Submarine pickup

[christianm77]

So this is a wee pickup that senses only two strings (or one if you like) at a time, so you can do stuff with them. Here a put the bottom two string through an octave pedal.

[neatomic]

very interesting pickup...

and octave divider is perfect use for it...interestingly, tal farlow added an extra pickup to one of his guitars to drive a primitive octave divider that he built himself...very old school...but was sort of attempting a similar thing


this pup makes it a lot easier...

tal talks about it in detail, in this great interview archived at the preparedguitar site-

PREPARED GUITAR: Tal Farlow Interview



cheers

[rpjazzguitar]

I've heard a hex pickup used to drive a GR33 synth. Drop the bottom two strings an octave, and rearrange your comping to play bass on those two strings. Can sound great. Requires some practice.

[christianm77]

Yeah, so I was using the Boss OC3 which is a good pedal with polyphonic setting that allowed you to add bass effect to the lower range of the guitar (Gilad Heckselman uses it), you could totally send the bass to a separate amp by fading down the direct signal an sending that to a bass amp, while sending the direct signal to a guitar amp...

Pretty awesome... but I was always frustrated with how that function faded into the guitar signal and didn't give control over exactly which strings had the bass effect - also running into problems of garbling and so on if you set the pedal slightly wrong. This new pickup allows me that control , and opens up a range of possibilities...

So I look forward to working with this. I find using this, as with the OC3 to be extremely demanding on the left hand.... Is good for me!

There's a more advanced version that is a pickup for all 6 strings and allows you control over which strings you send to one of two inputs. I didn't get it because I'd already invested in a nice Krivo pickup and plus it seems a bit crazy to use with things like Fender Teles that have such a specific electric tone.

[christianm77]

Grahambop and I both know a fella called Shane Hill (who was a student of Tal Farlow) who has a guitar strung with a bass guitar E and A that he uses for chord melody. He's developed amazing facility on it.... I tried it and it was hard to play haha! This is easier...

[neatomic]

having just the low e & a strings going thru the octave divider is going to give you much better tracking than other methods...

another use would be to use the pup under the high b & e strings with a harmonizer or doubling effect to simulate a 12 string type effect...but just on the higher jangly strings...a slight phasing effect might be nice as well

johnny smith used a roundwound set of strings but with a much heavier flatwound 58 on the low e..which he often tuned down to d...huge low note tones!!..especially whilst chording

continue to experiment!!

cheers

[grahambop]

Didn’t know Shane had a guitar set up like that, interesting. I think Tal Farlow did something with his A string down an octave.

Actually now you mention it, I think Shane might have talked about this when I saw him with Howard Alden and we were discussing 7 string guitars etc., it’s starting to ring a bell.

I’ve got one of those OC3 pedals but I am not too keen on that ‘gradual’ effect, it seems to work better on some tunes than others. I suppose it depends on the key and where the bass notes fall. I did use it on this:

[rpjazzguitar]

Having those lower notes can really make solo guitar sound full.

In a band, you end up, I guess, in Charlie Hunter territory, where you're the bassist and the guitarist. If there's a separate bass player, those low notes might tempt like poisonous fruit.

That said, Arismar Do Espirito Santo, a great Brazilian bassist and guitarist, playing bass in a jam, took a solo as follows. He kept the bass line going by tapping it with his left hand and then played a solo by tapping with his right hand, Stanley Jordan style. That was impressive.

Michael Pipoquinha, a Brazilian player, has taken the technique a little further, I think. He plays a 6 string bass. He's also a good guitar player. On bass, he plays that bass line and chord thing, but, in addition, he adds right hand percussion technique. He starts to sound like a guitar, bass and drums trio.

Bay Area guitar great Eddie Pasternak has the synth lowering the low E and A technique down. He arranges his chords and melody to move up and down the neck to accommodate the needs of the bass line.

All very impressive players covering two things at once.

[christianm77]

having just the low e & a strings going thru the octave divider is going to give you much better tracking than other methods...

another use would be to use the pup under the high b & e strings with a harmonizer or doubling effect to simulate a 12 string type effect...but just on the higher jangly strings...a slight phasing effect might be nice as well

johnny smith used a roundwound set of strings but with a much heavier flatwound 58 on the low e..which he often tuned down to d...huge low note tones!!..especially whilst chording

continue to experiment!!

cheers

Yes, it has a lot of flexibility... I have a few other ideas in mind... I'll post music when its done rather than read you the menu :-)

[christianm77]

Having those lower notes can really make solo guitar sound full.

In a band, you end up, I guess, in Charlie Hunter territory, where you're the bassist and the guitarist. If there's a separate bass player, those low notes might tempt like poisonous fruit.

Are you kidding? I'm in thin ice enough even owning this thing. I expect lots of abuse over it.

Anyway, you just don't bring the pickup to the gig. Simple. Thing comes off.

That said, Arismar Do Espirito Santo, a great Brazilian bassist and guitarist, playing bass in a jam, took a solo as follows. He kept the bass line going by tapping it with his left hand and then played a solo by tapping with his right hand, Stanley Jordan style. That was impressive.

Michael Pipoquinha, a Brazilian player, has taken the technique a little further, I think. He plays a 6 string bass. He's also a good guitar player. On bass, he plays that bass line and chord thing, but, in addition, he adds right hand percussion technique. He starts to sound like a guitar, bass and drums trio.

Bay Area guitar great Eddie Pasternak has the synth lowering the low E and A technique down. He arranges his chords and melody to move up and down the neck to accommodate the needs of the bass line..

You have to do the same thing here. It's not that much of a big deal mostly, but there's certain things I do when playing solo normally like little passages without the bass that just sound more jarring with this thing. So you have to get out of that...

Charlie Hunter says he just radically simplifies everything down. Seems good idea...

TBH I always thought the synth thing a bit gimmicky a bit like having a double bass sound on an electronic piano when they split the keyboard on a duo gig... just... a bit naff. (It was the first thing I experimented with when I tried out the Roland and then thought - I'll pass) Don't ask me why I think doing it with a pickup and a Boss pedal is any better.... I guess I'm an analogue snob!

[citizenk74]

Grahambop and I both know a fella called Shane Hill (who was a student of Tal Farlow) who has a guitar strung with a bass guitar E and A that he uses for chord melody. He's developed amazing facility on it.... I tried it and it was hard to play haha! This is easier...

Chet Atkins did a thing where he added an extra bridge behind the normal one for the bass E and A strings that he added, which replaced the normal E and A. One assumes they were lightish.

[Jim Soloway]

I first saw something like that about 25 years ago by a really good acoustic finger picker named Steven King. He had a pickup that picked up just the E and A strings and like you, ran them through an octave pedal. Hearing the power of the bass notes he was getting was amazing.