Godin Nylon - Slim vs non-slim?

**hoosier1981** · 01-03-2019, 01:15 AM

I've really been wanting to get a Godin Multiac / ACS nylon guitar. I currently own a few electrics and a steel acoustic, all 1-11/16 nut width (43mm?) I have played a Taylor nylon at just under a 48mm nut for a while. I didn't find it particularly frustrating to switch, tho it sometimes made things tricky at first (likely because I'm not that good yet). I think it mainly messes with me while using a pick, but not so much with fingerstyle. I do sometimes wish my guitars were a bit wider as I have good sized hands, but they work out fine.
There is nowhere remotely close to me that carries Godin, so I was wondering if anyone might chime in.
-For the sake of keeping things the same, would it make sense to go with the slim?
-Does the slim feel too cramped with the added nylon string width? (unwanted string touch)
-Would the slim be okay to dabble in classical or would this require the 48mm width?
-I primarily want to play jazz, both fingerstyle and with a pick. Maybe some occasional folk fingerstyle.

**Also, for those of you who prefer the wider version, do you prefer any specific pickup setup? I see the SA have individual transducers for each string, while the Encore has a bridge and neck transducer that you can mix.

**rpguitar** · 01-03-2019, 07:49 AM

This is a hard question to answer, because it's a physical thing which means it will vary for people. However, there is a reason why classical guitars have 2" nuts, and it is indeed because a narrower nut gets cramped for many (most?) players.

I am also originally a steel string player who incorporated nylon in earnest later in life. I play only with fingers on nylon strings, and when I started playing them I just adapted to the standard rather than considering so-called "hybrid" options.

I don't regret that decision, now that it's at least 10 years later. Fingernails need the extra space, as does the fretting hand since the strings are much thicker than steel. If you don't use nails, I'd argue that you need the space even more to pick with stubby fingertips.

I play a Godin Duet Grand Concert in addition to a couple of acoustic classical guitars, plus Gibson electric and acoustic archtops. And I move back and forth to different necks now without much thought. Then again, others who have gone a different path will counsel you on the opposite approach.

**Alter** · 01-03-2019, 09:02 AM

I tend to prefer my thin electric nylon guitar for jazz, brazilian, etc, but probably my standard width classical for classical. I find the height of the action more important of a difference though, different optimal setup for jazz (lower), and different for classical (higher). My nylon is a Guild custom shop Paloma, which i had made with a narrow nut similar to an acoustic, and a full width bridge similar to classical, with a truss rod.

You can probably get used to whatever width the instrument is. Having said that, my future classical build will be a hybrid, narrow width, small scale and a trussrod. Hopefully i 'll be getting there in 2019 !

**Woody Sound** · 01-03-2019, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by rpguitar

This is a hard question to answer, because it's a physical thing which means it will vary for people. However, there is a reason why classical guitars have 2" nuts, and it is indeed because a narrower nut gets cramped for many (most?) players.

I am also originally a steel string player who incorporated nylon in earnest later in life. I play only with fingers on nylon strings, and when I started playing them I just adapted to the standard rather than considering so-called "hybrid" options.

I don't regret that decision, now that it's at least 10 years later. Fingernails need the extra space, as does the fretting hand since the strings are much thicker than steel. If you don't use nails, I'd argue that you need the space even more to pick with stubby fingertips.

I play a Godin Duet Grand Concert in addition to a couple of acoustic classical guitars, plus Gibson electric and acoustic archtops. And I move back and forth to different necks now without much thought. Then again, others who have gone a different path will counsel you on the opposite approach.

Ah but here's an important note. Both smaller ACS neck widths (48mm & 43mm) have the same *bridge* width. 2-1/4" E to E. So as far as right hand picking technique, they're the same. The difference is in the left hand space.

I had an ACS 48mm and found the neck *slightly* clubby. Been wanting to try the slim model if I ever get around to it. Of course, JMOO.

**rpguitar** · 01-03-2019, 12:02 PM

Even if the other Godins have the same bridge spacing - I didn't know that - we often pick near the neck join, where the spacing is narrower. So it will still make a difference to have different nut widths.

Honestly the best approach is to go play some standard 2" classical guitars at a shop and see what you think. Unfortunately many will have high action though, which is usually terrible for bossa and jazz. But maybe you'll get lucky.

**hoosier1981** · 01-03-2019, 12:29 PM

Thanks for the feedback. I didn't realize they are still spaced similar at the bridge! Going over their site of various models actually left me a bit confused.
I ended up getting a 'best offer' accepted for a B-stock Slim SA (natural). $750 shipped, USD so I think I got a pretty good deal.
I was able to find just one shop an hour from me that had a non-slim model (koa extreme) but at MSRP of 1800 it was way out of my range...but wow did that neck transducer sound warm! Comparing it to a Taylor concert nylon, the nut was the same width, but the Godin actually had wider spacing in the strings, which put the outer strings closer to the side of the neck than the Taylor. I found that I had to be a little more careful to not slide the low E string into the side of the neck.
I think the slim will be a nice compromise for what I'm doing. (I just hope the strings are close enough together for using a pick) but it sounds like a good compromise for that and finger-style. If I get to the point where I really want to do some entry level classical and if this doesn't work out, I'll just get a cheap acoustic classical for that and shave the bridge down if needed.

Now for those of you who own this model, I'm assuming it doesn't need to be left in a case with a humidifier like a more expensive acoustic? I try to keep my house around 40% humidity unless it gets REAL cold and makes the windows wet.

