use either for much of anything other then checking out a composers tempo referenced in BPM.

[jordanklemons]

In between options as well... Mute instruments in biab...

Drum genius is getting a lot of buzz from real players and teachers as well.

Yes! I always forget about DG. For a while I would use that and loop myself comping x number of choruses of a tune on my looper and then practice over that. I liked that. The loops in DG have a good feel to them, so I feel ALMOST like I'm playing with a human being. And I like playing over my own comping because it gives me an idea of what it feels like for the musicians I work with to play over my comping.

I think many guitar players (at least myself) are often so focused on being able to improvise that we don't spend as much time on our comping and can be weak at it. So that was a fun way to work on both... and to be able to really hear and feel what it's like to improvise over my comping.

[mr. beaumont]

The rhythm section in my head is best...this week it's Adam Nussbaum and Richard Davis.


I like BIAB and backing tracks for illustrating concepts, or wanting to hear an idea over harmony. But rarely will I sit and play a whole tune with them.

Drumgenius is pretty cool...lots of grooves on there I'd never think of...good challenges, some eye and mind opening stuff. I like it less for practice and more for just sitting down and trying to lock in with it, improvising.

[dingusmingus]

The old Howard Roberts "Superchops" course had you record ten minutes of straight comping, and then do the solo exercises over it. I guess that way you're always working on your comping as well as your soloing. (I've never actually done that program.)

That's kind of a nice side effect of the more limited technology of the tape recorder. I often use a looper instead, which only has me comping through the form once or twice.

Very lately, I've been doing some practice with just metronome or drum loop. I see advantages to that.

[docbop]

I like metronome cause I can fill in the rhythm section in my head. Also using the metronome more to just check in like only clicking on 1 or every other measure that helps with working on your inner time keeping.

[christianm77]

Neither. Both are inhuman.

BIAB:

Aebersold is better the BAIB but can be too much of a crutch.

BIAB is Skynet trying to get into our music. You have to fight the robots.

Play along with records and other people, and develop your own internal sense of physical pulse. Play on your own, record it and try playing along with yourself.

Practice understanding how rhythms are constructed and practice vocalising away from your instrument. Also practice drumming and stepping in time while you play, polyrhythms and so on.

Mike Longo's polymetric Djembe tracks are great to practice with too...

Metronome:

It's a useful skill to be able to play with a click as most studio music is recorded this way now, for better or worse. A click will tell you if you are speeding up or slowing down especially on slow settings (try 15bpm.)

But - and here's the catch, I've only realised from years of ardent metronome practice.

If you can make a metronome swing, you don't need to use a metronome.

But - if you can't swing (or even synch) with a metronome, then practicing with a metronome and trying to make it match up isn't actually going to help you. It's an indication that you are doing something wrong rhythmically. Your concept of rhythm is off.

Usually, you don't understand the rhythms you are trying to play and haven't truly internalised them.

Or you are thinking too much of notes.

Or getting worried, excited, trying to inject emotion, trying to make something happen, etc.

The metronome is purely a tool of diagnosis, and even then not all agree that a metronome is the gold standard for pulse. Try chatting to some drummers about it.

[christianm77]

Yes! I always forget about DG. For a while I would use that and loop myself comping x number of choruses of a tune on my looper and then practice over that. I liked that. The loops in DG have a good feel to them, so I feel ALMOST like I'm playing with a human being. And I like playing over my own comping because it gives me an idea of what it feels like for the musicians I work with to play over my comping.

I think many guitar players (at least myself) are often so focused on being able to improvise that we don't spend as much time on our comping and can be weak at it. So that was a fun way to work on both... and to be able to really hear and feel what it's like to improvise over my comping.

They look like us now. Frackin' toasters.



Yes, comping definitely gets over looked as a practice area. I remember Peter Bernstein mentioning that at a workshop - practice comping for a few choruses. Should definitely do that more...

[christianm77]

The old Howard Roberts "Superchops" course had you record ten minutes of straight comping, and then do the solo exercises over it. I guess that way you're always working on your comping as well as your soloing. (I've never actually done that program.)

That's kind of a nice side effect of the more limited technology of the tape recorder. I often use a looper instead, which only has me comping through the form once or twice.

Very lately, I've been doing some practice with just metronome or drum loop. I see advantages to that.

Did he mention the idea of doing it the other way round - solo first, comping after? I think this is a brilliant exercise.

[dingusmingus]

I don't believe so. A PDF of the superchops course is floating around the interwebs--the book is out of print. I looked into it years ago when it was impossibly above my level. I just looked at it again--its kind of intriguing. Basically you play constant eighth notes over a chord progression for 10 minutes, 4 times a day. And you bump up the BPM each day. If you already know your scales and arpeggios pretty cold, it could be fun.

[christianm77]

I don't believe so. A PDF of the superchops course is floating around the interwebs--the book is out of print. I looked into it years ago when it was impossibly above my level. I just looked at it again--its kind of intriguing. Basically you play constant eighth notes over a chord progression for 10 minutes, 4 times a day. And you bump up the BPM each day. If you already know your scales and arpeggios pretty cold, it could be fun.

Yes it certainly could, though I imagine myself hitting a wall at some point, perhaps it's like the frog in the saucepan (horrible metaphor I know.)

Did he recommend a starting tempo?

[Little Jay]

I use:
- play-alongs (mostly iReal, but also Aebersold and Learn Jazz Standards on YouTube)
- metronome
- just my foot padding and the rhythm section in my head
- live musicians ;-)

I guess they all have specific pro's and con's, but combined they help me (like a healthy diet's secret is variation ;-)

Inhuman is not always thát bad:

[coolvinny]

Not sure which is better, but personally I just use a metronome. Simpler to use and I think it keeps me more focused.

[Sammo]

Is there iPhone Metrome app available that can shut down the beat for some period for additional challenge?

And note to self: time to dig out the Galactica DVDs.

[grahambop]

Is there iPhone Metrome app available that can shut down the beat for some period for additional challenge?

Time Guru can be set to remove more and more beats randomly.

Time Guru | avi bortnick

[Sammo]

Yeah, that's it! Thanks!