Practice guitar with an amp - or not?

[christianm77]

The Compact 60-3 is just as portable (it's only 0.3kg/12oz heavier than the Alpha).

Really? Hmmmm.... The 60 is definitely a step up from the Alpha.... Will seriously consider this...

[christianm77]

Oh the other reason why it is a VERY good idea to own an AER is that singers love the mic channel, and you may get booked on the basis of owning one. It's a bit crap, but it is the reality of gigging.

[christianm77]

I always practice with an amp, unless I'm just kind of playing around.

Best headphone amp I've found is the Phil Jones Bighead. It doesn't have adjustable reverb, but believe me...the sound is not too dry. They must have built just a touch of verb into the signal, not enough to notice reverb but enough to not sound too dry, and in fact sound really really good.

My Mambo amp has a good headphone out but if the wall power is not super clean, I will get annoying noises and hiss. It's not the amp, it's the power supply in the walls. No such problems with the Bighead since it has 5 hours battery life and/or you can power it by USB or with an iphone charger while you play.

I'm thinking a dry sound might be good for my chops, but maybe that's too much in the hair shirt direction ;-)

TBH I could probably use my AER, but I like the idea of something small and portable and battery powered. I'll check out the Phil Jones...

[mr. beaumont]

I think I might try out the Joyo at a big box store and then bring my amp down to a small shop that does amp work. I like the sound of the amp, it is full bodied for what it is. However, I just want more room on the treble side to capture the chime I get acoustically. I've finally graduated to the treble side of jazz, and boy is it hard to get that going and still sound full toned and smooth.

.

Not tough if you buy a tele

[zigzag]

The electric guitars I play don't put out much sound unplugged, so I don't really see the point. Plus, I love the sweet sounds played thru an amp. Not too long ago, I rented a furnished apartment for about six months when transitioning to a house, so I played thru a Cube 80XL and a set of headphones; not a bad way to go.

[Marty Grass]

I find it is much harder to practice with an amp and a metronome. The cruelest of all is to record at the same time.

I also practice around the house and have plenty of acoustic time. I can't hear my slop nearly as well. Amplified, especially with a single coil and a trebly tone, is stark and unforgiving. To me, it is essential.

[max chill]

I always use an amp, because my sound is drenched in reverb and tremolo. Can't really pull that off without an amp. I hate it when everyone says I sound like Pops Staple.

[Jabberwocky]

...I am considering a headphone amp.

I bought a VOX Amplug Classic Rock recently for practice. It has a surprisingly nice clean tone at 3.5 Volume, 5 Gain. I feed it into a pair of computer loudspeakers. It does not get very loud at all. I have to turn my guitar volume knob to 10. I can hear my archtop acoustically over the amped tones. That is how loud it gets or not.

With headphones on, it gets loud enough for practice without hurting your ear-drums.

It sounds very much like the solid-state small amplifier that it is. As long as you don't have high expectations of it as Marshall-in-your-pocket, it is serviceable as a practice amp.

Check it out.

(I got the BASS and AC30 Amplugs too. The BASS module has very good rubbery tone in the lower registers. It appears to be recessed in the midrange though. I can hear the high frequencies but they are slightly attenuated with respect to the bass. They are not rolled off but the bass notes come through more prominently, with more energy. As for the VOX AC30 Amplug, I am still trying to dial it in.)

[Shadow of the Sun]

I'm pretty sure Wes never practised without plugging in.

And if it was good enough for Wes, it's probably good enough for the rest of us.

[jazzguy100]

some common sense...if you cant hear clearly unplugged your just gonna pick louder and itll become habit so when you plug in...thwrraaapppp

[DanielleOM]

Might want to hear what Johnny Smith has to say at 26:52.

[Irez87]

Might want to hear what Johnny Smith has to say at 26:52.

James Chirillo said a very similar thing about technique without an amp.

He said that you need to learn to shape your tone without an amp so that you can control your sound before it becomes electrified. He approached tone control like Segovia.