**Woody Sound** · 01-03-2019, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by rpguitar

Even if the other Godins have the same bridge spacing - I didn't know that - we often pick near the neck join, where the spacing is narrower. So it will still make a difference to have different nut widths.

True, but I believe the string spacing near the neck joint would only be a mm or 2 difference. Two at the very most. That's a negligible narrowing between strings from a nearly 2-1/4" spread. Divide 1 or 2 mm by 5, that would be the difference between each pair of strings. Almost nothing.

**rpguitar** · 01-03-2019, 03:18 PM

Hoosier, congrats on your impending purchase. Let us know how it feels playing a bossa nova style Bb9 voicing x1011x with the narrow nut. That kind of chord is the determining factor for me.

Regarding humidity, my room is held near 40% all winter long with a humidifier. It's perfect, and yes - even the bolt on planks need to be maintained (fingerboards will shrink and fret ends will pop, regardless of the guitar type).

**Woody Sound** · 01-04-2019, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by rpguitar

Hoosier, congrats on your impending purchase. Let us know how it feels playing a bossa nova style Bb9 voicing x1011x with the narrow nut. That kind of chord is the determining factor for me.

Yes, VERY interested to know how the thinner neck works out.

**Woody Sound** · 01-08-2019, 03:19 PM

Any chance you've received this and have given it a spin yet?

**Woody Sound** · 02-01-2019, 10:23 AM

Revisiting this thread, just wondering if you've been playing on this yet. Any thoughts?

**hoosier1981** · 02-04-2019, 09:20 PM

@Woody Sound - sorry for the late reply! Keep in mind, I'm not a very experienced player, but here is what I've found.
Overall - I'm happy with the slim.
I did drive to a shop to try the 1-7/8 neck before-hand and it was a bit wide for my liking. But I'm not a classical player. The strings seemed a TINY bit wider spaced on the 1-7/8 model than a Taylor 114CE-N. (I got rid of the Taylor and won't ever buy another) - but that's another story on its own.
I mainly had a little struggle barring all the way across the neck of the 1-7/8 Godin. I had the same problem when I tested out various classical guitars with flat necks. The Godin at the shop was the Koa Extreme nylon...I couldn't find any info on it online. I'm not sure if it was even a Multiac or had the same neck. I don't remember if the neck was curved. I know the slim does have a slight curve.

Back to the slim.
The Godin Slim neck was a tad wider than my Gretsch streamliner steel archtop with 1-11/16 nut, maybe .75mm The total string spacing reflected this (which is good), while the 'gap' between the nylon strings was obviously closer together due to the string width (this was where my concern was before ordering). Keep in mind the nylon strings will also bend a bit easier if you get sloppy.
Overall, I'm not having issues with it tho. If I play certain chords toward the nut, like an open A7 with my 2nd / 3rd finger I might get a little buzz if I touch the 1st string but it's not happening that much since I'm playing less sloppy now and paying more attention. So I can definitly hit the chord clean if I try. It MIGHT happen a tiny bit more than with my Gretch, but I do it on all my guitars. I picked up my Fender Strat for reference and it was WAY more of an issue. The nut on that thing measured like 42.3mm with my caliper. and my fingers hit the adjacent strings more on the strat than with the Godin. I then tried my spare, Squire Strat Standard and couldn't even play an A7! It measured 40mm at the nut?! I picked it up on craigslist to set up as a slide guitar and never got around to playing it. I couldn't get more than 3 notes out of an open A7 with that darn thing. My finger would hit each string on either side. All I can do on the squire is blues solo. Looks like I'll be selling that.

At the bridge, the total width of the string spacing was also slightly more than my other guitars, maybe 1-2mm which I think helps out with fingerstyle. I probably wouldn't be learning classical on this thing, but I think it's fantastic for jazz comping, soloing and playing some fingerstyle. Idealy I think if they made the width 1-3/4 it would be perfect.

To the sound. Its nice if you want some quiet but audible unplugged practice time (like strumming my strat unplugged). I don't 'like' the sound of it unplugged, but that's to be expected as you don't get that acoustic resonance. Plugged in it's about what I expected. For jazz I really liked the dual pickup one I tried at the store with the neck fader. I could get a nice warm tone. But again I personally wasn't crazy about a 1-7/8 width. You still get some nice tone control options on the slim, but you're kinda stuck with the piezo. I guess it was the same thing plugging in my Taylor tho. There are plenty of youtube videos to hear them. I'm running a Line 6 helix which allows for Impulse Responses. Rather than using IR's of amps, I downloaded some that model actual guitars, such as Arch-tops. I set up some patches this way and really like the way it sounds...gives it a bit more of that jazzy resonance.

If anything changes I'll update. If you have any questions let me know.

**zcostilla** · 02-05-2019, 05:42 PM

Congratulations on your guitar and I hope it’s everything you want in an instrument.

I love my nylon string guitar, but I play Rondalla (Latin religious music) and dabble in flamenco, but I’m not that good at the latter.

**rob taft** · 02-05-2019, 07:19 PM

One also has to factor in hand size. I have large hands with long fingers and a 1 11/16" nut is just too cramped for me and that includes steel strings. My preferredstring spacing for nylon is 1 11/16" E to E for nylon strings with 2 1/4" E to E at the saddle. Coming from a steel string background, I dislike the flat classical fingerboard. I own a great classical and flamenco guitar and while I can adapt to the 2" nut, I don't like the flat or nearly concave fingerboard. I've recently commissioned a headless nylon string with Chris Forshage and in addition to my preferred string spacing, it will have a 20" radius.