Gibson L-5 vs. Heritage Golden Eagle

**Marty Grass** · 04-19-2017, 09:07 AM

These sorts of comparisons will never end. And they won't because they rarely resolve anything. Nonetheless, they are fun.

In this video an excellent fingerstyle player compares his trusty L-5 with several Heritages. It should be noted that he is a new Heritage dealer, but I've found Rich Severson to have a solid reputation for integrity. I also find him to be a great teacher and player.

**agentsmith** · 04-19-2017, 09:11 AM

didn't watch the video but I've had extensive experience with the L5 and the Heritage Eagle. My take is that nothing comes close to an L5 including many of the hand-made boutique guitars. In the case of the eagle, the fatter body of the L5 makes a huge difference in dynamic range IMO.

OTOH, a couple years ago, i had a Gibson L5 Wes and a Heritage Eagle Classic with 1 pickup, parallel bracing, etc. I actually preferred the Eagle. I felt it was more responsive and had more acoustic vibe to it. Not to mention, you can pick up a used Heritage eagle for around $2k.

Still, if I were going for exclusively the Wes tone, the L5 is closer to that sound.

**plectrum99x** · 04-19-2017, 10:24 AM

Hello,
I agree, I own both—3 L5's and 1 Golden Eagle with set PUP—and, while the Golden has a wonderful tone of its own, it in no way compares to the L5 CES or even my Wes. And, yes, acoustically, the Golden is somewhat brighter than the Wes, but amplified they differ significantly as well, one not being better than the other, just different. In addition, I own several boutique, alleged L5 clones, whose tonalities differ greatly from the Gibby. As said, if you desire the L5 sound, the only solution is the real deal.

**wintermoon** · 04-19-2017, 12:28 PM

I've never heard any Heritage that can touch a Gibson L-5 but ymmv.
I don't know if it's because Heritages are built lighter, the thinner body depth, but they just don't nail THAT tone.

Dutchbopper · 04-19-2017, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by agentsmith

didn't watch the video but I've had extensive experience with the L5 and the Heritage Eagle. My take is that nothing comes close to an L5 including many of the hand-made boutique guitars. In the case of the eagle, the fatter body of the L5 makes a huge difference in dynamic range IMO.

OTOH, a couple years ago, i had a Gibson L5 Wes and a Heritage Eagle Classic with 1 pickup, parallel bracing, etc. I actually preferred the Eagle. I felt it was more responsive and had more acoustic vibe to it. Not to mention, you can pick up a used Heritage eagle for around $2k.

Still, if I were going for exclusively the Wes tone, the L5 is closer to that sound.

A few weeks ago I thought I needed an L5 - not even sure why, probably just peer pressure - and checked out 2 Wesmos. One at my home (from a friend) and one in Amseterdam. They were fine guitars but I felt the price tag was just too high. Over 6k euro for a non vintage guitar. Man, I just can't get over that. Apparently the appeal is not big enough.

DB

**deacon Mark** · 04-19-2017, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by agentsmith

didn't watch the video but I've had extensive experience with the L5 and the Heritage Eagle. My take is that nothing comes close to an L5 including many of the hand-made boutique guitars. In the case of the eagle, the fatter body of the L5 makes a huge difference in dynamic range IMO.

OTOH, a couple years ago, i had a Gibson L5 Wes and a Heritage Eagle Classic with 1 pickup, parallel bracing, etc. I actually preferred the Eagle. I felt it was more responsive and had more acoustic vibe to it. Not to mention, you can pick up a used Heritage eagle for around $2k.

Still, if I were going for exclusively the Wes tone, the L5 is closer to that sound.

Jack and I have very different taste in guitars I do not always agree with what he says but I still respect his playing and knowledge. On this one jack is dead on.......nothing really comes close to an L5 but the real deal. The sound of an L5 is unmatched by any make or maker of guitars. I would say this also for a Super 400 of course we are taking about built in CES guitars.

Buy anything you want but if you like the sound of the electric L5 by many players such as Kevin Van Sant or Wes...... get an L5 and be done.

**Woody Sound** · 04-19-2017, 01:01 PM

I think I liked the Groovemaster the best, the 575 the least.

**lawson-stone** · 04-19-2017, 01:28 PM

I have owned a Heritage Golden Eagle with floater, for about 10 years. I also have owned 2 ES175s and an ES165 and recently acquired a 2015 L5ces. In the "L5 clones" department I've owned a MiK Epiphone Broadway, an Epiphone Elitist Broadway, and an Aria Pro II PE180, and I have the Epiphone ES175 Premium. My experience is nowhere nearly as broad as many on this forum, but my opinions at least have been shaped by actually playing these instruments and comparing them. I am really OCD about doing side-by-side "shoot outs." I make a video clip during my practice every single day, and often listen to them, note the tonal differences, and usually delete them, though as you know, sometimes I keep one and post it.

So while I'm not the most authoritative person on this forum by a VERY long shot, I think I do have an opinion grounded in experience.

I think all of these guitars sound fabulous. Yes, even the 2 cheap Epiphones punch way above their class and I always smile when I play them.

