How do I gain the speed to pick blazingly fast?

[MarkRhodes]

that old myth is nothing but a myth perpetuated by pipe smoking jazz intellectuals.

It is MUCH harder to play clean with OD than without. The string muting and need for accuracy in muting is MUCH greater with OD.

This is not a myth, period. Lots of metal players---who are by definition NOT pipe smoking jazz intellectuals---encourage students to practice with a clean tone to gauge their accuracy. I mentioned Stetina's book (-which is not the work of a pipe smoking jazz intellectual). Eddie Van Halen once said in a guitar mag interview that he didn't even plug his guitar in when practicing at home: that's by definition a clean tone.

I agree that learning how to mute with distortion is easier said than done but it is not the same thing as learning to play accurately in the first place. All of the super-fast metal / rock players talk about accuracy coming before speed. And playing with a clean tone allows you to hear how accurate you are (or aren't). You may disagree with this advice but it is a commonplace of hard rock / metal guitar teaching.

[mr. beaumont]

Distortion hides sins if you don't know what mistakes sound like.

High Gain amplifies everything...it's just that most folks can't hear a muffed note with all that fuzz...but it "hides" nothing. If you hear somebody play really clean with high gain it becomes VERY apparent.

So I'd say it's easier to hear mistakes clean, but a high gain tone is actually less forgiving.

[3625]

That harder/easier thing with OD is IMO referring to two distinct concepts

1/ it's harder to mute with OD cause it's akin to holding an active chainsaw

2/ yet it's easier in the sense that you don't have to expend as much energy to actually sound the note - so you can use a lighter touch and the amp is responsive to that.

So easier to shred with a light touch compared to clean, yet it takes more effort to mute.

[srlank]

Here's another take on playing fast: Pebber Brown and his version of Sarod picking.

This ain't jazz----I"m not saying the guy can't play jazz but this ain't jazz---but it is blazingly fast... Note that around the 2:30 mark he plays with his left-hand thumb UNDER the neck; don't see a lot of that....

interesting Mark....

Here's one of his earlier videos where he discusses a technique that I believe is called "scalpel" picking.......starts with a cleaner, jazzier example. The movement originates from the thumb, but in another video, he states that it is not circle picking

[Vladan]

Couple of things, from my experience:

- It's much easier to play fast with OD and delay, not because it hides mistakes, but because it evens out picked, hammered, pulled off and slightly to fully muted notes. It boils down to using less force and, well, hiding some mistakes.
While that can make me sound better than I am, it prevents me for really knowing what I am doing, as I can fall in the trap of believing I played some notes technically OK, which I did not and that's why, IMO, mentioned people recommend practicing without it.

- Mistakes that are more obvious with OD and delay are accidental "double stops" and parasite ringing strings and notes. Boils down to effective muting. Muted scratches and such, actually add to sense of speed if are light enough and rhythmically correct while not being wrong in tonal domain.

I see opinions are different, for those who think mistakes are more obvious with OD, maybe, because in jazz such tricks as muffled sounds, implied notes from mutes and scratches, and so on, are played with ultra clean and trebleless sound, when technique is applied with OD, where treble is flying around, it becomes overly exaggerated?

- Better players play with more definition, but lack of definition is not (always) (perceived as) a mistake. This goes for both the player and his audience.

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Now something re this last PB clip (the previous one I still have to watch):

I totally do not get this Thumb/ Index Action talk, nor do I see what he is doing?!
Is he extending and contracting both fingers, from all joints at the same time, or he is doing that with the Thumb only while flexing the Index in middle joint, or what?
He mentioned a pencil, drawing, writing, whatever, but I can not see that move, at least not as the way I draw, or write.
Further, he keeps saying it's not from the wrist, and when he actually did pick fast and across the strings, It looked like it was from the wrist.

I'm obviously missing something.

I remember watching one HM shredder explaining how he does it by flexing his thumb joint. I could not understand that one either, but it looked
somewhat similar to this.

[srlank]

It appears that he starts adding the "sarod" picking after he builds up the motion with the thumb. But here is another video where he shows some better angles with the thumb motion.

It's weird though...I took some Sarod lessons a couple of years back (was interested in Indian music), and the picking wasn't anything like is shown. I guess like the guitar, there are multiple ways to play.

[MarkRhodes]

That harder/easier thing with OD is IMO referring to two distinct concepts

1/ it's harder to mute with OD cause it's akin to holding an active chainsaw

2/ yet it's easier in the sense that you don't have to expend as much energy to actually sound the note - so you can use a lighter touch and the amp is responsive to that.

So easier to shred with a light touch compared to clean, yet it takes more effort to mute.

Yes! I think that's exactly right.

[Vladan]

Thanks Srlank.

Much clearer now. Well, for one thing, if I'd to go that way, I would not have to change pick angle as I hold it, but it seams I cross the strings in opsite direction. My downstroke goes towards the bridge, while his goes towards the neck (my way is with much more of wrist movement), so to say. My way is way less efficient, since the pick glides over the string much longer than his way. And so on. Seams worth investigating.

[MarkRhodes]

It appears that he starts adding the "sarod" picking after he builds up the motion with the thumb. But here is another video where he shows some better angles with the thumb motion.


It's weird though...I took some Sarod lessons a couple of years back (was interested in Indian music), and the picking wasn't anything like is shown. I guess like the guitar, there are multiple ways to play.

Thanks for adding that.
I was unfamiliar with the concept of sarod picking. I had heard of initiating down strokes by un-cocking the thumb and upstrokes by cocking it back. (There's a book on right hand technique for jazz guitar that is built on that exercise; I don't think I lasted a week with it.) It's not what I'm looking to do, but might be just the ticket for some players...