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This study group is based on the book, Patterns for Jazz by Jerry Coker et al.
Complete thread index for this study group here:
Post a "deadline version" video of any or all of the weekly patterns, by Sunday each week, following this schedule:
Mar 10: patterns 1-4
Mar 17: patterns 5-6
Mar 24: patterns 7-10
Mar 31: patterns 11-12
Please, state the BPM you're using, which pattern(s) you're posting, and label the post "deadline version", (understanding that a more "final version" may take additional time etc). Please state whether you would like comments on your playing. If you want the best comments possible, please be specific on exactly what you want comments on. "Especially my time/feel/right hand technique" etc etc. There are exceptions, but generally, people will be pretty vague and overly polite if they don't know exactly what you're looking for, ....what your experience level is , ...what your goals are etc.
Additionally, please look ahead to upcoming weeks , and post preliminary versions if you want, especially if you are newer to this kind of work and want to take some of the edge off... or pressure etc. Posting an early baseline version will give other players a frame of reference to compare things to later, rather than just comparing you to "every other player".
I've already posted one for the first week in the other thread, and my primary goal at this point only has to be somewhat improving on that, if I choose to see it that way.
I personally would encourage any types of questions regarding these exercises as to their purpose , technical approaches , specific problems as related to guitar fretboard organization etc. etc. Please note that if you do NOT intend to post playing in this thread, your comments regarding the purpose word validity of these exercises belongs in a separate thread of your own creation elsewhere. Thanks.
Please PM me corrections or post in the previous thread.Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 05-29-2019 at 04:04 PM.
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03-02-2019 07:00 PM
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Okay, to break the ice, I'll repost my preliminary version.
My goals for my deadline version this week are:
*to improve the audio of my drum genius backing by plugging into speakersand fixing volume,
*to get a little better gain setting on my camera and possibly improve the tone of this electric otherwise.
*to post these at the maximum of the "suggested tempo" range in the book with the best time and swing feel I can manage.
All of my music day job and playing/teaching is with acoustic, and I'm really lazy about even plugging this thing in. It's definitely something I want to improve on. Tone generally that is. Probably need to get some real jazz plectrums among other things... :-) I'm using the neck pickup , which is a humbucker. The tone knob is almost all the way on the treble side with flat wound chromes. I'd have to look at the amp settings when I get home, but it's pretty bad amp for this purpose, honestly.
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I am making an iReal playlist for this group.
Let me know if are interested in sharing.
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Hey Matt... so patterns 1-148 are great... I'll post whatever you want.... I can sightread any of these, and already have fingerings internalized. I could post possible fingerings for each pattern.
When you get to patterns 149-233.... might want to insert the same previous patterns in melodic minor before. Would be much more useful for playing Jazz.... and then harmonic Min. (maybe even harmonic Maj.)... then patterns 149-233, the symmetric scales and arpeggios... If you don't do it up front... you'll just need to do it later. Symmetric scales and arpeggios have harmonic relationships to functional harmony... (not just Major).
A note... when one works on these patterns... try and not look at neck while you play. It will be difficult, so go back and forth between watching and not. Getting away from starring at your guitar while you play just take practice and is part of performance.
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Originally Posted by Reg
I'd especially be interested in your take on some of the ii-V's. There's always discussion of thinking of them in terms of either the II or the V alone, but it occurs to me in thinking of these cycles, that on the guitar, it may as well be as much dependent on position as pure musical considerations. For example, if the root of the II is on 6th string, you may as well consider as if it's all II and "spell" the line as-if...
Maybe different if root is on 5th? I have to want to see them more as V.
Anyway, would be interested in your take...
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Second post on this page for IReal playlist:
Jazz Practice Exercises - Page 22
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Originally Posted by Doublea A
I'm currently using drum genius to play along with, and I'm just in love with this free app. I'll post the names of the loops I'm using for 1-4 today. Everyone else, please do the sameas you think about it.
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Few comments.
First way through (E and A string roots) is familiar. All 2nd finger roots. I could play that much faster.
