Alnico 2 vs Alnico 5 tone

[Jimmy Smith]

That might give you a dark sound, not necessarily warm and round. Again, I (and many others) wish it was that simple.

What do you mean might? I've tried it, so I know it is that simple. Again with the obstinance. :P

[ruger9]

The obstinance is just strange to me. 'I want a warm, dark, round sound.' Ok, wire in a $5 200k volume pot. Job done. But they will not do it lol.

Or even, "turn your tone pot down". I get it. But when people are first beginning this "learning journey" of music gear mods and tweaks, sometimes they have to learn the hard way, I certainly did at times over the years. But that's how you learn sometimes. And that's OK. And sometimes that journey, tho expensive, can be fun! I've had alot of fun (and frustration) swapping pickups over the years! LOL

These days, I actually am at a point where I'm done modding. If a guitar or amp doesn't sound good enough to buy, it certainly doesn't sound good enough to buy and mod. You can't turn a tele into a Les Paul with a couple of humbuckers. Or a Gretsch into an ES-125 with a neck P90. I usually try to steer people towards that mindset, if they are looking for some crazy change. But yeah, you want it a little warmer? Turn down the treble on the amp, or the tone on the guitar, lower K volume pot helps a little. Sure, you could try a different pickup... but be careful to not waste too much time and money, when you might have the wrong guitar or amp for the sound you want.

[jorgemg1984]

What do you mean might? I've tried it, so I know it is that simple. Again with the obstinance. :P

Any clips that show your warm, dark, round tone?

[DawgBone]

A3? Nah... it's still unmistakably pole magnet/telecaster sounding. Bar magnets (P90s) are a whole 'nuther thing. (Plus, with a P90 you've got a larger bobbin which changes the magnetic field and now we're getting into physics LOL). I've read alot about the first telecasters ("Broadcaster" then "Nocaster"), and alot of them were A3. They had more balls than later models of the telecaster. People especially liked the A3 bridge pickup as it was rounder than A5 that fender eventually moved to. I think alot of the after-market "Broadcaster" pickups are A3.

Think about it: Fender was looking for "clean" tones. The tweeds were mid heavy. The browns/blondes were more neutral. Then with the blackface amps they went scooped. All in an effort to get cleaner. Same for the pickups: A3 is more mid-heavy, A5 is more scooped.

Interesting post.

I have a 10 percent overwound Biltoft HS-90 that I bought with all the sets of magnets he has available. The best combo I found was an A3 and an A5 in that pickup before yanking it out because I like the compression of a humbucker better. I tried A2, A2/A5, A3, A3/A5, and A5 before going back to the A3/A5. Never did get to the ceramic 8's but the A3/A5 indeed had a rounder or softer attack less inclined to harshness in the highs while maintaining the note definition pretty well. Even though I didn't keep it in a guitar, hey I only got two, it was an interesting experiment.

All this stuff is so insanely variable which makes it all a guessing and testing game then you get guys who throw the "it's gotta be ROUGH CAST" into the magnet equation. Pretty much why I always fall back on the 57's cause experimenting is too much money and too time consuming if you are going through a dozen pickups....especially in an ES haha.

[jorgemg1984]

Or even, "turn your tone pot down". I get it. But when people are first beginning this "learning journey" of music gear mods and tweaks, sometimes they have to learn the hard way, I certainly did at times over the years. But that's how you learn sometimes. And that's OK. And sometimes that journey, tho expensive, can be fun! I've had alot of fun (and frustration) swapping pickups over the years! LOL

These days, I actually am at a point where I'm done modding. If a guitar or amp doesn't sound good enough to buy, it certainly doesn't sound good enough to buy and mod. You can't turn a tele into a Les Paul with a couple of humbuckers. Or a Gretsch into an ES-125 with a neck P90. I usually try to steer people towards that mindset, if they are looking for some crazy change. But yeah, you want it a little warmer? Turn down the treble on the amp, or the tone on the guitar, lower K volume pot helps a little. Sure, you could try a different pickup... but be careful to not waste too much time and money, when you might have the wrong guitar or amp for the sound you want.

I've often found the turn the tone pot trick to be a "jazz shortcut" that produces more mud than any anything else.

