Tone Control Issue Gibson ES175 1959 VOS (single pickup)

**Eric Rowland** · 08-11-2019, 02:03 PM

The tone control acts more like a volume control on mine. Below 3 there is no sound at all, and the tone only stays bright as you turn it up. I'm having to turn the volume knob all the way up and then adjust the overall volume with the tone control. There's no way I can get a darker tone. Am I missing or not understanding something with this type of tone circuit? I am using a DV Mark Little Jazz amp and I have to turn the bass and mid up and treble way down. Thanks for any advice you may have!

**73Fender** · 08-11-2019, 02:11 PM

Is this something that occurred out of the blue or was it after working on the electronics? If you solder the connection from the volume pot to the wrong lug of the tone pot that is pretty much the symptom. I made that mistake once myself.

**KirkP** · 08-11-2019, 02:15 PM

Yes, the description suggests incorrect wiring.

**Eric Rowland** · 08-11-2019, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by 73Fender

Is this something that occurred out of the blue or was it after working on the electronics? If you solder the connection from the volume pot to the wrong lug of the tone pot that is pretty much the symptom. I made that mistake once myself.

Originally Posted by KirkP

Yes, the description suggests incorrect wiring.

I was afraid that would be the diagnosis......Thanks.

**sgosnell** · 08-11-2019, 05:55 PM

No need to be afraid. It's not difficult to fix that. Pulling the pots and reinstalling them is a pain, but it's certainly doable, and not expensive if you can't do it yourself.

**gggomez** · 08-11-2019, 11:58 PM

I believe Gibson has two wiring schemes, generally referred to as old and new.

If the wires are attached as a hybrid you can end up with this result (happened to me when I had new pick ups put in, was really peaved clearly the supposed luthier did not check his work).

As you have a 59 reissue VOS it is likely to be the old wiring (mine is a 2012 VOS and it has the traditional wiring not new).

**Eric Rowland** · 08-12-2019, 01:21 AM

The funny part of this situation is that the Gibson repair shop in Nashville did the wiring.......

**TOMMO** · 08-12-2019, 05:53 AM

Could be so-called 50s wiring where the tone pot is wired to the output of the volume control instead of parallel to the input of same....

**Gitterbug** · 08-12-2019, 07:04 AM

My 175 VOS has a different issue: the volume pot of the neck pickup is absolutely non-linear, so there's just a few degrees of turn between max. volume and hush-hush. Very difficult to adjust in action from solo to comping volume with any consistency.

**Eric Rowland** · 08-12-2019, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by Gitterbug

My 175 VOS has a different issue: the volume pot of the neck pickup is absolutely non-linear, so there's just a few degrees of turn between max. volume and hush-hush. Very difficult to adjust in action from solo to comping volume with any consistency.

Exactly, all the volume on mine is between 7 and 10 on the vol knob.....

**lawson-stone** · 08-12-2019, 02:45 PM

My 1959VOS ES175 neck pickup volume control has a very nice slope. Silent at 0, it wakes up about 1.5 or 2 and increases at a reasonable and manageable rate all the way to 10. I know mine was new from the store, and I made no modifications on it. Maybe some of these others have had pots changed or wiring modded?

**vinnyv1k** · 08-12-2019, 05:52 PM

Every VOS 59 175 I bought or tried the volume pots only worked from 7-10 and sounded bad at 7.
I basically had to leave the guitar on 10 and adjust the volume by amp or volume pedal. I played a real 1959 all original 335 that was exactly the same way. Might be a on purpose thing for the reissue 59 but doesn't work for me. I like a very gradual increase.

**pingu** · 08-12-2019, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by vinnyv1k

Every VOS 59 175 I bought or tried the volume pots only worked from 7-10 and sounded bad at 7.
I basically had to leave the guitar on 10 and adjust the volume by amp or volume pedal. I played a real 1959 all original 335 that was exactly the same way. Might be a on purpose thing for the reissue 59 but doesn't work for me. I like a very gradual increase.

my original '63 335 did that too
(but didn't sound bad on 7)

**sgosnell** · 08-12-2019, 06:20 PM

That sounds exactly like the difference between a linear and audio taper pot. Audio taper has a wider usable range, while linear taper has a much narrower range. Human hearing is not linear, it's logarithmic, so the audio taper was invented to make the volume change closer to what humans hear. It's not exact, but closer than linear taper.

**Chazmo** · 08-13-2019, 02:56 PM

It's the 50s style wiring as mentioned above. My VOS 175 does the same thing. It's supposed to keep the tone the same as you lower the volume knob. I don't particularly like it, but it is what it is. I usually set my guitar volume knob at 10 and reduce slightly as needed. My volume knob lives between 8 and 10. There is no defect with your guitar. If you really cannot live with it, you could have it rewired to the "new" style.

**floatingpickup** · 08-14-2019, 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by vinnyv1k

Every VOS 59 175 I bought or tried the volume pots only worked from 7-10 and sounded bad at 7.
I basically had to leave the guitar on 10 and adjust the volume by amp or volume pedal. I played a real 1959 all original 335 that was exactly the same way. Might be a on purpose thing for the reissue 59 but doesn't work for me. I like a very gradual increase.

I had a Memphis 2013 VOS ‘63 ES335 and it was exactly like that. It sounded bad anywhere below 7 or 8. It was too sensitive between 8 and 10 to allow for slight volume changes on the fly. I probably could have tried getting into a wiring job, but I decided to just sell the guitar. It was beautiful in every other way, but I didn’t like the wiring.
Keith

**Chazmo** · 08-14-2019, 02:11 PM

Ironically, there was a whole thread recently on this forum about how guitars didn't sound right unless the volume knob was at 10.

At any rate, I sometimes comp at 9 and shoot the volume knob up to 10 on my VOS 175 for lead or single note stuff. I had a Strat I used in a rock band years ago that worked similarly. On the Strat I got a nice clean tone at 9 and enough gain at 10 to push it into overdrive for leads.

**lawson-stone** · 08-14-2019, 04:34 PM

You all have me really curious now. My VOS1959 ES175 has a very smooth rise in volume as I turn the knob. I should fish around inside and see exactly how it's wired. It was new straight from the store to me, with no changes in wiring. Puzzling indeed.

**Eric Rowland** · 08-16-2019, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Chazmo

It's the 50s style wiring as mentioned above. My VOS 175 does the same thing. It's supposed to keep the tone the same as you lower the volume knob. I don't particularly like it, but it is what it is. I usually set my guitar volume knob at 10 and reduce slightly as needed. My volume knob lives between 8 and 10. There is no defect with your guitar. If you really cannot live with it, you could have it rewired to the "new" style.

Is this what is known as the "Memphis Tone Circuit"?
I like the volume control to actually control volume and not 8-10 volume.
Thanks guys for chiming in about this phenomena....