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I hope you will just mind your own business and stay out of mine. I am intelligent and not American. I can make my own decisions about media.
Originally Posted by Spook410
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05-10-2024 05:59 AM
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There always is and always has been some kind of agenda when it comes to news. News has to sell in a capitalist country and it has to please the government in a socialist country. In addition to that, journalists and owners of a news company will promote their own bias in most cases.
And then there is education, which once again has someone's agenda attached to it. If the news and education system promote an agenda that you like, you will be pleased and think it is fair, if not you will be angry and think it is unfair. No surprises there.
We humans are part of nature and by design, are always clawing our way to survival. The strong survive and the weak perish. Same with guitars (or any industry). The strong survive and the weak perish. Fender, Gibson and Martin guitars are still strong and (mostly) still USA made. IMO, considering the competition, that is pretty damn strong.
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Erm, what socialist countries are you thinking of exactly? Do countries with an elected president of prime minister from a socialist party quality? Does the news have to be funded by the government for the above statement to apply? Originally Posted by Stringswinger
Just two examples of the latter: Nederlandse Omroep Stichting - Wikipedia and France Televisions - Wikipedia. Their public funding just means they don't get to be owned by any corporations with the obvious biases that could bring.
Concerning the NOS I have no recollection that they were any more pleasefull towards the last socialist governments we've had than towards the more recent liberal ones. The situation in France is a bit different: a big chunk of the written press is decidedly left-wing (part of what's often referred to as the well-meaning intelligentsia de gauche), but esp. in recent years the radio and TV versions have often sounded like propaganda & support channels for the government because of an utter lack of critic attitude. It'll be interesting to see if and how that changes if Le Pen or someone from her stable do win a future election.
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China, Cuba, USSR, North Korea, Vietnam all come to mind. Think about "Pravda". Originally Posted by RJVB
In addition to my earlier thoughts, right-wing authoritarian States that decide what news media is allowed to exist will also get favorable "news".
While America has always has a free press to some extent, for a period in the early days of the Republic, journalists were jailed for writing things that displeased those in power under the "Alien and Sedition" act.
I say kudos to all journalists who speak truth to power and shame to all journalists who knowingly print false and misleading (omissions and out of context information) stories to promote a political agenda. It seems to me that here in the USA, we have more of the latter than the former these days.
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Somehow I think this thread stopped having anything to do with "Guitars Amps and Gizmos" a long time ago.
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I'd call those communist rather than socialist even if their totalitarian traits have in principle little to do with communism either. We have communist parties in Europe that would (presumably) never go there if ever they came to govern. (Recent years did reveal totalitarian streaks in several countries, but that's really not a topic for this thread.) Originally Posted by Stringswinger
To veer back on topic ... did any USA guitars come to their death like USA flags tend to?
(EDIT: for you, Jim!
)
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There is no system. We have the opportunity, in education and media, to learn different viewpoints, and consider their merits. Even if we had no more than Fox, MSNBC and PBS, we would have at least three viewpoints. But in fact we have access to news media worldwide. And we can educate ourselves or learn from others. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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So.. this is your response to the question of where you are receiving the truthful and accurate media you claim to be receiving? Originally Posted by Litterick
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Think this is nuanced. Click bait is important and not losing too much money is important (e.g. Musk and Twitter). However, many of the big outlets are owned by moguls (sometimes hidden in private equity companies) who drive the political agenda with a diminished concern for profits. Bezos does not care if the Washington Post turns a profit. Just that it has an audience. Murdoch has both made money and promoted an agenda by recognizing the power of political and religious confirmation bias. Something emulated by the likes of MSNBC on the left. And then there are the those that run PBS and NPR who are not constrained by profit (or anything else) in promotion of their agendas. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
I think we have it a lot better in the west. We can gaze into the kaleidoscope and make some guesses. Can't imagine what the Chinese and Russians have to put up with.
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Just saying, nothing interesting to expect there. She's a fake alternative just like her father was. France has nothing to gain by losing another 20 years with her or anyone from her stable. Originally Posted by RJVB
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I don't know where you are located (the 20 years reference suggests it's not in France) but this is absolutely not true. The 2 are in different leagues. Marine is a highly intelligent woman who is not afraid to have her own ideas and is capable of expressing them extremely well too (and I don't mean just appealing to the traditional target population of populist right-wing parties). She is still tainted by her legacy but from what I understand that's changing or at least less and less justified. I can't vote in national elections here so I don't bother too much with knowing whom I'd vote for but I do think she could be a refreshing change from the currently governing party. (Or we'd end up with another period of stale mate where nothing real can be done.) Originally Posted by m_d
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True, I've been an expatriate for over two decades and now have Swiss nationality. But try as I might, it's impossible to be indifferent. You obviously don't have my political frame of reference, which is France libre / gaullist doctrine, which framed the last epoch when France was great, and is consistent with France's multisecular history and values - the last valid regime France has had. I don't care what anybody says, the Le Pens never belonged in that frame of reference and have always been fake, controlled opposition. From the right-wing political nebula of Le Pen the father (an extremely suspect character, whose political career some historians now suspect was financed by a certain foreign intelligence service I will not name here) came some of the people who attempted to kill Charles de Gaulle, on several occasions. Anyone, like Marine, wishing to remain in the EU and going along with the current regime's proclamations of "European sovereignty" having replaced French sovereignty is a fake article and I'm being extremely polite. I don't see any intelligence in Marine (since she does nothing, hardly speaks even doesn't write... all things by which it's possible to judge a politician's intelligence), no political doctrine of her own to speak of, the epitome of an opportunist, an extremely passive, spineless, borderline lazy politician. She's not ready or willing to govern, hence will do what she's told, and will betray the French, in like, a couple of weeks, and nothing will change if she's elected. Originally Posted by RJVB
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No, I definitely don't believe in a "La Fraaaaaaance" that was great anytime in recent history but rather that it's been a pays en voie de sous-developpement since I don't know when (I do share de G's opinion of the French though). The prospect of a Frexit is the only real reason why I'd prefer another alternative than any of the current batch of potential candidates I'm aware of. Originally Posted by m_d
But frankly, somehow I can't imagine anyone can have a better informed opinion about such things who is unaware that French presidents are no longer elected for 10 years (calling "fakes" and evoking greatness reminds me of a dumbo the US still hasn't rid itself of).