[ruger9]

Any clips that show your warm, dark, round tone?

ok, you need to drop this one now. He's tried to help you... you DID come here looking for advice from people with more experience than you, right? I mean, why else would you ask?

[ruger9]

Interesting post.

I have a 10 percent overwound Biltoft HS-90 that I bought with all the sets of magnets he has available. The best combo I found was an A3 and an A5 in that pickup before yanking it out because I like the compression of a humbucker better. I tried A2, A2/A5, A3, A3/A5, and A5 before going back to the A3/A5. Never did get to the ceramic 8's but the A3/A5 indeed had a rounder or softer attack less inclined to harshness in the highs while maintaining the note definition pretty well. Even though I didn't keep it in a guitar, hey I only got two, it was an interesting experiment.

All this stuff is so insanely variable which makes it all a guessing and testing game then you get guys who throw the "it's gotta be ROUGH CAST" into the magnet equation. Pretty much why I always fall back on the 57's cause experimenting is too much money and too time consuming if you are going through a dozen pickups....especially in an ES haha.

100%. As has been said, the "different magnet" thing only really applies if all else stays the same... which is exactly what you can do with those Biltofts! He's a genius on that feature.

[ruger9]

I've often found the turn the tone pot trick to be a "jazz shortcut" that produces more mud than any anything else.

I tend to agree, it works better on some guitars than others. So that brings you to lower the resistance value of the volume pot, or start trying other pickups. It's a fun/frustrating journey if you take it! You could also try an EQ pedal, but I don't get on with those things. I've tried lol. I just don't like 'em. Amp EQ is one thing, but I'm just not a fan of EQ pedals (plenty of people love them tho)

[jorgemg1984]

ok, you need to drop this one now. He's tried to help you... you DID come here looking for advice from people with more experience than you, right? I mean, why else would you ask?

Ruger, I'm not the OP. I'm not seeking help, and if I was it certainty wouldn't be from that specific poster. I just think that when you regularly do posts where you're selling simple truths as hard facts, you need to back them up. And it's funny these posts always end when you ask for a clip - it's important that the OP learns these posts should not be taken seriously, since moderation here is too scarce.

[jorgemg1984]

I tend to agree, it works better on some guitars than others. So that brings you to lower the resistance value of the volume pot, or start trying other pickups. It's a fun/frustrating journey if you take it! You could also try an EQ pedal, but I don't get on with those things. I've tried lol. I just don't like 'em. Amp EQ is one thing, but I'm just not a fan of EQ pedals (plenty of people love them tho)

Yeah, on my part I'm a huge fan of eq pedals They solve many problems for cheap.

[DawgBone]

100%. As has been said, the "different magnet" thing only really applies if all else stays the same... which is exactly what you can do with those Biltofts! He's a genius on that feature.

He is, and he gives credit to other makers where it is due. And he is a nice guy to deal with. Thorough, reputable, very fairly priced, and has a quick turnaround. There are a few more pickups I want to try in the next year or two and a Biltoft Humbucker is definitely among those because of the magnet swapability.

[Jimmy Smith]

And it's funny these posts always end when you ask for a clip.

What was that? This is some of my crappy playing of a vamp, I'm a B3 player, not a guitarist. This is with an 100k volume pot full up, and the no load tone is also full up so it is out of the circuit. It is recorded with a condenser mic which is brighter and more transparent than a dynamic mic. The pup also happens to be a 59 with an A2 in it.

[jorgemg1984]

What was that? This is some of my crappy playing of a vamp, I'm a B3 player, not a guitarist. This is with an 100k volume pot full up, and the no load tone is also full up so it is out of the circuit. It is recorded with a condenser mic which is brighter and more transparent than a dynamic mic. The pup also happens to be a 59 with an A2 in it.

Ok, I would not consider that a full, warm, round tone. At all. But others might think differently, and take your advice into consideration.

[Jimmy Smith]

That's max bright for the guitar lol. I set up the controls to have some upper range and still be able to chirp a tad but while being smoky. If you want it warmer, simply roll off the tone a tad or eq the amp warmer. It was also recorded with a condenser mic which is way brighter than a dynamic mic.