The Aria and Elitist are also splendid guitars and to my ear are the closest approach to the L5ces tone I have heard. On the other hand, maybe that's the wrong way to judge. When I say these guitars don't match the L5ces sound, I'm not deprecating them. I think the Aria or EEB could be a satisfying only guitar for a lifetime. I'm wanting to sell the Epiphone but it's hard to put down when I pick it up to play. It's that good. But I prefer the L5ces. I can totally understand, though if someone liked one of the others better.

Likewise the 16" guitars. I love the spunky little Epi ES175. I like the 1959 VOS way better, despite the peer pressure to deprecate the "re-issue" as not being the real deal. Mine does everything for me I want an ES175 to do. But the ES165 is in a class by itself. It has the fit, feel and finish I associate with the L5. It has a rich tone that I still have some trouble defining. It and the L5ces make a wonderful pair.

Then there was the long lost, late-lamented Heritage Golden Eagle. It also was in a class of its own. For finger style solo guitar, I have never played anything that equaled it, even the L5ces, though it has been 10 years since I played the Heritage.

Bottom line: it's a rich environment for lovers of archtop guitars. I agree, nothing is quite like a real Gibson ES175 or L5ces. On the other had, "different" is not "worse," just different. So much depends on preference and what you've listened to, what the mental memory banks are filled with. Younger players especially who came up on digital recording and the more modern, post-Benedetto archtops, might not find the traditional Gibson sound to be their favorite. That's totally good. I'm in between, and enjoy a lot of different tone qualities, so I have more guitars than is sane, and I play every one of them.

Not sure the point I'm making here... I agree with the Gibson crowd (heck, I AM in the Gibson crowd) that it's a distinctive sound hard to duplicate; but I also think the other sounds and tone qualities out there are beautiful too. A guitar need not be judged by how close to the Gibson it sounds unless you are someone (like me, and some others) for whom that is the canonical baseline of guitar tone.

**Marty Grass** · 04-19-2017, 01:37 PM

There is a bias towards Gibson, deserved or not. The L-5 is king.

**helios** · 04-19-2017, 01:47 PM

Given the limitations, I enjoyed the video!
I think the differences between the Eagle Classic & L5 would mirror the differences between the Super Eagle/Super KB & Super 400. The Super Eagle would be somewhat more acoustic & brighter in timbre than the Super 400, which would be darker and mellower.
I may (personally) slightly prefer a Super 400, but not to the tune of additional $4000 or so to acquire one.
If I were wealthy, I'd own both (along with an Eagle Classic & L5).

**vinnyv1k** · 04-19-2017, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by Dutchbopper

A few weeks ago I thought I needed an L5 - not even sure why, probably just peer pressure - and checked out 2 Wesmos. One at my home (from a friend) and one in Amseterdam. They were fine guitars but I felt the price tag was just too high. Over 6k euro for a non vintage guitar. Man, I just can't get over that. Apparently the appeal is not big enough.

DB

I would rather have my L5 than the $7.5K I paid for it. Money doesn't make me happy.
Well I take that back. Spending it on a L5 did make me very happy.
Money.......you can always make more of that. A good L5 is a lifetime of sweet sounds.
There is no price tag on that.......IMO and I am no rich man money wise that is.

**helios** · 04-19-2017, 02:20 PM

I don't personally buy the perception that nothing touches an L5.
A Triggs St Croix, for example, is ladder-braced just like a Gibson archtop (that's what Jim told me in an email).
I suspect it would be very difficult to tell them (L5/St Croix) apart in a blind listening test!

"Thank you for the inquiry. This guitar is ladder braced just like a Gibson arch top"

**mr. beaumont** · 04-19-2017, 02:37 PM

Maybe.

It's not so much about "not touching." Better is subjective.

What's not subjective is that an L5 sounds more like an L5 than any other guitar

**agentsmith** · 04-19-2017, 03:45 PM

It doesn't matter if you buy it or not if you can point to an example that proves the point. A local guy in cleveland is loves Triggs and for years has been telling me that they blow away Gibson and anything else including d'aquisto, d'angelico, etc. He has one of the triggs guitars with parallel bracing and L5-like dimensions and materials.

He sat in with my band a number of times with his triggs and the guitar sounded nothing like an L5 IMO. It sounded good but to me , it proved that whatever "improvements" triggs is doing are causing it to sound less like an L5. Not that the L5 is the ultimate tone but to me, it's kind of like vacuum tube amps. The reason we love them isn't because they are better but because that's all we heard (if you're a boomer) growing up. And like vacuum tubes, many of us like myself grew up worshipping wes and his L5. i no longer want that tone but I do recognize it as a signature sound and I have played benedettos and triggs and even d'angelicos and none of them sounded like an L5. So if you absolutely have an L5, get the gibson.

Originally Posted by helios

I don't personally buy the perception that nothing touches an L5.
A Triggs St Croix, for example, is ladder-braced just like a Gibson archtop (that's what Jim told me in an email).
I suspect it would be very difficult to tell them (L5/St Croix) apart in a blind listening test!

