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- Are you playing Bebop/Jazz, with a clean tone ?
- Do you dial in lots of bass and midrange ?
- Do you set your amp on a stool or is it on the floor ?
- Do you have a really strong pick attack and are you using heavy strings ?
- Can you travel with an extension speaker cab ?
All these factors come into play when considering your question ! For myself I decided long ago on a 200 watt Evans combo (1x10" speaker, half closed cab) that I use when playing with drums i.e. a larger group so I am always on the safe side. Without drums I take my Bud. An extra cab is a big help, too and not very costly.
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11-16-2018 05:39 AM
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Yes, but we also play fusion tunes and the drummer/sax players can go *loud*.
i always use flat EQ and have my amp on a stand.
i have a light touch with light strings.
if i understand correctly the Jazz12 has 60watts, the cube has 80watts and i've never even had to crank it past halfway, but i'm not that tech savvy
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I use a DV Mark Micro 50 with a 2x12 cab and it gets plenty loud enough for fusion gigs. I know that probably doesn't answer your question, but thought I'd throw it in there. I know Dean Brown toured Europe with a Micro 50 and was very happy with the results.
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yeah but he certainly had PA support, i don't always have that luxury
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This is true. I guess I was assuming you were micing up the cab. My bad!
Originally Posted by flush
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hehe no problem, i might try out the jazz 212, to see if the tone is really that much better than the roland cube 80gx
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Originally Posted by flush
>>> Ok, so I guess the headroom won't be such an issue with a light touch and light strings. The low frequencies always need much more juice to get properly amplified and a "thick" initial signal from heavy strings picked hard is often too much even for the preamp stage of your amp. In those cases the use of a compressor/limiter pedal can save the day, dialed in so it doesn't squeeze the tone too much, just so to tame the initial spike .... the sensitivity of the speaker is an issue : a high sensitivity gives you more volume per watt .Last but not least : the design and heft of the output transformer plays a big part in how loud and robust the amp sounds - all to often these trannies are too small (a cost factor of course) and therefor are not able to transform all that is fed into them. Just compare a Vox AC 30 (2x12" 30 watts tube combo with a large tranny) to a 30 Watt Roland combo and get blown away by the Vox ....
The difference between a 60 and an 80 watt amp is minute, I dare say you will not detect a difference in tone or volume (if it's the same design). Even the difference between a 50 and a 100 watt Marshall amp is really only apparent in the amount of bass "thud" you feel....
<<<
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The easiest thing to do is add an extension cab, if the amp can handle the lower ohms.
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thats interesting, i thought the difference between 60-80 would be significant. Originally Posted by gitman
also having a light touch with light strings and pickups set low means i need the amp to be louder to be heard than someone who picks hard with fat strings and pickups set high
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All that can be academic if you use a clean boost pedal. After fiddling with my guitar's volume knob for years, when I switch between soloing & comping (I must have a heavy right hand "chug"), I bought a boost pedal and just punch it on or off. Originally Posted by flush
On 60W vs 80W: not much difference. What would have a bigger diff between two such amps would be the sensitivity of their speakers, I bet.
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i'll try it out when i get the chance, but a lot of people have told me to stick with the cube 80GX, but there's something that i just don't like about the tone
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I've never ever had my Jazz 12 louder than 12 o clock at most. Even in rehearsals where the drummer was asked to play as loudly as he would at the concert. I haven't used it without PA and with a drummer, though - but if it's -too- loud at rehearsal at 12, I assume that at 3 or even maximum volume, it'll be enough for clubs
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On a parallel matter, I have been considering buying a Henriksen but have learned they’ve essentially discontinued the 12” models, and currently have the Jazz Ten instead. I’ve not used a solid state amp, nor a 1x10. Im slightly anxious that the 10” won’t be enough but I suspect I’m jumping at shadows. I know in a hifi context that speakers smaller than that can make bass below the frequency of a guitar. I’m not in a position to try before I buy so I’m curious about your experience? Originally Posted by gitman
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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Elevating a speaker reduces low frequency response a lot. Compensating for that with bass EQ consumes a lot of amplifier power. Placing the speaker on the floor reinforces low end and you may be able of reduce bass EQ and conserve power. Originally Posted by flush
Light touch and strings is fine, just turn up to the level you need.
