Sadowsky laminate archtop prices: YIKES

**ccroft** · 02-18-2023, 07:45 PM

Thanks Bach, but I think I've got this niche covered with the Borys now. Not to mention being tapped out as far as new guitar purchases.

Might you be interested in my 2013 Bernie Lehmann? It'll be going to market soon.

**Woody Sound** · 02-18-2023, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by ccroft

Thanks Bach, but I think I've got this niche covered with the Borys now.

Gee, I guess so!

**Woody Sound** · 02-18-2023, 07:52 PM

Someone is asking roughly the new price for a 2004 SJH.

Granted, you don't see many in the lighter "violin burst."

Sadowsky Jim Hall 2004 Caramel Burst W/OHSC | Reverb

**ChazFromCali** · 02-18-2023, 08:16 PM

I think it's absurd to pay more than 1k usd for a jazz guitar. Just an arbitrary number on my part. But if you can't get / cobble something together for that.... otherwise it's just a bragging contest.

(looking for the hide behind the couch emoticon)

**ccroft** · 02-19-2023, 01:58 AM

Chaz... is the arbitrary number for a jazz guitar so low because there's no money in Jazz?

How much are we allowed to pay for a rock guitar? I mean...$5k is about entry level for something like a Les Paul. Or even a really good blue grass pickers flat top.

I think you need to bump your arbitrary number at least 5 fold. Unless it's tied to how much money can be made with it :-)

**Hammertone** · 02-19-2023, 03:01 AM

Originally Posted by ChazFromCali

I think it's absurd to pay more than 1k usd for a jazz guitar. Just an arbitrary number on my part. But if you can't get / cobble something together for that.... otherwise it's just a bragging contest.
(looking for the hide behind the couch emoticon)

Are you here all week? How's the veal?

**John A.** · 02-21-2023, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by ChazFromCali

I think it's absurd to pay more than 1k usd for a jazz guitar. Just an arbitrary number on my part. But if you can't get / cobble something together for that.... otherwise it's just a bragging contest.

(looking for the hide behind the couch emoticon)

Hmm, what's the absurdity benchmark for, say, a jug band kazoo or K-pop euphonium? Polka EWI? Tango shofar? I mean this is vital work you're doing here, so don't just stop with jazz/guitar. We need to know this info for EVERY genre and instrument.

**Archie** · 02-22-2023, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by John A.

Hmm, what's the absurdity benchmark for, say, a jug band kazoo or K-pop euphonium? Polka EWI? Tango shofar? I mean this is vital work you're doing here, so don't just stop with jazz/guitar. We need to know this info for EVERY genre and instrument.

Alas, even the JGF is not immune from K-pop.

**John A.** · 02-23-2023, 12:40 AM

Originally Posted by ArchtopHeaven

Alas, even the JGF is not immune from K-pop.

Only when it has euphonium. Otherwise it’s a K-Pop-free zone.

**whiskey02** · 02-23-2023, 10:20 AM

Forgive me for being bluntly honest but you guys keep complaining about the ever increasing price of guitars while you keep adding guitars to your collection. The price of Dolce and Gabbana handbags and Ferrari's keep going up but luckily, nobody needs one, or six. Stop buying shit you don't need and ignore prices. Doing this will bring prices down on shit you still don't need to buy. Just because Tiffany's offers for sale a solid gold diamond crusted soup spoon doesn't mean you can enjoy a delicious soup with a stainless steel soup vessel.
The good news is that someone who just wants to play music can get a fine playing and sounding instrument for less money than ever before (adjusting for inflation).

**John A.** · 02-23-2023, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by whiskey02

Forgive me for being bluntly honest but you guys keep complaining about the ever increasing price of guitars while you keep adding guitars to your collection. The price of Dolce and Gabbana handbags and Ferrari's keep going up but luckily, nobody needs one, or six. Stop buying shit you don't need and ignore prices. Doing this will bring prices down on shit you still don't need to buy. Just because Tiffany's offers for sale a solid gold diamond crusted soup spoon doesn't mean you can enjoy a delicious soup with a stainless steel soup vessel.
The good news is that someone who just wants to play music can get a fine playing and sounding instrument for less money than ever before (adjusting for inflation).