Second way through uses more fingerings (2nd, 3rd and 4th finger roots) and includes roots on the D string. Don't have this down at all.
I have iRealPro on my phone but as I used the phone to record video, I didn't want to use it as a backing track (fearing it would be too loud in the mix). So I used my Zipbeat metronome. May have to switch to a webcam for future videos.
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Isn't the deadline version the final version after working on it for a week?
I don't know if I'll post a preliminary version this week. I'm still trying to work out some bugs in my audio/video setup. Thought I would get that ironed out this weekend, but it didn't happen.
My approach for the sake of this group is going to be working the material through three positions - E A D set, A D G set and D G B set - staying in strict position for each set. I'm specifically trying to avoid just memorizing patterns and shapes on the fingerboard and forcing myself to be aware of the name of each root and the intervals I'm playing. To this end, I'm calling out the roots as I go through each exercise.
I can play all four exercise without much trouble freestyle, but as soon as I throw a backing track on, I start fumbling around and missing the mark or getting lost on which root comes next. Certain things are throwing me off at this point. Thinking Gb rather than F# is a big one. I never realized such a simple thing could mess with my head and hands. Remembering the sequence of roots in minor thirds is completely foreign to me at this point as well.
My goal for the week will be to get each set down well enough to play to the track without mistakes and hesitation.
My overall goal for working this material is that I want to get to the point where I can play any scale or arpeggio in any key from wherever my hand is on the fingerboard without having to think about it.
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Originally Posted by FwLineberry
I was determined to post something today just to get started.
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So here is my first post on patterns 1-4. I hope I'm doing what we're supposed to be doing here. It's strange how I've played jazz guitar now for over 20 years and these basic triad patterns were tricky! The 5/4 pattern also threw me. But here it is, clams and all!
Featuring... my 1960's Hagstrom I in brilliant bright red acrylic!
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Looks like a party, I'll see if I can hang.
Pattern 1, 100bpm, pattern 2 110bpm
Something different, I hope to sing all the patterns. But, I won't always subject you to the singing.Intonation is a challenge at this tempo (well, honestly, intonation is always a challenge at any tempo).
Goal is to speed up and clean up. I want my left hand fingers that aren't fretting a note to stay tight/close to the strings, I want my pick motion to be more compact, I want to tighten up my rhythm.
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Wow. Kind of lit this thread up today. Good stuff. Thanks for posting, everyone.
"Weekending" works as well as anything. That's what I meant by "deadline". I just didn't like the sound of "final" version on something like this...
I really like seeing the different approaches.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
That drum genius pattern has been one of my go-to's as well. Infectious... Did you check out the "Take 5" pattern? It may be a little on the fast side. I'd have to look, but it works well for this 5/4 pattern. There's another New Orleans 5/4 that's way faster than the target BPM but is a lot of fun too.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
I'd be interested in others' s take on that D- forum arp, in terms of what might be consensus anyway (maybe Christian uses this one?). Seems like I remember Mike Christiansen using a pinky shift up the fretboard on the second string for that upper octave. So his D-form would be 2-1-1-4 from the same fret as the A-form. I'd have to look back. Anyway, your fingers are so long, you make everything look like it's a one position. :-)
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I just read through the first 16 patterns....
So it seems that one should work through in positions
When I sight read through, I played them all between 5th and 7th position. Which used standard position shapes. There are a few options... but seem to lay easily on fretboard.
I tried a few others... 2nd to 4th, then 8th - 10th.... they all seem to work.
It seems that eventually when we get to larger arpeggios... 6ths, 7th, 9ths etc... you need to have shapes that fit into positions, I don't think it will matter whats system you use... caged, 3 notes per string or 7 positions.... the point is to have a fretboard system that repeats.
Eventually your not going to have to figure fingerings...they will be internalized and you will only be choosing how you want the pattern to sound, different fingerings have different natural articulations etc...
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Originally Posted by Reg
I don't like the "C Position" fingering for major arpeggios because it to easily becomes sweep picking-articulation.
