Anyone Built a Guitar Amp From a Kit?

[lawson-stone]

I know some of you are very advanced types who can build amps from scratch... I respect you but this question isn't about that.

Has anyone bought a kit, like the ones from Stew-Mac or MojoTones, and assembled it into a solid working amp? I've got the itch to try it, but it's a substantial investment of money and time, not to mention the various incidental hazards of working with stuff that can stop your heart.

Any experiences with amp kits, especially maybe the more complicated, like Princetons or Deluxe Reverbs?

[dingusmingus]

I did a tweed champ kit years ago, similar to Mojotone or Weber. I can't actually remember who sold it--this was years ago.

It was very doable. I had done some soldering on pedals, and the like, before. If you've done that, I'm sure you'll be fine. If not, you might want to put together a little pedal or something similar as a warm-up. Blackface amps like the Deluxe Reverb are more complex, which just means you have to take your time and be careful.

The end product was great, though the 8" speaker makes it very crunchy. I'm sure you'd be pleased with the result.

[vernon]

I put a 5f1 tweed champ together from Dave at Boothill amps several years ago. It is a fine sounding amp and was pretty straight forward to put together. Kit was about $200 for chassis and components. I bought a very nice lacquered tweed cabinet from him for another $200. Sourced NOS tubes and a Jupiter 8” speaker for $80. Well worth it in my opinion. It would also be good to have a friend knowledgeable in electronics to help you in a jam. Even though Julian Lage has played a vintage tweed champ, I wouldn’t consider it a jazz amp,.. but plug a tele in and crank it up and you’ll have just as much FUN as you can have playing a guitar through an amp. Seriously!

[morroben]

I kinda did a 5e3 kit. Someone else had done it first with a bunch of mods that I couldn't figure out, so I completely stripped it and started over with a regular 5e3 (Mission Tweedy) layout. Trying to troubleshoot the original problems was incredibly frustrating, but once I gave up on that and just started over it was pretty easy. It was my main gigging amp for years after that and I still use it quite a bit.

If you can follow directions and have basic soldering and multimeter skills, I say go for it. You can't help but learn a little along the way.

And at the end, you have a 5e3, which is a killer jazz and blues amp. I don't know if it's what Kenny Burrell used, but it sure sounds like it. A champ kit would be fun too. I would probably start with one of those two before trying a Princeton or DR, unless you have outside experience with electronics etc.

Plus if something goes wrong with it, you'll have some basic understanding and hopefully the ability to fix it. Mine hasn't had any issues since I redid it though, and that was 8-10 years ago now. I don't get into the debate on whether point-to-point sounds better than PCB, but they're sure easier to work on.

I've shared this before, but you might find it interesting considering your recent fall down the tube wormhole...tubehole??? wormtube???
An easily digestible explanation of a 5e3 that can be read in one sitting. It's a good read even if that's not the exact amp you go for...

How the Fender 5E3 Deluxe Works - misinformation and the art of disinterest

[ptchristopher3]

Lawson,

I know you specifically asked not for scratch builders.

**********

But learn to read schematics. No, seriously.

”Wiring diagrams” are FAR worse than ‘guitar TAB’. They can make you think you do not need to really grasp the concept of where the electrons are wiggling. And THAT can help you to do harm to people and things.

A schematic, and the understanding of it, lets you look at your work as the electrons do. This can help you see issues before you fire up the amp and possibly “discover” how things (like the lack of bias) can make remarkably warm glows that are very impressive, and even more ill-advised.

Learn to see how AC current sees caps, chokes, resistors. Even more importantly, learn to see how the power supply actually works (not how the wiring diagram shows it), and really (really-really) understand how a tube works.

**********

Or not.


À chacun son goût, as they say - just before they feel the current where it might best not flow.

[vintagelove]

Bad idea.

You need to learn to solder, break a couple things first, then make a pedal that actually works. Then you need a bunch of tools, get zapped a couple times, learn some lessons.

Then, you might pull it off.

[lawson-stone]

I'm the sort of guy who likes to know how things work and why they work as they do, so yeah, I'll work through the schematic if I decide to build a kit. To me the whole deal of building one is the learning process, plus I end up with an amp I'd otherwise have paid 2x as much or more for, assuming (big assumption) I'm successful. But the education part of it is what makes the process value-added for me.

[ptchristopher3]

Sounds like a plan to me.

[lawson-stone]

Sounds like a plan to me.

I appreciate your advice. Like a language; I don't want to know simply phrases to use, I want to know how the language works, and how to make it work for me.

[Tal_175]

Good luck, I'm interested in the subject as well.
Not to hijack the thread but it would be great if there was an amp building/electronics thread. I have so many really good questions. Like when reading schematics which way the electrons actually flow? Or when electrons are grounded do they literally to go to the ground?
On a more useful level, I'm under the impression that all amps can be characterized by a few design parameters such as the amount of negative feedback, type of bias and phase inverter, tone stack, class type (A, AB etc.). Or may be that's too simplistic?
Anyway that's for another thread.

