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I have just thrown my guitar across the room.
There is (was) something rattling on the inside. It is a new(ish) Yamaha classical guitar with in built piezo pickup system.
These in built systems seem to be so unreliable.
Next weekend is the upcoming jazz gig again and I want to use a classical guitar amplified. Yet I also have little faith in microphones and relying on a cheap house PA with no-one to operate it properly.
I may just have to take my ibanez GB and Roland amp up.
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11-19-2023 10:39 AM
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Man, chill out. It’s just music, no need to get so frustrated you throw a guitar.
There’s a time to push through and a time to take a break.
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Welcome! I’m having a little trouble understanding your distress. I’ve had many flattops with onboard piezo systems of all kinds over decades, and I’ve never had a failure except once when the putty holding a transducer to the inside of the top came loose. I’ve used OEM and self-installed piezos under the saddle with 100% reliability.
Originally Posted by tiktoktodd
I’ve been an active pro for over 60 years, so I’ve spent a lot of time with a lot of guitar players. I’ve heard many common complaints, but reliability of piezo systems is not among them. I’ve had electrical / electronic issues with standard pickups and switching, but never with a piezo.
As I recall, most of the piezo-equipped guitars I’ve had rattled when I shook them. My current flattop favorite is an Ibanez 7 string with a piezo. When I shake it, there’s a rattle that I suspect is from one or more of the wires inside. This causes no problems and is not a reliability issue. In fact it’s not an issue at all as long as I don’t twirl it around while playing it quietly in a silent room with mics around me. When I first encountered this, I took out the slack in the wiring by looping it and holding the loops with small nylon wraps. But I stopped doing that when I realized that it could put strain on connections and cause one to come loose.
Are you having problems with the system, or is the rattle the only thing bothering you?
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Yes, these things can be very annoying. Rattles and buzzes happen with many types of guitars. Just takes some patience and a systematic approach to find the culprit, but they can all be fixed. I have a small repair shop in Southern, CT. I’d be happy to take a look if your nearby.
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Is it rattling outside now? Originally Posted by tiktoktodd
I've had a Cordoba (brand now owned by Yamaha btw) that also had a number of buzzes bordering on rattles and that I considered throwing across the room several times (instead, I sold it through consignment at the store where I bought it). The ones not due to the numerous incompletely seated frets were all due to the barndoor Fishman Presys Blend preamp.
- the latch buzzed. Solved with a sliver of thin packaging foam.
- the trap door itself rattled in the frame. Solved with multiple layers of microphone tape
- without battery or without carefully installing a battery the springs in the compartment rattled.
I think some of these noises would have been audible acoustically to anyone nearby, and they should at least have been picked up microphone installed on the preamp housing itself.
It's not just piezo systems that cause this (and not all do). My Loar archtop also has recurrent buzzes that are due to cables from the floater touching the top, or the fingerrest. I managed to make a loop in the internal cable that goes to the endplug but I also heard that one buzzing against one of the plates before.
Our hearing may simply still be too good... Periodically I'll also get annoyed by buzzing in the lowest 2 strings that probably comes from the winding interacting with the saddle, somehow.
I remember having my violin luthier hunt down minute buzzes, him complaining that everyone seems to be doing that, and me explaining again and again that you can't unhear those issues once you've noticed them...
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These are objects designed to vibrate, ergo they will rattle sometimes.
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This is a Yamaha transacoustic CG-TA. The other day it powered down mid song when I know the batteries were ok.
I bought new batteries anyway and replaced the strings as a string had snapped. Now there is a buzz from inside when the open G is plucked. it is not fret buzz or stringends or tuners. It sounds under the saddle.
Last month at the jazz gig my new Lag hyvibe sounded terrible. It was a variety of reasons why. Hence why I dont want to post a clip of the event.
I have used my Philip Woodfield classical guitar miked up before, to success. But it a very expensive instrument and I think i was lucky the microphone and PA was working ok that night.
Like I say i'll take my Ibanez and JC-40 but it not what I wanted.
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filling it with expanding foam would resolve it. And stop feedback.
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Do I recall that was a Fusion? Originally Posted by RJVB
Is it rattling outside now?