"Thank you for the inquiry. This guitar is ladder braced just like a Gibson arch top"

**deacon Mark** · 04-19-2017, 06:07 PM

D'angelico's do not sound like L5 s that is for sure. Listen to Kenny Burrell and his D'angelico and some recordings and the Super 400. Not doubt that it is Kenny, the sound is in the hands but I can hear it in a moment the difference. Even built in pups D'angelico s and I have played those before too.

**BigMikeinNJ** · 04-19-2017, 06:24 PM

I like a NY Strip just as much as I like a Ribeye... rare
Owning and loving both I see it like having my steak - one day I want the strip the other the ribeye...

**skykomishone** · 04-19-2017, 07:15 PM

Ford or Chevy?

**jads57** · 04-19-2017, 07:35 PM

For me there's no comparison Gibson sets the bar very high when it comes to archtops. Not all Gibsons are great, and not all Heritage
Golden Eagles are bad. But that's exactly my experience with both of these models over the last 30 years or so.

From fit and finish to neck shape, acoustic and electric tonality as well. When comparing these 2 models make sure to compare X braced acoustic floaters to each other as well as the electric parallel double or single p/up models.

**The Freak** · 11-07-2017, 02:46 PM

Haha! ok, this thread is not that old!

How do they compare to each other, is there a big sample variation?

The Gibson L5's I mean and more concrete, lets say you've got 5 Gibson L5's CES in the same finish, from the same year.

Are they all good, but with their own character?
Do they sound like each other, because their top is tuned?
Or is any piece of wood, or construction, or pressure different, so the sound also varies?

I read that L5's vary over the years, but do they vary after each other?

Can you please say something about the sound differences. I don't care about variations in finish, frets, string(heights).

Do you have to try them? Are professionals looking for the best ones, so the suckers can get the leftovers from the local store?

**plectrum99x** · 11-07-2017, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by helios

I don't personally buy the perception that nothing touches an L5.
A Triggs St Croix, for example, is ladder-braced just like a Gibson archtop (that's what Jim told me in an email).
I suspect it would be very difficult to tell them (L5/St Croix) apart in a blind listening test!

"Thank you for the inquiry. This guitar is ladder braced just like a Gibson arch top"

Your comparison does not indicate whether the St Croix has a set PUP or the usual floater, and if the L5 that you are referring to is a Wes model, with a single set PUP, otherwise, a valid comparison cannot be made. That said, I own a Triggs New Yorker Special with the usual floater, as well as 2 Gibson L5 CES's and 1 Wes. While a direct comparison cannot be made due to the PUP differences (set vs floater) there is an easily discernible difference in tonality between the Gibsons and the Triggs. As has been said elsewhere, both the Triggs and Gibson L5's are excellent instruments—and I love them all—but they are different animals. The same can be said for the Heritage Golden Eagle that I own, which has 1 set PUP. It is closest in tonality to my Gibson Wes, but still considerably lighter and slightly brighter. However, given the variations among same model guitars, I suppose that one could happen upon a Wes and a Golden Eagle that sound and play the same.

**plectrum99x** · 11-07-2017, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by The Freak

Haha! ok, this thread is not that old!

How do they compare to each other, is there a big sample variation?

The Gibson L5's I mean and more concrete, lets say you've got 5 Gibson L5's CES in the same finish, from the same year.

Are they all good, but with their own character?
Do they sound like each other, because their top is tuned?
Or is any piece of wood, or construction, or pressure different, so the sound also varies?

I read that L5's vary over the years, but do they vary after each other?

Can you please say something about the sound differences. I don't care about variations in finish, frets, string(heights).

Do you have to try them? Are professionals looking for the best ones, so the suckers can get the leftovers from the local store?

While the more recently produced L5's are all presumably made from the same set of plans, with the same specifications, they are after all, hand made instruments, and that fact alone offers the potential for variability. But in terms of tone and playability, whether one is better than another is a matter of personal taste. And, yes, tonality tends to change with time, meaning, that older L5's will probably have a mellower tone than a brand new product, a fact that I can attest to, as I own both a 26 and a 4 year old L5 CES. Lastly, players and potential buyers have always been known to reject a given instrument for different reasons (i.e., finish, color, playability, tone, price, and so on). But remember, one man's reject is another's jewel.

**johnnyjazz** · 11-07-2017, 07:44 PM

I think it is a very personal thing to ask which is best and we all have different hearing.

I am also a believer in the fact that if you have great technique then you will make any guitar sound great.

It,s all in the hands.

**Gitfiddler** · 11-07-2017, 08:02 PM

I'd love to own an L5. Ever since first hearing Wes Montgomery way back in '65 playing such beautiful music on his big, beautiful Gibson, that was the ultimate guitar to me. One day I might own one. Maybe not. I'm not a rich man, nor a professional guitarist. What is most important is how THAT sound inspired me all these years, to play, learn and enjoy guitars and jazz. Now I think I'll pour myself a wide-mouth brandy sniffer of B&B, reach for my Heritage Golden Eagle (see avatar) and do a little Bumpin' this evening. Peace.