Introduction to Jazz Guitar Soloing Pages 2 through 5

[fep]

So what are we going to do in this study group? We’ll figure it out as we move along. This will become what ever we all end up making it. Let’s all captain this ship.

Pages 2 through 5 includes the Introduction and Chapter 1. You’ll see that the Introduction to the book has us reading chapters 26, 27, 28 and the conclusion. By my count that’s 11 pages. Maybe about a half hour of reading.

If you’re like me, and already have the ‘prerequisites’ down, there won’t be anything to learn on the guitar for this section of the book. Although there are guitar exercises on page 4 and 5 which are something probably all of us can already do. These chapters are just introducing some concepts. Let’s discuss those concepts.

Perhaps some of you have a bit of work to do if you don’t have the prerequisites under your belt. Ask for help with that if you have any questions.

From Page 2 of the book:

The essence of the book can be summarized by the following statement.

As a developing player you have two simple goals:
To acquire a vocabulary (licks you know)
To acquire a repertoire (songs you know)

I’ve created an ‘Index Thread’ that lists all of this Study Group's threads and links:

Introduction to Jazz Guitar Soloing - Thread Index

I want my role to be the same as every elses in the group. We are all students, teachers, and cheerleaders. The only thing extra for me is to start each thread which will also set our schedule through the book.

[fep]

What do you call a jazz musician with a large repertoire and a large vocabulary?

Answer: A Pro


Depending on your definition of 'A Pro' that may be a bit of an exaggeration as you certainly could have a large repertoire and vocabulary and not be making your living playing music.

But, the biggest difference between me and the professional jazz musicians that I know is that they all have a very large repertoire and vocabulary.

[gingerjazz]

Hey Fep,only just noticed this study group.I love this book,and have been using it and its concepts now for quite a few years.I will be happy to talk about my experiences of the book if anyone is interested in my views of it.This was one of those books that came along just st the right time for me.It helped me a lot with learning to actually play something that sounded like jazz with all the arps and scales i had memorized,but was struggling to actually turn them into something musical.Hope i can be of some help around here.Peace.

[pantz]

Won't get my copy until May 3 but please y'all begin at your leisure and I'll catch up!

It looks like the first couple chapters are likely covering familiar territory for me anyway and I can likely fly through those to catch up.

[gersdal]

I enjoyed reading the first pages of this book, and they kicked of some ideas for me that I turned into something in another thread. Hope you see the resemblance.

Your qoute on:

To acquire a vocabulary (licks you know)
To acquire a repertoire (songs you know)

pretty much say the essence of these first pages.

The thing I would ask would be "What is missing? Is that all?"

I like licks, and we worked on a lick thread some time ago, but still I would say that I´m missing:
To acquire a set of situations that you are familiar with.

Such situations would be things like ii-V-I´s, turnarounds etc.

ok, enough ranting from me.

[gingerjazz]

The thing i like about this book is that although at first glance it seems a pretty short book.When you begin to work with it you realize that he gives you a concept that you can then take away and expand upon.I tend to think of it as a book that opens doors to rooms full of more doors.

[fep]

The thing I would ask would be "What is missing? Is that all?"

I like licks, and we worked on a lick thread some time ago, but still I would say that I´m missing:
To acquire a set of situations that you are familiar with.

Such situations would be things like ii-V-I´s, turnarounds etc.

ok, enough ranting from me.

Those situations, ii V I's and turnaround are what this book has you write licks over.

Chapter 4 is actually called "Situation Playing".

In that chapter on page 12 the author says

The ultimate goal for this book is to learn to write, practice, and play licks over the common situations listed in this chapter.

He then lists 11 common situations (on page 13) found in jazz standards. Those situations include ii V I's and turnarounds.

[gersdal]

Those situations, ii V I's and turnaround are what this book has you write licks over.

Chapter 4 is actually called "Situation Playing".

He then lists 11 common situations (on page 13) found in jazz standards. Those situations include ii V I's and turnarounds.

Cool. I haven´t been cheating so I didn´t know. This looks very interesting.

[fep]

Hey Fep,only just noticed this study group.I love this book,and have been using it and its concepts now for quite a few years.I will be happy to talk about my experiences of the book if anyone is interested in my views of it.This was one of those books that came along just st the right time for me.It helped me a lot with learning to actually play something that sounded like jazz with all the arps and scales i had memorized,but was struggling to actually turn them into something musical.Hope i can be of some help around here.Peace.

Hi Gingerjazz,

That would be great if you follow along and add your insights as we go. Perhaps you might also want to post some recordings of some of the exercises. That may be something you didn't do your first time through the book.

[yelserpdog]

Hey Fep, For those of us that are waiting for our book to arrive, could you outline what the 'prerequisites' are?

Cheers
YD

[FatJeff]

Just noticed this thread got posted. I'm in. I've read this material before but it was a couple of years ago, and I never saw it to its conclusion. One thing I definitely need is to improve both my repertoire of songs and my vocabulary.

BTW good to have Ginger on board!

[fep]

I emailed Joe Elliott to tell him that we had started this Study Group.

Here is his response. I put part of it in Bold, the part that really struck a chord with me. I have never heard it expressed this way.

Hi Frank --

Awesome.

I taught this course at MI for over 20 years and I teach it here at McNally Smith, too. I've had virtual beginners and experienced guys do the method with varying results. The beginners do reasonable well because they surrender to the method and make noticeable progress. However, they lack performance experience which means their phrasing isn't very developed. Until they listen to a lot of jazz and played a lot of tunes, the sound can be mechanical.