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I recognise a tar baby when I see one. American media is not my concern. Originally Posted by Spook410
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Originally Posted by Litterick
You said you were getting truthful information from media and that the media you were relying upon was not controlled by government and those seeking to manipulate. You were asked for the source. Yes.. I already knew it was quite likely that there was, in fact, no source. But I suppose it's always possible there's something interesting out there the rest of us haven't heard of.
You might consider the Singapore Times which is pretty good. Requires a subscription but not sure how expensive that might be. Singapore is in a unique position with strong ties to both the east and west. It's view on geopolitics is more considered than most. And their government has recently become more egalitarian. The local and regional news might be even be germane to New Zealand.
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I was reading the thread on nuts and then scrolled down here to to the nuttiest thread ever on a guitar forum...you guys should take a guitar break and then maybe study a little history, and then go back to your guitar
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What those men did was extraordinary and culminated decades later when France ranked third economy in the world. No deficit, full employment, cheapest electricity in the world. What you call "sous-développement". You misinterpret de Gaulle's opinion of the French; he certainly thought very poorly of right or left-wing decadentists and the comprador bourgeoisie... that's who he really had a grudge against, not the ordinary people. He was what today's French media and intelligentsia, whom you robotically mimick apparently, would call with disdain, a populist. You don't like greatness, but do you even know your own history - in politics, the arts, science, savoir-faire, art de vivre, thought, literature, architecture ? It's not only under your nose but imprinted all over the world, from Mexico, to Russia, to Japan, to the United States... As I said earlier, I was just in Japan ; they are in awe of the French heritage - of times when, of course, France still had a spine. They're not in awe of Marine Le Pen or the clown in chief, or any of their minions, who haven't accomplished anything, and never will. And the Japanese have a spine. Honor. They don't hate themselves. They don't hate Japan. Their culture doesn't tolerate it. They know they have come a long way - as we should, too. It was truly a breath of fresh air to see. So you, or anyone else, can mock the idea of greatness all they want, I frankly don't care. I'm not aware of any time when French presidents were ever elected for 10 years, maybe you could specify? I couldn't make sense of your Frexit sentence either. Originally Posted by RJVB
Last edited by m_d; 05-13-2024 at 12:35 AM.
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I think you mean the Straits Times, which I read occasionally, but not for regional news: Singapore is a long way from New Zealand. Originally Posted by Spook410
I read widely, but I am not willing to provide a reading list for you to critique. I dislike your condescending tone and your bad faith: "Yes.. I already knew it was quite likely that there was, in fact, no source."Last edited by Litterick; 05-12-2024 at 09:47 PM.
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Originally Posted by Litterick
Condescending.. yes.. that's certainly true. Bad faith asking for a source.. not really. What if you had actually had a source? Stranger things..
And yes Ricko.. enough rabbit hole. I'll go make a few guitar posts on a political forum as penance.
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Interesting views and you are certainly an articulate writer. Seems that French (and all European) art, culture, and political influence was bound to change to a massive degree post WW2 as this also roughly corresponded to the end of world wide empires with the wealth and influence those entailed. Not that I'm going to engage on this as some find it aggravating on a guitar forum.. but the posts on French politics and culture have been instructive. Originally Posted by m_d
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They're justified in considering it's aggravating and I will stop. In case of any misunderstanding I don't believe being born French, or this or that, makes anybody superior. A core (not exclusively) French idea is that dignity and possibility are inherent in everyone. I also know times have changed. We need to reinvent ourselves - while honoring a rich and complex cultural and historical continuum. But I have no patience left for things like self-hate as a national passtime, political naïveté or the denigrating of our historical figures (in the same way as in the US or England, as far as deconstructivism may go, Washington and Churchill would be pretty much out of bounds). And thank you for your words and patience. Back to guitars! Originally Posted by Spook410
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I neither know nor care what you mean by a source. It will be my pleasure never to converse with you again. Originally Posted by Spook410
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As an European, US made is as much imports as Made In Asia. There was a time when US guitars were head and shoulders above those of other countries. That time passed, at least when it comes to mass-produced instruments. The CNC machine doesn't know what continent it's on, and there's very little know how to instrument making that can't be transferred to workers in other parts of the world.
And if that's the case, then I might as well buy the one that I like best at the price point I'm willing to shop at. And there's no reason that equation come out on the side of MIA
There is still a remnant of an intangible prestige to MIA, they used to be the best and the history of popular music is largely made on MIA instruments. This is imho why for instance Gibson can charge what they can for their upper tier instruments - good instruments to be fair, not really competitively priced in the EU. But these days I'm less interested in prestige or what the Guitar Gods of yesteryear played. I want a good, solid instrument, a nice sound, low action, etc. I want functionality. And MIA is not longer the only game in that town.
Caveat: The above is about factory instruments, I don't know about custom builders
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Ahem, you mean The Straits Times, Spook. Even so, they are known to bend to the will of the People's Action Party. Not exactly a disinteresred and fair press where the politics of the island state is concerned. Originally Posted by Spook410
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The thing for jazz instruments is finding a reliable source for carved solid wood archtops with high quality hardware and electronics. This seems to remain a MIA thing. Originally Posted by Average Joe
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