[sgosnell]

The threat of being killed while assembling an amp is badly overblown. You cannot be hurt until you put the plug into an AC outlet. If the amp isn't plugged in, it's harmless. But be very careful if you plug it in while it's outside the cabinet. You can be badly bitten by a powered circuit. But while you're building it, you shouldn't have it near live AC power. Be ready to pull the plug quickly the first time you plug it in, though.

[ptchristopher3]

The threat of being killed while assembling an amp is badly overblown. You cannot be hurt until you put the plug into an AC outlet. If the amp isn't plugged in, it's harmless. But be very careful if you plug it in while it's outside the cabinet. You can be badly bitten by a powered circuit. But while you're building it, you shouldn't have it near live AC power. Be ready to pull the plug quickly the first time you plug it in, though.

Funny stuff.

My first scratch build was in 1980 or ‘81.

I powered it up by plugging into a switched outlet and standing on the other side of the room to throw the switch.

This was how I noticed that a lack of bias to the power amp 6L6’s can be a remarkable experience.

I then fixed the bias supply, and used the same “roasted” tubes for easily 10 years with no ill effects.

**************************

[sgosnell]>>> If the amp isn't plugged in, it's harmless.

***************************

Well not exactly. If your power supply design does not discharge the filter caps after you power down, then the amp can definitely frost your flakes even when disconnected from AC.

But yes agreed, one is unlikely to die from making an amp.

[sgosnell]

I suppose I should have said "hasn't been plugged in". Yes, caps can hold a charge, but it's rarely, if ever, fatal. My father built an amp, and I'm not sure he even had a schematic. Might have had, but I don't remember seeing it. I helped a little. He used it for years. He had a radio/tv repair business, and I worked for/with him until I finished college. The worst injuries I sustained were not directly from caps (and a CRT picture tube is a really big capacitor, with lots of volts) but from the result of my hand and arm jumping when hit by electricity, and banging into tubes and chassis sharp edges. A picture tube will light you up, but the current is very low, so I never heard of it being fatal. Once we were working on a guy's color tv, out of the cabinet, turned on, but the picture tube unconnected. He was driving us crazy getting in the way and asking stupid questions. Then he saw the picture tube lead hanging loose, carrying about 30,000 volts, and pointed at it to ask what it was. He was too close, and it zapped his finger from about a foot away. He left, and we eventually got his tv fixed. Touching the tube at the lead connection, even after the tv had been off for some time, could be an exciting experience. We were very careful moving them around, because they were expensive. The zap was funny to others until the tube hit the floor. Transistors and LCDs took all the fun out of fixing tvs.

[Alter]

This should give you an idea of what is involved. You need to be decent at soldering, have some tools, and a good understanding of the dangers of high voltage. I 'd start with an overdrive pedal, something like a tubescreamer first. Man, this is tempting (although i haven't done serious electronic work for years..)

[Longways to Go]

I did a DIY 5 watt head a few years ago. It sorta worked -- but not really well.
I'm decent at soldering, but chasing the demons? -- beyond my skill set.
And besides there are so many really good builders out there. I gave that shizz up.
I decided I'd rather buy something good, and put my time into playing.

Swapping speakers, or tubes or cabs (or pickups?) . . . sure. But handwiring an amp? Nope.

[icr]

How would you answer the following:

I own...
A) soldering station with de-solder tool
B) soldering station
C) soldering pencil
D) soldering gun
E) BernzOmatic
F) none of the above

If you have never done this before and choose "F" this I'd start with something like the tube headphone amp in which you are unlikely to harm yourself with over voltage.

If you can get that to work, I'd move to a "CHAMP" kit. I think 5e3 might be too much if you are doing this on your own with no help, unless you have prior experience with electrical projects.

[stevo58]

A blackface circuit is complex as a first project for someone with no experience. A Champ or Tweed Deluxe is far simpler.

1) Learn how to solder well. Put a couple pedal kits together. Put 25 nails in a board in a grid and solder wires to them and repeat until you can do it cleanly. Cold joints are a common beginner (and not-so-beginner) problem.

2) Learn to read and understand schematics. Learn what a capacitor is and how it works (or any component).

3) Understand that a kit is still not paint-by-numbers. You will discover things like how you route your wires (‘lead dress’) has a huge effect on noise. You will make mistakes and have to learn to debug them.

4) Learn proper safety procedures. At some point you will have to at the very least make measurements in a live amp.

5) The guy who said shock danger is overrated is irresponsible. At the very least it is very unpleasant getting hit with 400VDC. Have a healthy respect for the voltages in an amp - at all times.

6) If you have any ability at all you should be able to do this with a bit of care and thought.

7) Buy a kit with good documentation. This leaves Weber out.

8) Have fun.

Steven

[cosmic gumbo]

https://robrobinette.com/Tube_Amp_Safety.htm

[Herbie]

That's a good idea, Lawson!

Or not. Besides of hazards etc there is some other threats too.

1) One amp is not enough. After the first one (I recommend some tweed amp) You start thinking: "... they say that the Brownface Deluxe is THE AMP... not bad layout... " Then You end up making an amp after an amp.

2) If You get tired of Your DIY amp it has not the best re-sale value.