You will not be able to hear a difference in level between 60 and 80 watts. The position of the amp's volume control is meaningless - the amp's gain acts on the level of the input signal passed by the volume control. An amp spec'ed at 60 watts means that for a nominal distortion spec (for musical instrument amplifiers it's about 5%) the amp will produce an output of 60 watts when the volume control is wide open and the input signal from the preamp is some spec level called the input sensitivity (typical 1 volt, but varies). The volume control is used to attenuate the input down below this input sensitivity value enough to the level you want. So the volume control might end up being set anywhere depending on the input and desired level, and the control is not linear taper, so 5 out of 10 on the dial does not mean half volume or anything like that, can't be used for comparing from amp to amp.
You know, some drummers sound loud even when they play easy and others can sound kind of soft even when they play with considerable force. I'm not a drummer, but I've played with many and found a lot of variation good and less good. I have played with drummers that could play loud when needed, yet due to their technique even their loud playing did not seem to cover up the other instruments... I don't know how they do that, but I guess what I'm getting at is that as musicians we all kind of understand that music is very much a constructive illusion.
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A 10" guitar speaker is certainly capable of producing adequate bass, provided it is working in a suitable cab. Originally Posted by duncannz
The EVANS a combo I use for louder gigs has a 10" Evidence "Beta" speaker built in and even with the half-closed cab design this combo delivers just fine. As far as I understand the Henriksen cabs are closed and use a bass reflex opening, calculated in relation to the cab size. This type of enclosure typically can produce even more bass than a half-closed/open back design.
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My DV Mark Little Jazz, with an 8" speaker, can produce so much bass that I have to dial it back under some conditions, mostly flat on the floor. I like to tilt it back a few degrees with something under the front edge, and to me that sounds the best, plenty of bass with the controls set flat. My Raezer's Edge Stealth 10 can easily produce more bass than I can abide. Both are ported, not open back. The speaker in the Little Jazz is very efficient, and it gets very loud if turned up. I've used it at very loud blues/rock jams with incredibly loud drummers, and it was loud enough, more than enough bass, with the volume at ~50% on both the guitar and amp. The Fender and Katana amps others used were harder to hear, mostly because they had no mids. IMO there is no need for 12" speakers, not for bass nor for volume, but they're available and do the job as well, but modern speakers can handle bass very well. Many bass players are now using 8" speakers, and 10" is certainly enough
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Originally Posted by sgosnell
if what you say is really true, then the littlejazz would save me a lot of cash, backpain and headaches
i'll have to try em all out, perhaps i'll start with the littlejazz, i could order it with 30days try-out period
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How might the Little Jazz compare to the Bud? Similar weight, a lot less money.
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For those interested in a comparison of the Bud and the Little Jazz, here is one from a member who has owned both: At last , my Little Jazz is finally on the way (Recording added to the OP)
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so there wouldn't be any benefit volume wise of having the DV mark 12 over the littlejazz? Originally Posted by sgosnell
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Maybe, I can't really say because I've never tried a Jazz 12, nor anything with that size speaker. A 12" speaker certainly moves more air with the same excursion, but by the time I turn my Little Jazz past 12 o'clock it's too loud for my ears unless I have the guitar volume way back. I'm more concerned with portability than volume, but I've played in blues/rock jams where I had to wear earplugs and it was still painfully loud, and the Little Jazz was as loud as anything else present, without turning much beyond 12 o'clock. That 8" speaker is very efficient. I think it comes down to how important portability is to you.
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would the lunchbox be louder than the littlejazz? i can pick one up for $300 Originally Posted by sgosnell
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I know nothing about the lunchbox, but there seems to be little love for it here. I doubt it is as loud, clean, but again I've never even seen one. There are lots of threads discussing amps here, and they have lots of opinions.
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Cabinets can be very different, depending on the design and the speaker. Different designs sound better with different speakers. I have no recommendations.
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Originally Posted by sgosnell
people on the page of the cheaper cab have commented that it sounds 'fizzy' and 'thin'.
i don't know if they are corksniffers though lol
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