For some of the more experienced players, they have trouble disciplining themselves to actually develop a solidified vocabulary. I always stress to them that "lick writing" and "lick inserting" is only a phase you go though like adolescence. But it is a necessary phase for MOST.

Licks are a way to inject new, clear and precise harmonic ideas into your playing without allowing you to slip back into your normal habits which may be passable. I don't think I use the term "finger path" in the book but I always have in the classes. The licks teach you the finger paths and help you work out smooth segues from chord to chord.

I've had some very rewarding experiences with the guys who put it all together. I feel like a proud papa when guys get through the method and can play tunes convincingly. It's even better when they come back a few years later and kick my ass.

Cheers,

Joe

[wizard3739]

I just got my book and after a short overview, it looks great! It always feels good when I find something written by a G.I.T. grad.

wiz

[fep]

Hey Fep, For those of us that are waiting for our book to arrive, could you outline what the 'prerequisites' are?

Cheers
YD

I just found the 1st 12 pages previewed in goggle books. See if you can preview it there. Here's the link I ended up with:

Introduction to Jazz Guitar Soloing: A Comprehensive Improvisation Method - Joe Elliott - Google Books

[gingerjazz]

First of thank you Jeff for your kind words about having me on board.Secondly Fep,i would love to post some examples of my playing.The problem is i am a complete numbskull when it comes to computers.I have absolutely no idea how to go about getting a recording of my playing on here.I do not think i have the right equipment to do it either.I cannot deny being a bit of a dinosaur.

[gingerjazz]

Would just like to say that i own just about all the major jazz guitar books on the market,and without a shadow of doubt this book is the one that has helped me the most.The connecting game that joe has you doing is just the most incredible and powerfull tool i have found.After a short while of using this book i found myself really being able to visualize the fretboard more clearly than i had done previously.

[fep]

Page 3 Scale patterns

For those of you still waiting for your book, the author says you should know at least Pattern I of the Major shapes and Pattern II of the minor shapes.

Those are the same patterns I already learned. I learned them as “CAGED” and I believe they are also the same patterns that Jimmy Bruno teaches.

Did you know with these patterns you can connect the entire neck for any key?

And, using these patterns you can play every key within 3 frets, anywhere on the neck?

And there are really only 5 fingerings, the roots just shift between minor and major. Sorry about the open position one, these are all in G and that's how Sibelius presented it. Pretend that's not an open position and it becomes a movable form.

[FatJeff]

Hey fep, any way you could shoot me that .sib file? I'd like to print it out in higher res than what I'm getting of the file site.

[FatJeff]

BTW, what do we do about comments for Chapt 26-28 and the conclusion, which are required reading for the Intro chapter? Do we post here, or create another thread for that?

[pantz]

Thanks for the info for those (like me) still waiting for the book.

[wizard3739]

When I attended G.I.T. in 77-78, we had not yet adopted a particular set of scale patterns and were encouraged to come up with our own approach. I ended up with a 5-fret set (7 patterns) that covers all the major scales within that 5 fret position. The only real advantage to this approach it forces you to stretch to play these patterns and if you start at the top of the neck and play them a cycle sequence (Bb-Eb-Ab-db etc...), you will work your way down the neck from top to bottom. As a result of practising these for a few years, I am able to play any scale set in any position. Many times, however, I have wished I had used the caged approach.

wiz

[Ozymandias]

I own this book and have done some work with it and continue to use some of the concepts although I haven't mastered all the material by any means. I'm not sure I want to go back and work through it from the start, so I won't opt in to the study group, but I will be following the thread with a lot of interest.

I'd make a couple of observations:

1. It's a useful approach in particular to incorporating melodic minor concepts into your playing in a practical way. Priceless information for the novice jazzer (as I am myself).

2. One difficulty you will have is deciding at what point you move on to the next stage. You could probably read and assimilate most of the information in this book in an evening's concentrated reading. Getting the concepts under your fingers and in your ears is a different matter. I've ended up spending months on the "long" major and minor 2-5-1s because I want to feel I've assimilated the material properly before moving on to the next thing. I'm not saying this approach is better, just that there's a difficult judgement call to be made about when to move forward.

I'm interested in Joe's own comments. I admit that like some of his students I've tended to neglect writing licks in favour of using the connecting game to develop my sense of a pitch-pool that will work in a given harmonic situation. I'm pretty happy with the results but I do feel that my phrasing could be sharper. Maybe I need to incorporate more pre-composed licks.

Apologies for the slightly off-topic ramblings but I thought some people might be interested in the thoughts of someone who has worked with the book.

[fep]

Hey fep, any way you could shoot me that .sib file? I'd like to print it out in higher res than what I'm getting of the file site.

Hi Jeff, here's the .sib file:

Scale Patterns Elliot Vs Caged.sib - File Shared from Box - Free Online File Storage

and here's a pdf for those that don't have Sibelius:

Scale Patterns Elliot Vs Caged.pdf - File Shared from Box - Free Online File Storage

[fep]

BTW, what do we do about comments for Chapt 26-28 and the conclusion, which are required reading for the Intro chapter? Do we post here, or create another thread for that?

Yes, I think we should post here as it is required reading for the Intro chapter.

It will be a while before I start a thread specifically for those chapters as I'm going to create threads in the same order as the chapters of the book.

I'm glad you are going to post on those chapters. I had some comments, but was really hoping this could be more of a group discussion. So I've been holding back a bit.

[gingerjazz]

Just thought i would mention that i now use all the concepts in the book,but i am now applying the approach to the leavit fingerings.However i have not yet mastered this by any means,as i am still getting all the arpeggios together,i just love the journey.I should have the connecting game down in all twelve fingerings within 200 years if i get my head down.Peace.