The kits are a good place to start. But You should find out the weak parts of the kit. Are the jacks Switchcraft or cheapos, are the transformers Chinese cheapos etc etc.

18 months ago I made a Tweed Deluxe clone with 6L6 power tubes. It was not from a kit and in the design phase I had two mentors helping and recommending which capacitors should be changed, what would be the best output transformer etc.

In the end the amp was very bass heavy. So I ended to change the capacitors, one by one. Finally I tamed the bass and the amp is now very enjoyable machine.

After changing those caps, some different tubes and over half dozen speakers I have learned that even the coldest & dullest tube amp can be modded to a hot (I mean as hot as You want) sound machine.

Rhett Shull did the kit route:

If You have any woodworking skills You should try to make the cabin too. I ain't no master but after careful studies I have now made three cabs: 1x12", 1x10" and 2x10" (or 1x15"!) tweed cabs.

[ptchristopher3]

Safety

Great link.

Well except that I truly hate wiring diagrams. The guy says “fight complacency”, which seems like perfect advice.

ANY wiring diagram is 100% complacency since it takes you out of seeing the project as the electrons do.

Plush-butt complacency has its place for sure. I just think that guitars and amps are not such a place.

Great advice there though. The habit I learned in high school was to put one hand in your back pocket when reaching anywhere near serious voltages. It can be awkward, which is good. It keeps you aware.

But the link advised using an electricians glove on the “other” hand. This sounds even better.

[339 in june]

I have built an amp, not from a kit, but from components I chose from different suppliers (JJ tubes, Hammond transformers, WGS speaker)
I even built my chassis and my cab.
Some pics :
the chassis
the board
assembly
first firing up
building the cab
Enjoy !

I wanted to start with an easy one : Tweed Champ 5F1. I only made two mistakes that I had to fix, one easy to find after quick analysis, and the other because of a bad wiring color on the OT (this has been more difficult to fix !) I'm quite pleased with the sound and the weight of it. It really is light as a feather.

I'm now in the process of building a second one (as explained above, once you start this kind of activity, you're addicted !)
This time, it is a 5E8, much more complicated !

So yes, if you want to go that route, learn the basics of tube amp (RobRobinette site is very good for that) and stay humble for the first one. Then you'll see ….

[Sam Sherry]

Has anyone bought a kit, like the ones from Stew-Mac or MojoTones, and assembled it into a solid working amp? Any experiences with amp kits, especially maybe the more complicated, like Princetons or Deluxe Reverbs?

Here's the short version: It's like building the world's coolest 3D jigsaw puzzle, and if you're lucky or very patient you get a cool amp too.

= = =

I've built four 'kits':
2x Weber 6A14HP -- a 30+ Watt 6L6 Princeton Reverb with a 12"
AmpMaker Double 6 -- scalable low-power amp about 12 Watts
Chinese Box-O-Parts 5E3 off EBay

The Weber was my first build and people told me, "That's too hard. Build a 5E3 first." My hubris-filled response was, "I'm not going to build something I don't want just so I can later build something I do want." Well, people were right; I built that amp 2.5 times. And I was right; the 6A14HP is a brilliant amp for jazz guitar. Weber is great people. Their parts are solid but lacking internet-approved fairy-dust -- they don't sell, and you don't buy, artisanal capacitors. They also don't sell direction, so 'figure it out, Amp-Boy.' Research, ponder, dig in, test, play.

And I eventually did build a 5E3, which is also a brilliant amp as millions of players have noted.

AmpMaker, MojoTone, StewMac and Allen are all about detailed direction. A lot of what you pay for is guidance, in writing and maybe even remotely. They also include some boutique-y parts.


= = =

There is no feeling in the world like flipping the switch on a homebuilt amp and having music come out the front. I smile every single time I do it. "Hah -- still works, muthafukah!'

[icr]

Here is a work in progress...there are a lot of wires. You need to know what every wire does without looking at the schematic. If you don't know it all when building it, you will need to know what every wire does when figuring out why it does not work or sounds bad.

[Cunamara]

I have build one amp from a kit, a Tweed Deluxe kit from Mission Amps. Bruce at Mission Amps is helpful. I also got a step by step set of instructions from another person for the same kit that were very helpful. To paraphrase This Old House, read twice and solder once. When I was done, I had a working amp. When I first fired it up there was some arcing and sparking due to a cold solder joint on one of the tube sockets. That was easily fixed. All the voltages were in spec.

As has been mentioned in other threads, this particular amp is bass heavy and can be problematic with archtops and feedback. Mission Amps sells the Humbucker I and Humbucker II modifications which can help tame the bass and improve clean headroom (however, the modification kits do not come with instructions as to how to actually use them once they're installed- a slight oversight). Sonic heaven with my Tele and Strat and also with my archtop, after adding the mods which make the normal channel volume knob act as a bass cut. Also, I first built it as a head and used it with my Raezer's Edge 12"- extra bass heavy. Much better with the Deluxe combo cab. I used a Cannabis Rex speaker.

I've gigged many times with a quintet with this amp and have been very happy with it. But I had a listening drummer!

Go for it, I say

[cosmic gumbo]

Build something like this, it looks so cool, it doesn't matter what it sounds like...