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From what I have seen, sweep picking is not used much in Jazz. Other than Frank Gambale, I have not seen many Jazz greats using this technique much, except for in short bursts. I also have not seen it used much in "straight-ahead" Jazz, but rather in more fusion-type styles of Jazz.
Have any of you tried to master this technique?
Do you think it is worthwhile to learn it for Jazz, or is it just a waste of time?
Is it even a valid, effective technique to use when playing clean, as opposed to with a lot of distortion and effects the way that Frank Gambale plays?
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01-17-2014 12:49 PM
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Yes, short sweeps are used frequently by most Jazz guitarists.
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Short sweeps, yeah...Jim Hall did that a lot.
Jazz players generally like chromatic enough that a long passage of sweeping is uncommon...
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Barney Kessel had a whole thing going on with sweep picked arpeggios during his later years.
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Jimmy Bruno, Tony DeCaprio, Garrison Fewell, and other masters include sweep picking in their teachings.
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This sounds like jazz to me. Lots of little sweeps throughout and at about 3:10 he goes full Yngwie for a moment.
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There was a jazz guitarist named Django who used to sweep pick a bit. Rumour had it he was pretty good.
I hear gypsy jazz guys do it all the time.
Last edited by teok; 01-17-2014 at 05:35 PM.
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But gipsies only do sweep with downstrokes never when the play upstrokes.
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Check this Jonathan Kreisberg sweep thing he does at 6:00... its crazy awesome.. the whole set is just as amazing!!
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I use sweeping all the time in my playing. Even Wes did sweeping. I wish people didn't generalize so much. Jazz is not *ONE* single thing and musicians are creative people. The more techniques you have in your arsenal the better you will be.
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A groove injection. Pure joy!
Originally Posted by Derekdaman
Just watching Lonnie's foot calmly play the bass line at around 10.10 while the top half of his body goes crazy.
The groove in the second track. Just killing.
Nice when jazz is fun.
Oh yeah sweeping......part of the language. Lonnie's doing his fair share of it as well!
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Of course jazz guitarists use sweeping. One guy who made it a focal point of his style was Chuck Wayne, who was one of the early bebop electric players to make his mark in the 1940s. Chuck wrote some books and had lots of students, so I'm sure his influence was well disseminated.
Aside from Wayne you can elements of sweeping in most every jazz player out there - Howard Roberts, Barney Kessel, George Benson, Joe Pass, Pat Martino - just to name a few.
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Great clips, folks! Some of those sweeps were breathtaking.
I have seen several live artists and many heavy metal guys shredders in videos "going crazy" with sweeps up and down the neck.
Frank Gambale was the first artist I observed using it heavily.
Some like to pick a larger portion of their notes like Pat Martino (at least in his early year transcriptions I have studied) while others may use a lot of legato and slurring.
My time is limited, but this thread has helped in deciding whether or not to aggressively pursue sweep picking.
The answer is a resounding "yes."
Unfortunately, I am going to have to leave my walking bass studies on the backburner for a while.
I love guitar! Its endless in so many ways the things you can do with it.
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Gotta love the guy in the orange shirt yawning in the background.
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martino actually sweeps quite a bit on arpeggios. So did Jim Hall
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Jack, Originally Posted by jzucker
I wasn't going to say anything out of respect for your great accomplishments and your own personal story of triumph (which I read with admiration), but I am an old military guy who speaks on things that he feels need to be spoke upon.
There are always going to be the poor devils like me who are hungry for Jazz information, yet have no time pursue it in the real world, despite having the luxury of a thriving Jazz scene here. All I have is the Jazz Guitar forum and my CDs, records, Mp3s, books, and DVDs and this wonderful forum to guide me.
I did not study with Pat Martino and have never played Jazz live (other with meetup groups), and heck may never because my family comes first and it is taxing.
I have found Jazz to have many camps, each full of many do's and don'ts. Like many camps, each has its own traditions - and arrogance (like in the military).