[PDeville]

What was that? This is some of my crappy playing of a vamp, I'm a B3 player, not a guitarist. This is with an 100k volume pot full up, and the no load tone is also full up so it is out of the circuit. It is recorded with a condenser mic which is brighter and more transparent than a dynamic mic. The pup also happens to be a 59 with an A2 in it.

That was a nice warm tone. That's a Strat? What amp are you using?

Thanks for posting.
PD

[Jimmy Smith]

Thx. The amp was a Peavey Classic 20 played thru a lil 8 inch open back cab. The guitar was a warmoth hardtail strat.

[Cunamara]

What do you mean might? I've tried it, so I know it is that simple. Again with the obstinance. :P

No mirrors in your house, Jimmy?

[Jimmy Smith]

Wat!

[Hep To The Jive]

What was that? This is some of my crappy playing of a vamp, I'm a B3 player, not a guitarist. This is with an 100k volume pot full up, and the no load tone is also full up so it is out of the circuit. It is recorded with a condenser mic which is brighter and more transparent than a dynamic mic. The pup also happens to be a 59 with an A2 in it.

I would not call it a warm rounded tone either. It sounds like a guitar directly into mixing console with no preamps or anything and all EQ flat. If that's how it sounds through the amp and that's what you're going for... well all right then

Speaking of getting your tone calibrated through a 'knowledgeable' tone gurus it also depends. What you hear in your head is not necessarily what you think it is. I recently modded my tele for two humbuckers, and I the neck one I was very happy with SD Jazz right away, but the bridge I got JB and i didn't like it. I always thought this swamp ash thinline tele needed more mid oriented pickups, and i tried a few and didn't sound like what i hear in my head, So then i thought maybe i'm all wrong and should go a different direction. And boom, SD 59 in the bridge instantly had the sound I was looking for, and it's mid scooped! The lesson is trial and error is only way to go unfortunately. 'Cos it cost $$!

[voyage]

John, can you say what pickups the aA2 and the A5 were?
For example, a Seymour Duncan 59 or?

[Greywolf]

I have both in my Heritage H535 LTD the neck is AlNiCo 5 , the Bridge 2 . both seymour duncans . Great combo as the warmer 2 softens the bridge a bit to a for me more usable tone.

[GuyBoden]

It's easy and inexpensive to swap magnet type, especially with pickups with no covers.

Magnet Change.

Tone Change.

[garybaldy]

I've never compared them side to side but I was looking for a mellow Telecaster neck pickup a few years back, I settled on SD Alnico 2 pro. The alnico 2's had the reputation of having a softer treble sound and warmer tone overall. It didn't disappoint.

I have the same in the neck position of my '88 Am. Std. Tele. The original fender was microphonic. At the time (around '96) I got it for country. It's a great pickup. The original bridge pickup is very good.
Interestingly, with the SD, I had to wire the ground to hot and the hot to ground to avoid OOP. Luckily no noise issues though!

[garybaldy]

A3? Nah... it's still unmistakably pole magnet/telecaster sounding. Bar magnets (P90s) are a whole 'nuther thing. (Plus, with a P90 you've got a larger bobbin which changes the magnetic field and now we're getting into physics LOL). I've read alot about the first telecasters ("Broadcaster" then "Nocaster"), and alot of them were A3. They had more balls than later models of the telecaster. People especially liked the A3 bridge pickup as it was rounder than A5 that fender eventually moved to. I think alot of the after-market "Broadcaster" pickups are A3.

Think about it: Fender was looking for "clean" tones. The tweeds were mid heavy. The browns/blondes were more neutral. Then with the blackface amps they went scooped. All in an effort to get cleaner. Same for the pickups: A3 is more mid-heavy, A5 is more scooped.

I believe the early Gibson P90s were A3. Not sure about the very early slug magnet version though.

[garybaldy]

You can't turn a tele into a Les Paul with a couple of humbuckers.

Believe it or not, I got pretty damn closed with my standard Tele (no HBs) through a Korg G3 multifx and a Musicman 65RP! I was Paul Kossoff! That was 30 years ago. Now I use an LP std but I don't sound like PK!