The purpose of the internet is to assert grievances that have no basis.

**Stringswinger** · 02-23-2023, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by John A.

The purpose of the internet is to assert grievances that have no basis.

And here I though it was about cat pictures.... Sadowsky laminate archtop prices: YIKES-blackcatclub-jpg

**Doctor Jeff** · 02-23-2023, 11:34 AM

Haven't read every post above, but I don't think it's pro or talented amateur players who have driven up the cost of guitars.

Hint: people with more money than talent.

OTOH, it's absolutely true you can get a reasonable guitar for any genre for well under $1000. The best of times, the worst of times.

**Doctor Jeff** · 02-23-2023, 11:37 AM

Even more off-topic--a guy shared a post on the Facebook Archtop group featuring part of his collection--IIRC about a dozen red 335s. With the comment, "and those are just the red ones."

I collect stuff but I like different stuff. If I have a beautifully carved mallard duck decoy (which I do) I don't look for more mallards, unless it was carved by Elmer Crowell himself.

But to each his own.

**bluejaybill** · 02-23-2023, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by John A.

The purpose of the internet is to assert grievances that have no basis.

Yes, I think we are getting into the "I can't afford a $5000 guitar so I'm going to hate on everybody who can" part of the conversation, which happens eventually on every guitar forum I've been on. To those who can't, I feel for you. There were several decades like that for me. Now after working hard all of my life I can afford a Campellone made to my specifications, and so I bought one. I did however take a pass on the diamond encrusted Tiffany soup spoon, or whatever trinket was mentioned. Oh, and my car is 6 years old and my house is nice but not that expensive.

I doubt very highly that whether or not I choose to buy a Campellone, admittedly a luxury item, has any affect on what Mark needs to get to be able to produce them. Other guitars seem overpriced to me, but that its because they are mass produced, and often poorly made. High end Gibsons and Fenders come to mind, for me anyway.

In the case of the Sadowsky, to get back to the original topic, those guitars are imported and were $4000 just a few years ago. But they are fine guitars that are carefully built, maybe the builders are of luthier quality, I don't know. But ultimately Roger is welcome to charge what he needs to get for them, or even wants to get for them. We live in a capitalist system and the government doesn't get to dictate guitar prices.

**st.bede** · 02-23-2023, 02:55 PM

Typically capitalism works well for luxury goods. Not so well for things we all need to live. If we are honest with ourselfs, it is obvious that every modern economic structure will include a mix of both what we call capitalism and what we call socialism. However a vast majority of times those words are poorly understood, completely miss used, fetishized and turned into idols.

A question about if someone should own something, is burdened by invisible externalities… no one really deals with those. However in the future some of those “externalities” very well will deal with us.

Given the zeitgeist and ortgeist, I am happy for anyone to enjoy any guitar.

**John A.** · 02-23-2023, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by bluejaybill

Yes, I think we are getting into the "I can't afford a $5000 guitar so I'm going to hate on everybody who can" part of the conversation, which happens eventually on every guitar forum I've been on. To those who can't, I feel for you. There were several decades like that for me. Now after working hard all of my life I can afford a Campellone made to my specifications, and so I bought one. I did however take a pass on the diamond encrusted Tiffany soup spoon, or whatever trinket was mentioned. Oh, and my car is 6 years old and my house is nice but not that expensive.

I doubt very highly that whether or not I choose to buy a Campellone, admittedly a luxury item, has any affect on what Mark needs to get to be able to produce them. Other guitars seem overpriced to me, but that its because they are mass produced, and often poorly made. High end Gibsons and Fenders come to mind, for me anyway.