I still use a gemstone pick to shape my tone. When I first got the pick, my tone was shit. James HATED the sound of that pick. Now, after practicing with it acoustically for at least 5 years, I know how to control the pick. I warmed up next to another musician at a local jam session and he was very surprised at the sound I got. He said it sounded very warm and bell like. That came from years and years of playing scales very slow (quarter note at 60 bpm) and I still play that slow when I really want to shape my tone. I also know exactly what I want to sound like.

I want to mix Johnny Smith's tone with David Russell and John William's. I want every sound out of my instrument to be purposeful. So, it will either be bell like and beautiful, or gritty and popping. Everything is controlled by my inner ear. When I play and a note doesn't sound the way I want, I will play that note over and over until it sounds round again (in the shed, not on stage). I will even raise the action on my bridge to effect the sustain and fullness of certain notes on the neck.

Like I said, I am a tone fanatic. So speed, whatever that speed is, must conform to that sound I have in my head. So when I hear comparisons to Pat Metheny, after years of shaping my tone almost like a sax player plays long tones, I get pissed. I know it's not something to take personally, but I put a lot of years into that sound.

Neatomic told me once that I have more of an early/ late bebop sound, but I gotta get more movement in my lines. That's what I want to hear, and that is exactly what I am trying to do on the instrument.

[destinytot]

Really? Hmmmm.... The 60 is definitely a step up from the Alpha.... Will seriously consider this...

I really like the Bose L1 Compact PA, but I've just ordered an AER Compact-3 because it's so easy to carry around.

Doesn't the Alpha have a headphone output? I practise without an amp, but I find that feature really useful for preparing for gigs. I have one on an Evans RE200. The preamp is made by Bose (I think), and I love how it sounds through a Polytone, but I'm probably only going to use the Evans as a headphone amp now.

The AER is definitely a compromise; my ideal sound is valve/tube (I'd like to have one made), but I decided to put portability over sound for practical reasons to do with health and lifestyle. (I shudder at the thought of driving to gigs now, but I get a huge amount of satisfaction from local scenery and colour - I actually enjoy going by tram.)

I can get a really nice sound from my main guitar (Sonntag Augusta) through AER, but not from my Ibanez (from which I want more brightness/treble) - but this pedal looks ideal:

Why the hell would you want an AER, when most of the tone choices you list are tube sounds?

AER's are totally overrated for electric guitar sounds, imho.

Go on amazon and spend 30 bucks on a Joyo American sound (or spend a little more on a tech 21 blonde)

Try that before doing anything drastic.

EDIT The Joyo American sound is available locally, and it's actually cheaper than online - so I'm going to try it out (and, if I like it, pick one up) today.

[Marty Grass]

I'm pretty sure Wes never practised without plugging in.

And if it was good enough for Wes, it's probably good enough for the rest of us.

Hmm. I don't know about that. You may be right, but I've read that he practiced with his thumb so as not to disturb others in his home. If that's true, plugging in would make no sense.

[Reg]

Hey Destiny... I've been using the AER 60 for a while now... I also use a PreSonus Tubeprev2... I keep it velcroed on top, fits in bag with amp. Really gives warmer tone... fatter sound up top, much like tube amps... well it is a tube pre amp.

Sound is still very clean and bright... which is what I need, I tend to play lots of notes etc...

Back to topic... if I couldn't perform on an acoustic.... personally I would have difficulty calling myself a guitarist.

It gets back to basic references... technique developed from acoustic playing is more natural to what the instrument is.

Playing solid body style guitars through amps, is a different style of playing. Not good, bad etc... just different. I've found it was easy to transition from acoustic playing to electric playing.

I guess if your just using the amp to give volume to your guitar sound, not change the sound, there's not that much difference. Your articulations etc... are still basically the same.

But if your working on your performance skills... which generally involves louder sound and in group settings, you need to have playing through an amp skills together. It's just like working on guitar techniques, it take practice.

[destinytot]

Thanks for the tip about the PreSonus Tube Pre V2, Reg! I'm going to pick one up in a couple months.

