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Anyone ever do it for prolonged times when practicing or playing?
I find it helps me play more intuitively.
I used to study online with Jimmy Bruno and I remember the discussion came up. This was some, 3-4 years ago so I don't want to quote him on anything since it won't be accurate. But watch him play and you'll see he tends to close his eyes. Then you have others like Pat Martino who seems to never close his eyes when playing(even when playing "Close Your Eyes"), and Pat Metheny who really, really closes his eyes. Almost seems to put effort into doing it.
So how about we get a discussion on that? I'd like to hear if anybody feel they play differently when doing it. How, and why. If they prefer it or not.
I certainly find it helps me step out and dare more because when I can't look at the fretboard I HAVE TO trust my intuition. If I perform in front of an audience, I tend to want to play things I really, really know well. But that's not how good music is made. I remember Joe Diorio talking about playing from the right-side of the brain more and that inspired me to work on that more consciously. Try to get out of the practicing mentality and try to actually practice playing more organically.
Thoughts?
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02-01-2014 08:06 PM
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Cool topic, i've been thinking about this a lot over the past few months. I make a point of practicing with my eyes closed.
I get what you mean about intuition but I think you can keep that level of intuition running while looking as well.
It helps me be really honest about my progress and the patterns/things I'm visualizing while playing. For example, the best chess players in the world can play an entire game without looking at the chess board if the moves are called out to them.
it can also be a funny trick to use if you end up in a jam session playing a tune in a key you aren't as familiar in. Close your eyes, pretend you're in the same key you're comfortable with and avoid the open strings! Not a great long term plan but it definitely can get you by in a pinch
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I've been told I sometimes half-close my eyes when I play - it looks really creepy! all you see is the whites of my eyes. But when I do it, it's when I go into the music - that point where you're confident knowing what's going on around you, and you naturally 'go into' the music deeper. Feels good - looks bad...
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In My opinion, I believe by closing your eyes while playing helps to make you focus on what your hearing around you and play to that.
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If you see my eyes close, you can be sure of two things:
I KNOW that tune.
I'm feeling it.
Without a doubt my best playing happens with my eyes closed...but it's not like I can close my eyes and make it happen!
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I don't know about my eyes, but I need to practice closing my mouth so I don't drool on my guitar when I go into the zone...
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It's an interesting subject and definitely one I have thought about a lot.
But I have also noticed with monotonous regularity that a lot of really great players concentrate like hell when they solo.
I especially notice this with Benson. Even though his whole body is relaxed and loose, his level of concentration is very noticeable. He is REALLY watching hard and close most of the time.
Then I notice a lot of players getting all excited, reacting to the audience and trying to please them and moving around and pulling faces and playing way out of the pocket……and that's a trap a lot of players fall into. They get taken by the music and acknowledge the audience and the whole situation and it stops them from playing.
Then there are players who seem to be in another space. Not caring if the audience is there or not and just feeling the music but somehow controlling IT and not the other way around. Not being overwhelmed or even affected by what the music is projecting. Somehow immune to but controlling the energy. Those guys are the ones I love.
Some of those guys look like they are concentrating and some of them close their eyes.
It seems to be an individual thing.Last edited by Philco; 02-02-2014 at 01:39 AM.
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I often play with my eyes closed because I believe it helps me concentrate on using my ears for melodic ideas, especially when I really know the chords and melody of a song.
wiz
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I like playing with my eyes closed, because then playing becomes totally focused on the aural dimension. I experimented tonight on a new song I just learned this evening - Yardbird Suite by Charlie Parker. Excellent solo guitar vehicle.
The only thing is I'm not sure how that looks to an audience or on a video. But I have a solution. Next video I'll go Ray Charles with a pair of shades.
(No disrespect to the great one - he is one of my musical mentors.)
JayLast edited by targuit; 02-02-2014 at 11:17 AM.
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I'd like to throw another aspect of the issue into the discussion:
Looking at the fretboard while playing means having the neck turned down and (if you are playing right handed) to the left. And even worse may mean hunching over to get close and stare. X hours of playing per day every day, every week, over years and years, then neck always twisted to one side what's going to happen? These days I try to look straight ahead and take a peak only when needed.
Cool discussion in this classical guitar masterclass, both about playing posture and the issue/problems of looking at the fretboard while playing (discussion starts at 4:15)
Last edited by JakeAcci; 02-02-2014 at 08:44 AM.
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Nobody said it yet, so I will: Playing/practicing in the dark is different way of accomplishing what you said and it doesn't require as much effort (to pay attention to keeping your eyes closed or not to look at your hand or fretboard). Another good brain exercise is looking at your hands in the mirror while playing.
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I often close my eyes; it's more or less unconscious. For me the main issue is that I can miss visual cues from my bandmates when my eyes close. Also I sometimes "wake up" too late at the end of my solo and I don't give the others enough time to prepare for the next part of the tune.
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Close your eyes and think of England….oh,… never mind, wrong forum. I don't necessarily close my eyes but I can usually "see" the fretboard better if I don't look at it. I sometimes run into problems when I switch, in the middle of soloing, from "thinking and visualizing" (where I am on the FB) to letting go and playing the rest of a phrase or line "by ear" alone. I find that when I do that, I may very well play something I'm happy with, but then having "let go" of my mental image of the board, when I finish that phrase, I may have to pause to recollect where I'm at, sometimes actually looking for a second to catch my bearings. As well as I can visualize the neck without looking, I still wish I could use "shapes" to better advantage. My issue I think stems from shapes being "one note/finger" per string, and once I play 2,3,or 4 notes on one string…that shape has dissolved.