Somehow this very terse summary just clicked for me. I feel like I understand now why I've inclined toward playing some things a certain way.
Day made. Not even 1 PM and I can go to bed happy!
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So I've slightly modified my approach on this.
After reading Reg's comments about position playing, I'm putting more emphasis on position playing. It was a better way to organize this a little and not be completely random. Still gives me a lot of benefit of making choices but just kind of reels it in a little bit from being a free for all and I like that. It just makes sense that you would probably naturally play out of a position and then shift positions as opposed to randomly jumping around, Although I'm not counting that out haha.
Thanks for starting this thread and excercise, Matt. I'm a little blown away with some of the benefits I'm already seeing with regard to fretboard freedom. Just in these first 4 patterns I can already sense that I'm seeing the fretboard a little more clearly but also I'm hearing it .
I find not looking to be a crazy challenge, especially on the circle of 5ths and the minor 3rd transitions. wow. I am trying not to be buried in the fretboard though. Just gonna take some time.
Anybody else feel there is 3 months of study in just these first 4 patterns? lol
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oh, and I just wanted to add.....
I can also see how these first major patterns are a springboard for extensions, dominant and minor patterns coming so I wouldn't expect every few groups of patterns to take 3 months, but certainly these major patterns are foundational in nature and for me, worth spending a lot of time organizing them.
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Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher
I'll make a video later.
As for CAGED, I got the five fingerings (got them down, I should say) via Jimmy Bruno. He hates the term CAGED. Joe Pass liked it. They're really the same. But I didn't learn it thinking of CAGED. To Jimmy, the fingerings are named for the lowest note in the fingering. For Jimmy, if you're in C, the lowest (closed) fingering has the root on the A string, 3rd fret. But the lowest note in the position is G, the 5th of C, so that's fingering 5. Fingering 6 starts on A, and fingering 7 starts on B. Fingering 2 starts on D and fingering 3 on E.
And this is why Jimmy prefers "pitch collection" to "scale." Fingering 5 turns out to be (in C): G A B C D E F G A B C D E F G A. That's all the notes of the C scale but you don't play it root to root, you play all the available notes in the position.
I relate this to Pat Martino's "five activities" in his book "Linear Expressions." (Same 6-4-3-2 chord inversions of m7 chords.) But that's another story. ;o)
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I'm implementing Michael Kaye's approach of staying in the same area of the neck. I like that it forces one to use a bunch of different patterns. Never the same pattern consecutively.
Also, fyi in case some don't know. Jerry Coker is not a guitarist, he is a saxophonist and educator. Thus, no specific guitar position or fingering guidance in this book.
Regarding Matt's request about how we are using the D form:
I am using the Caged D form at parts of this video, actually I'm using all 5 forms in this video. I play the D Form per the attached 1st measure. I'll sometimes combine the D and C form as in the 2nd measure. There is no rule that you can't combine the CAGED positions, no rule you have to be "CAGED" in with CAGED. I think those that criticize the CAGED system don't consider that the positions get combined to create these hybrid positions.
(The 3-2-1-1 that Mark described is not a D form, it is the E form as Matt mentioned).Last edited by fep; 03-05-2019 at 05:43 PM.
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If trying to deepen awareness of the fingerboard is one of your goals
then I would consider practicing the patterns in the context of 5 fret positions.
2 1/3 octaves of the chromatic scale and one unison are contained in every 5 frets.
Pick any 5 frets and stay there for the whole pattern. For chromatic ascending,
I would suggest starting on the lowest possible chord in the position
and continuing to the highest one rather than C (ex. 1st position F major > A major)
This yields most of the standard fingering possibilities as well as several awkward ones.
In my opinion, there is also value in learning to problem solve best possible fingering solutions
for more awkward note locations.
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Here's a quick take on the first pattern in two octaves. Planning to work on cleanliness and time feeling!
Inviato dal mio SM-G955F utilizzando Tapatalk
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Originally Posted by benjaminjoe
Ha! I didn't think of using a finger tap move on the B string roots. I might have to rethink my approach.
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