[mrcee]

I think I might try out the Joyo at a big box store and then bring my amp down to a small shop that does amp work. I like the sound of the amp, it is full bodied for what it is. However, I just want more room on the treble side to capture the chime I get acoustically. I've finally graduated to the treble side of jazz, and boy is it hard to get that going and still sound full toned and smooth.

Like I said before, my models are Chuck Wayne and Johnny Smith as well as John Williams and David Russell. JS was on to something when he said his role models were Django, CC, and Segovia.

It seems like the better I'm playing the more treble I like. When I'm warming up or just phoning it in I go for a darker sound.

I always play plugged in but in the past I'd practice a lot unplugged. I used to play an old Gibson LG 1 flat top quite a bit and that helped my tone. When I used to play the sax I would practice long tones with dynamics, in time. I'd increase the volume (starting from silence), in time, for four bars and then decrease it for four bars. Too bad there's no way to do that on a guitar.

[Gilpy]

I almost never plug in at home. I pick up a guitar many times a day and don't want to be confined to the area where the amp is. I play hollow bodies and love the pure sound of string and wood.

But I agree that practicing with an amp is a good thing. And when I've got a rock gig I'll spend some time with the amp because it's such an important part of that sound.

[destinytot]

The Joyo American sound is available locally, and it's actually cheaper than online - so I'm going to try it out (and, if I like it, pick one up) today.

Just what I wanted for the Ibanez - THANK YOU, Jeff/MrB! Very quick A/B:

[christianm77]

Just what I wanted for the Ibanez - THANK YOU, Jeff/MrB! Very quick A/B:

Are you Benson picking there? Sounds snappy....

Glad you like you new toy ;-)

[lawson-stone]

Iilawson-stone's response is almost verbatim a Wes Montgomery interview.

….

Cool! You mean Wes Montgomery agrees with me! That clearly is why he was so great!

Where's that interview? I'd love to read it.

[destinytot]

Are you Benson picking there? Sounds snappy....

Glad you like you new toy ;-)

Thanks, Christian - yes, I love the new toy!

These wise words from Reg point to why I love it:

But if your working on your performance skills... which generally involves louder sound and in group settings, you need to have playing through an amp skills together. It's just like working on guitar techniques, it take practice.

Truth time: I know (personally) more individuals - and groups (of individuals!) - who (imo) typically play loud and badly, in a variety of 'jazz' styles, than who typically play loud and well. But Iknow numerous groups who (imo) play loud and well - in assorted (non-jazz) dance styles.

(Stevebol's posts are what got me thinking about why this matters - so much so that I've been listening to Cameo songs daily every morning for months now, and scrutinising their lyrics, too.)

But what's my point? Well, it's that my new toy will give me a tone to cut through volume when I need it - and I recognise that my assumptions about volume were wrong.

This is partly because I see these matter-of-fact pearls as a recipe for and a gateway to... instant catharsis and renewal:

performance skills... which generally involves louder sound and in group settings

But it's mostly that I now see any misgivings I have as being not so much about volume as they are about taste (as I define it).

And yes, I'm Benson picking - only on my little Ibanez (but I love it).

(I'm using a more standard grip with a D'Andrea Pro-Plec on my 18" Sonntag Augusta, and also on my little trusty Godin 5th Ave acoustic in Marty Grosz's tuning.)

[Cunamara]

I only use an amp at rehearsals and gigs most of the time because I don't want to annoy my wife any more than I already do in so many other ways. Let's just say I got the better end of the deal when we got married. But if I have some time when she isn't home I will plug in for a bit. I don't feel a strong need to practice with an amp because I am either playing an archtop or a semi-hollow, so I can hear them fine.

[pingu]

i've found myself practicing on an acoustic
with long scale and fat neck with highish action ...

then playing out on an easier to handle
ibanez box , the transition either way is fine after a minute or so ....

[gggomez]

Lawson-stone

i love it when he says he is not a guitarist he is a musician. Guitarists spend too much time talking about their equipment. Easy to say perhaps when you carry an L5 around. Such a humble dude always smiling.