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I close my eyes a lot when I'm playing, helps my hearing.
Having your eyes closed might cause problem with players with a Fake book dependency.
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I was thinking about this about a month ago. I noticed that I have the bad habit of not looking enough at the fingerboard.
For playing and being in the moment sure... but for practice I force my self to look at the fingerboard or close my eyes and visualise the fingerboard. Otherwise I am making mistakes and practice makes permanent.
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As a non professional musician, I play mostly just by ear involving a lot of tactile memory.
I can play for an extended time without looking at the fret board but mistakes DO happen sometimes but lets say my living room is much more forgiving than a band situation or club would be
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I was thinking about this as I went to sleep last night. I took out a book from the library about 5 years ago called The Mind's Ear that had exercises to train how to hear music in your head. For me, playing with my eyes closed seems to relate to being able to hear what I want to do in my head first and on the instrument second.
Horn players are never looking at their fingers while they play, that would be ridiculous.
My little sister thinks it's odd that I know what note's I'm playing when I play with my eyes closed. She even tried to test me, I improvised for 10 minutes with my eyes closed and she told me to stop randomly and wanted to know what note I was playing when I stopped.
It's just like speaking, you don't need to look at your mouth or tongue when trying to speak.
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That's funny to me in one way. I never had a problem "hearing the music in my mind", but it did take a bit of work and love to learn to make it happen on the guitar, especially as a full 'chord-melody' or classical jazz arrangement improvisation. Tonight I was playing in various keys two of my favorite jazz standards - The Second Time Around and When You Wish Upon A Star, as I watched Chopped on TV. With eyes closed, I hear Tony Bennett or Cliff Edwards singing the melodies, and I just follow. Too late to sing aloud, as everyone is asleep. But, as I play the song that first enchanted me a very young boy and hear Cliff Edwards unique voice in my mind, it takes me back to my childhood and the magic happens all over again.
Music is a kind of addiction - I'm always chasing that high.
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Here's something more to consider:
http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2014...rain-hear-more
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You must have been listening to radio four this morning.
Originally Posted by Gertrude Moser
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This topic has obsessed me plenty..(as well as my irritating fellow guitarists when i suggest they quit looking at their hands so much)
(and a veer: but what REALLY drives me nuts is multiple-guitarist jams where all the pickers are always looking at the other guys' hands, like "OMG i better make sure i'm doing the same thing they're doing or else"
some factors which led to pondering this topic much:
--i played soprano sax & clarinet for about a decade...mediocre-to-horrible at best but loved the sound...wherein i realized that you can't really see your fingers when playing horns...instead you develop 'muscle memory'...and seek to access any & all possible notes on the horn, i.e. tp play ALL of the instrument...and the process DEMANDS using yer ears more than yer eyes.
--about age 15 i fell in love with and tried to learn old-time appalachian fiddle, failed...but kept trying off-and-on...about age 42 i finally got serious about fiddling....'serious about fiddling' now there's an oxymoron for ya
...but again: eyes don't help much with fiddle...your view of the fingerboard is extremely foreshortened....and there's no frets...so it becomes all 'mental sonic image', muscle memory and keeping yer ears on high alert...
--ditto for playing fretless bass (and upright bass tho i presently dont own one) which i love playing...when playing fretless i look at the fretboard very little...of the non-bowed string instruments it's the one that feels the closest to singing...VERY ear-oriented...very tight link between what the 'mind's ear' desires and what the fingers do...
--thinking about the many great blind musicians of various genres...they cant use visual input...many of them, when good, tend to be VERY good, like scary good...
these have led me to consciously be wary of watching the fingers/fingerboard too much...i often play in the dark, or with my eyes closed, or just deliberately avoiding looking at the fingerboard.
oops: keyboard too...it seems that some of my 'best' keyboard playing (in jazz idiom, tho i'm no great shakes) happens when i'm not looking, just playing...
dunno exactly why it is, but i do believe there is something about guitar playing which can lead to the vision-sense becoming too bossy....
brings to mind the title of that george martin book about details of the beatles' recording sessions: 'all you need is ears'...kinda
actually IMO playing any fretless string instrument--even if only occasionally--can help enhance guitaring...conceptually, physically, sonically etc.
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Segovia looked at his hands.
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Hello to all! I think that it is important to clarify the difference between learning and playing. Many players don't know the difference between the two approaches.
If you go to any instructional video and someone is demonstrating a musical idea, their eyes are always going to be open.
If you watch someone in a playing mode, sometimes they will close their eyes.
When you are practicing, you are either starting to learn or reviewing musical information. this always requires that one'e eyes should remain open because you are in a learning mode. Everyone keeps their eyes open in a learning experience.
Playing itself is the instantaneous moment of representing music that has already been learned. It is here where emotion and the flow of music takes place and it is only here where one might close their eyes.
It is a non-helpful approach to deliberately close one's eyes in a learning situation, assuming that you will either learn how to play better or get in contact with some deeper part of you. You won't! Learning is not art. It is an information gathering moment and you will all learn better if you keep your eyes open and think about where your fingers should go on your instruments. Please write your thoughts and we can talk about them. I am home for a few weeks and would like to know what you think. Regards to all. Jeff berlin
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Originally Posted by Gertrude Moser
This explains why, when I wake up during the night, the ticking of a clock that I don't even notice in the daytime bugs it and I have to turn on a fan to drown it out.....
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Good point! I guess this is also a test: if you can close your eyes and play it, you have learned it. Otherwise, not so much..... Originally Posted by Jeff Berlin
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