I've had a Cordoba (brand now owned by Yamaha btw) that also had a number of buzzes bordering on rattles and that I considered throwing across the room several times (instead, I sold it through consignment at the store where I bought it). The ones not due to the numerous incompletely seated frets were all due to the barndoor Fishman Presys Blend preamp.
I like my Cordoba Stage, and if you’re going to amplify playing a non-classical type of music, i.e., jazz fingerpicking, I would recommend it. Mine has no quality issues I’ve noticed.
The preamp is described thus: “At the heart of the guitar is the revolutionary Stage Pickup System paired with a solid, fully chambered body for reduced weight and enhanced resonance, and a robust, tonal foundation. Equipped with easy-to-access Volume, EQ, and Body Blend knobs the Stage Pickup System allows players to dial in their preferred acoustic tone. Co-developed with Fishman to produce Cordoba’s authentic, acoustic nylon-string tone, the Stage is revolutionary in sound and feel.”
I have an Alvarez (midrange model) that is OK, but since I got the Stage I have no interest in playing it live. The Alvarez has a typical piezo and Fishman preamp, and it is a little hard to tune in. I did have an issue with the piezo not making contact with the saddle and had to file it flatter. Also, batteries don’t last long in the Alvarez but seem to last for months in the Stage.
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Yes, it was a Fusion, and one of me pet theories is that the QC department is (was) completely focussed on the then-still-new Stage (in addition to possibly being understaffed and what not due to the Corona Circus). Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
I wonder how a classical would sound with an internal mic and a "bung" to close the soundhole as you often see on acoustics. Or a Lute Hole cover with a dense pattern.
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There's a way to find out...
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Aer 60
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I think Chet was already on it. Originally Posted by RJVB
BTW here’s a chance to buy some history—number 1 Gibson Chet ever made:
Gibson Chet Atkins Classic Custom Shop Edition 1982 - Natural | Reverb
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According to that description, it's not the first one ever made, it's just the first one made in 1982, the 7th year of production, or thereabouts.
And that's a solid-body. 11.5 lb!
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I can sympathize. In various guitars I’ve had:
1) Truss rod rattle.
2) Wires rattling inside the body. I’m looking at you, Epi Dot.
3) A pickup wire rattling against the underside of the pickup. Still looking at you, Epi Dot.
4) A P90 rattling because one of the two screws wasn’t flush to the pickup cover.
5) The pickup wire inside my fave acoustic rattling. That one stumped me for a while.
And don’t even get me started about amp rattle.
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That looks more like a "hardly-acoustic" to me, and the Chet Atkins sound I know is the archetypical don't-wanna-sound-like-that piezo kind of sound... This guitar clearly must have individual transducers under the saddle because there's a tone wheel for each string. Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
Re: AER-60 : I got the impression the OP is looking for something not too expensive. For me that would probably exclude anything AER, even 2nd-hand. And apparently the 1st concern is going to be to find a replacement guitar...
Don't Fender do a Nyloncaster?
Or find a way to make the rattle part of your act
EDIT: works with a CG too...
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Just letting you know throwing the guitar hard across the room fixed the rattle.
And it seems unharmed.
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That figures. My phone once stopped rattling (on command) after I dropped it. Dropping it again fixed that ... so don't throw your guitar again! Originally Posted by tiktoktodd
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The Chet SST was a solid body acoustic-electric steel string. I think the nylon string did debut in 1982, at least according to the internet. Originally Posted by sgosnell
Gibson Chet Atkins SST - Wikipedia
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When something is not working on my wife's phone, she shakes it, as if it will clear like an Etch-A-Sketch. Originally Posted by RJVB
That figures. My phone once stopped rattling (on command) after I dropped it. Dropping it again fixed that ... so don't throw your guitar again!
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I don't really remember, it was a long time ago. All I'm going by is the Reverb description. The guitar in question, from the pictures and weight, is certainly a solid body.
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Kind of unrelated, I've noticed that a compressor helps a lot with the sensitive dynamics of solo amplified nylon string.
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I have a Barbera transducer on one of my classical guitars. It's fantastic. Barbera ultra high performance pickups for stringed instruments.
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FWIW, this high-end crossover builder lists a number of pickup methods I'd never heard of, but that seem very interesting. Combinations of multi-mic (internal) and piezo pickup designs so you can dial in the best of both worlds.
Zucali
Stephanie Jones plays one
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Please no one entrust the OP with a Hauser
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