In the case of the Sadowsky, to get back to the original topic, those guitars are imported and were $4000 just a few years ago. But they are fine guitars that are carefully built, maybe the builders are of luthier quality, I don't know. But ultimately Roger is welcome to charge what he needs to get for them, or even wants to get for them. We live in a capitalist system and the government doesn't get to dictate guitar prices.

I enjoy the spectator sport of other people buying fantastically fancy and expensive guitars, but don't participate. I could afford more than I have spent (per guitar, and number of guitars), but I just feel like this is an area where setting limits works better for me. I have good stuff that I use, all bought for a price that didn't produce any real stress. It makes no difference to me what someone else spends. It's their money and their business how to spend it.

Looked at as coldly as possible, the level of quality in fairly cheap to moderately expensive guitars is so good nowadays that almost anything "high end" is wildly overpriced compared to what people actually need in order to make music. But value is subjective and shot through with non-practical factors. It's not worth arguing about whether a guitar that costs N-times another is N-times better. To the person who bought it, it might be. To me, it might not. ¯\_(?)_/¯

**coyote-1** · 02-23-2023, 03:52 PM

I occasionally lust for a dazzling archtop with carved solid spruce and carved solid maple and floating pup etc. I don’t need a Benedetto, but an Eastman 910ce would be wonderful.

Then I remember that I already have a laminate spruce top, laminate side maple, solid maple back archtop with floating pup etc… and it sounds just fine thru an amp. And the moment of lust passes.

**NSJ** · 02-23-2023, 04:02 PM

Eventually, if I don’t’ play it, it gets sold. Unless it’s modded in such a way that no one else would want it but me. For example, I have a Gibson ES-339 that I modded thusly: (1) Jason Lollar CC in a HB route neck pickup installed, rendering the bridge pickup useless; (2) got rid of the frets; (3) replaced fingerboard with a stainless steel slab. Turned into a “sarode guitar”. I have a semi hollow guitar that I put a Fernandes Sustainer on it.

I think I’ll have a couple of nice six string guitars for sale, at some point. I intend to keep one six string, though.

Guitars I’ve bought multiple times, tried to bond with, and gave up, getting rid of them:

Gibson Howard Roberts oval hole Custom (twice)
Ibanez GB-10 (twice)
Gibson ES-175 (twice: still have the third, though. Third time’s the charm. But still may sell it).

**Woody Sound** · 02-23-2023, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff

Even more off-topic--a guy shared a post on the Facebook Archtop group featuring part of his collection--IIRC about a dozen red 335s. With the comment, "and those are just the red ones."

That's just crazy insane. (Although I must say, wen I was in college I used to go see a nice blues player who used one, great clear broad maple grain. No flame.)

**Hammertone** · 02-23-2023, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by John A.;[URL="tel:1249865"

1249865[/URL]]The purpose of the internet is to assert grievances that have no basis.

Originally Posted by Stringswinger

And here I though it was about cat pictures....

Nah, the purpose of the internet is to keep me personally amused.

**John A.** · 02-23-2023, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

The purpose of the internet is to keep me personally amused.

Is it succeeding in doing that? If not ...

**Hammertone** · 02-24-2023, 01:23 AM

QUOTE=John A.;1249973]Is it succeeding in doing that? If not ...[/QUOTE]So far so good! The key is to get a really good ergonomic chair. I use an Aeron (designed by Don Chadwick and Bill Stumpf for Herman Miller) as well as a Contessa (originally designed by Giorgetto Giugiaro for Okamura, now updated and sold by Teknion). I recommend either of them.

**John A.** · 02-24-2023, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

QUOTE=John A.;1249973]Is it succeeding in doing that? If not ...

So far so good! The key is to get a really good ergonomic chair. I use an Aeron (designed by Don Chadwick and Bill Stumpf for Herman Miller) as well as a Contessa (originally designed by Giorgetto Giugiaro for Okamura, now updated and sold by Teknion). I recommend either of them.
[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the recommendation. I find that snacks further enhance the experience.