I have only seen and heard sweep picking in short rakes in the Jazz (I don't get out much), and I have never seen Grant Green, Pat Martino, Wes, or any of my favorites (other than Gambale) go on a sweep picking binge like that Kriesberg guy did in the video above (what a great way to mimic a saxophone or trumpet - that was really exciting - just what I look for in music).
So to end my statement, I like to know what techniques are more relevant. For instance, all that I have read about walking bass seems to indicate it is more of a novelty to many. I did not even read much enthusiasm for it here on this forum. So guess what? I made it a lesser priority and continue to work on the basics.
I understand your passion and that of others but just bear with those who are trying to get a feel for what people are thinking, even if you interpret it to be a "generalization." It will save you some unneeded angst.
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thanks for writing. My point is that there is more to sweeping than the gross displays of grandiose technique that gambale is known for. Martino and Wes used sweeping on arpeggios as a regular part of their playing along with slurs and other legato techniques. It's just part of the lexicon. I think sweeping got a bad name from the '80s when Frank Gambale was wearing a bad wig and leather pants with aerobic girls dancing in the background but the techniques are able to be utilized in more subtle ways.
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Hi AlsoRan,
Rich Severson has a little taster video on sweep/economy picking on Youtube. Worth a look I should say.
Btw, How did you get on with the Jim Ferguson Blues Comping book? I just received mine today. Is this where you were learning about walking basslines?
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Pat Martino does sweep quite a bit. Here's a sample in the tune Joyous Lake around 2:32.
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at 1:05, this type of lick is played by every jazz guitarist. Martino had tons of these moves with sweeping.
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Sweeps are used often but I wouldn't spend too much time on them. Use as needed but not as an end in themselves like the rock shredders use them.
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Two schools of thought:
1. There is this technique (sweep picking). Let me see what sounds I can make with it.
In this case the results are driven by the method.
2. I love this sound, how the hell can I bring it to fruition.
Here, with persistence, a method will be found and is driven by the music itself.
Ever hear a horn player articulate multiple notes on one breath? I'm pretty sure you have.
Guitar and piano are percussive instruments by nature (electric guitar a bit less so).
What are our choices regarding legato phrasing?
With the left hand, we use a variety of techniques to slur notes together, to limit the number of picking articulations.
Sweep picking is simply a method for the right hand to contribute to a legato sound when changing strings.
There is of course a continuum, alternate picking is all not staccato and sweep picking is not all perfect legato,
but they are reasonable choices when exploring a path towards these extremes of melodic articulation.
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I have spent considerable time sweeping, and I am thinking of dropping the pick altogether. The one thing that keeps bugging me about sweeping is that the solos, become more about sweeping, the more you use it. I have had some disc. with frank G. on his forum about this. You subconsiously look for ways to plug it in. But sweeping in the FG sense, takes a lot of work to master, to get it down clean and even, so then you naturally want to use it all the time. One thing I mentioned to frank, is that I was concentrating more on sweeping slow, he agreed with that. that trying not to play fast every time you sweep is sort of important. Make it sound like you are not constantly looking for an opp. to plug in a technique. If you do it too much, or sacrifice the musicality for the sake of this technique, you will have people in the audience complaining, and possibly mocking your playing. don't want that. time is an issue. getting really good at sweeping does take considerable time, for most. Will you be sacrificing other aspects of guitar just to do this one thing?. That part scares me. I don't want to just start sweeping everytime I pick up a guitar. I do see this to some extent everytime I listen to just about any name player who has a rep for some sort of technique. Vic W. John M. Frank G. gotta worry about that.
Last edited by bob dullam; 01-18-2014 at 11:53 AM.
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Very good player Originally Posted by Derekdaman
It's not sweeping though. There might be a little sweeped transition in there, but it's mostly regular pull on/offs.
I'm sure most jazz guitarists use sweeping to some extent, and it's a very good thing to master. It's the only way to do fast runs with a pick at intervals that requires string shift with every note.
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anytime you are interjecting a new technique into your playing this will be true. If you truly integrate it into diatonic material including lines from bird, trane, wes, etc., it will naturally tame itself down. If you choose to wear black leather pants and a hair band, that's a choice. The technique doesn't do that. It's just a tool. Originally Posted by bob dullam
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