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Just curious fellas! Don’t get me wrong I love Charlie Parker,Dizzy,etc. But how are the gigs going so far? Lol!
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05-24-2024 12:25 PM
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Uh … going fine? No one’s told me otherwise, anyway.
Originally Posted by jads57
I guess the implication here is that no one likes to listen to bebop? Or like .. maybe that dorks don’t get gigs?
I don’t know.
Dorks get all the gigs in my experience.
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I had a goal to play 12 gigs this year, my first year gigging, and I have 14 on the books. So it's going great. How are your gigs? Originally Posted by jads57
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Upscale Cucina Italiana close to the bay with my trio this evening, new bassist, wish me luck! Originally Posted by jads57
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I wasn’t being entirely serious about the ‘cool kids’ bit. Originally Posted by Reg
Of course I’m pointing out that the relationship between melody and harmony goes both ways.
Tbh I think jazzers think about harmony more than any other type of musican. It’s a bit of a preoccupation.
I don’t know if this has always been the case and if it’s not a bit of a cul de sac conceptually.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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The joke is only a few musicians and people will take the time to listen to musicians music. Or better put there’s no money above the 3rd fret!
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This is generally more true the more pretentious the musician is about their “art.” Originally Posted by jads57
But people like seeing performers play fast and get into what they’re doing.
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So… no gigs for you then? Originally Posted by jads57
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Not too many any longer! To be honest at 67 kind of tired of bars , and playing music just for the meager paycheck most gigs offer.
There are no shortage of technically competent players, but the gigs
themselves are generally not worth the hassle. There were some fun gigs, some that paid well, but not too many.
It seems like a hobby for many people, like fishing or golf. And that’s fine, but I did it as a profession and it was probably not the best choice as a career path. It also has dramatically changed from just playing and adapting to many styles, too now being your own booking agent, manager, business agent,etc. No thanks!
Have too say as well there are no new Jimi Hendrix, Jaco Pastorius ground breaking music that were my inspiration as a younger player.
Now it’s all about Marketing and Video and playing famous music exactly like Charlie Parker, Coltrane, Jeff Beck,etc. I find that extremely boring and unmusical. In other words the actual Magic about it has found another path like Computers,Video,etc.
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Zzzzzzz
Can we start talking about turns again?
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Yeah, it’s a labor of love now. You can’t support yourself on $100 gigs anymore. Originally Posted by jads57
A non-insignificant amount of my practice time is looking for and promoting gigs. I don’t think it used to be like this.
I fantasize about a regular gig now. A restaurant or something with a weekly jazz brunch would be heaven. Then I wouldn’t have to hustle for all these one night stands.
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I played through your exercises. It’s high on the staff. I don’t think I have those notes on my guitar. So I started at 10th fret e string. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
Part two is like a tongue twister. Fun.
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Ohhhh I just got it. The DEDC is the root note turn, then it goes down the scale. This will be useful.
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Doesn't really matter where you start ... should eventually do them wherever and in whatever key. Originally Posted by AllanAllen
But the highest note on the page I think is 12th fret E
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Excellent. Yeah they're fun. Originally Posted by AllanAllen
The Clifford Brown ones I'm tinkering with now are super fun. I'll get around to putting them over here soon.
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I tend to ramble so I had to chop a lot out, but here’s something. I’ll get into some weirder stuff soon:
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Originally Posted by pauln
Good luck. Hopefully you're not asked to play Italian folk songs. (my in-laws always ask me, so I did learn Volare).
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Well, yes really. The weasel word is ‘mostly’; in other words they all use their pinky Originally Posted by Christian Miller
From a practical point of view I find that CG technique allows access to the higher positions without having to slide up and down the neck. But if you do slide up and down the neck, that’s ok with me.
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Weasel words? Haha you are definitely trying to wind me up. Originally Posted by Irishmuso
Well, yes really. The weasel word is ‘mostly’; in other words they all use their pinky
From a practical point of view I find that CG technique allows access to the higher positions without having to slide up and down the neck. But if you do slide up and down the neck, that’s ok with me.
No this is a really obvious distinction. Everybody seems fixated on the fingers for some reason- ‘Why wouldn’t I use the pinky?’, reasonable question, the answer being that if you set up your hand this way you wouldn’t really want to.
The principle difference between the techniques of Wes and Pat compared to Jim Hall or Adam Rogers is in the position of the thumb, the pronation of the hand and the area of the fingers that is doing the fretting.
The reason we might call it a ‘three fingered’ technique is that the little finger is naturally disadvantaged and less useful than in CG position because the 3rd finger stretches that much further to cover the notes the 4th finger would normally play, and the pinky is sidelined, even tucked away by some players.
However while the little finger is much less useful in the pronated position it is not completely useless. It’s particularly handy for melodic turns working in combination with the third finger. Metheny, Grant Green and Wes use this type of figure as a part of their improvisational vocab.
You also obviously need to use the pinky for many common chords. But you’ll see these players shift their thumb position from ‘legit’ for some grips to thumb over (even thumb fretting) and so on for others. For CG technique we really want to keep thumb in the same place for a given position, right?
there’s no question it’s a distinct technique because you would instantly get told off by a CG teacher for doing what I’m talking about. I nag my child students for doing it haha.
Anyway I don’t think I did a bad job of explaining it in my video. George demonstrates the position perfectly in my thumbnail. The relevant discussion is around the 2:30 mark.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkLast edited by Christian Miller; 05-26-2024 at 05:09 AM.
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you make it sound like that is a good thing. Originally Posted by Irishmuso
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Not to mention that it only offers access to the higher positions without shifting if you don’t … yknow … start in a lower position. Originally Posted by djg
Im 100% a pinkie guy, but if it has advantages, I don’t think the lack of shifting is one of them. If you shift less, it’s only marginally so. I think shifts tend to be more abrupt and distinct with four fingered technique, though maybe there’s a little less shifting in general.
See: the three octave Segovia scales.
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It’s a weird one. I started watching a lot of classical piano videos online, and they spend a lot of time talking about the physicality of a master’s playing in a way I don’t hear much in jazz.
It’s possible to see why - the fixation in much of jazz is the construction of music, we seem less concerned with the way those notes are played (a mistake in my view). In classical piano the notes are a given, and learning them is stage one of many levelled process.
Many of the piano greats seem to have had non standard techniques but these are discussed and analysed with the basic assumption being that there’s something to learn from them. I assume the same thing of our jazz greats, Wes, Grant etc. The way they play notes is often as interesting as the notes they choose.
I don’t make the assumption that what my guitar teacher told me to do in CG lessons as a teenager means that there’s nothing to learn from the way those guys played. And yet I’ve heard people talk about Pat Metheny’s ‘bad technique’ because he moves his fingers too much and sticks his thumb over the neck. And so on.
I find this mind boggling. Would Wes have sounded better if he’d played with his thumb behind, fretting with his finger tips? No idea, but he certainly wouldn’t have sounded like Wes.
Otoh I completely understand a lack of desire to ‘relearn’. All I would say is, I’ve found it fun and I like the way it sounds.
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Well if four fingers was good enough for Allan Holdsworth, it's good enough for my meagre talent.
Watch this video of Allan Holdsworth trying to do an advertisement for his signature guitar, it's very funny and shows closeup his incredible four finger fretting technique.
"RIP AH, you will never be forgotten."
He starts really playing at 3:38mins
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My God, you guys are still talking about fingers?
2 was good enough for Django.
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“Four fingers good, two fingers better! All guitarists Are Equal. But Some Guitarists Are More Equal Than Others.” George Orwell, Animal Farm Originally Posted by AllanAllen
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