Gibson L-5 CES Copies and the Real Thing

**lawson-stone** · 03-31-2017, 02:58 PM

I re-did this clip and fixed the panning problem. Now the guitar comes through one channel, the right (on my system, maybe left on yours, hey, your right is my left and that's what's making this world what it's rapidly becoming, but I digress…) and the backing track is in the other, with a little leakage via the microphone into the guitar channel.

I've tried to give equal time to all three guitars, longer segments early, getting more rapid in the switching toward the end.

I am again struck at how well the Aria and the Epiphone Elitist do in providing a great playing experience that is in the L5ces zone, even if the Gibson does retain its pride of place.

**Greentone** · 03-31-2017, 04:33 PM

Lawson,

With the release 2.0 of the comparison your guitars are even more neck-in-neck (no pun intended). They _really_ sound supremely woody, archtop-y, warm, and desirable. The L-5 wins, but only by a nose! The other two guitars are right there.

Now, I know how it feels to pick up and play a L-5CES--supremo quality. The neck carve, neck-to-binding-to frets area just feels so smooth in your left hand. The Elitist and the PE feel great, too, but not quite the same thing. You feel rewarded for your efforts playing an L-5.

The sound, though? They all three sound damned fine.

**lawson-stone** · 03-31-2017, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Greentone

Lawson,

With the release 2.0 of the comparison your guitars are even more neck-in-neck (no pun intended). They _really_ sound supremely woody, archtop-y, warm, and desirable. The L-5 wins, but only by a nose! The other two guitars are right there.

Now, I know how it feels to pick up and play a L-5CES--supremo quality. The neck carve, neck-to-binding-to frets area just feels so smooth in your left hand. The Elitist and the PE feel great, too, but not quite the same thing. You feel rewarded for your efforts playing an L-5.

The sound, though? They all three sound damned fine.

Yep. Playing "live" I sense a little more "bite" in the Aria, or maybe more grit. The Epi moves toward the smoothness of the Gibson.

I'm so happy with the L5, but seriously, someone with either the Aria or the Epiphone Elitist would have a splendid, lifetime-rewarding guitar.

I'm about decided to sell the Epiphone and keep the Aria, but honestly it's a hard choice.

**rob taft** · 03-31-2017, 05:14 PM

I'd sell the Epiphone, you will probably be able to move that faster than the Aria. I'm partial to the Aria as I have a 77' PE-190 Robert Conti model with a KA floater an it is a great guitar. If it had a wider nut I would play it more than I do but it is a great pick guitar and plays like butter.

**rio** · 03-31-2017, 05:57 PM

That is a tough call regarding what to sell. Now that they are all more comparable in the second version, they all do sound remarkably similar. I think that I would be tempted to sell the Aria personally, but it probably wouldn't sell as fast. You have good plywood guitars already and as cool as the Aria is, you do have a real L5 now. That Broadway Elitist will age very nicely too and has a more distinctive voice than the Aria imo. It is a hard decision but that is the way I would lean. I would buy that from you in a second if I had the money sitting around even though I have an L5 - I always wanted an Elitist because I have heard only good things about them.

**lawson-stone** · 03-31-2017, 06:12 PM

One variable for me is that I'd try to sell it on this forum. In that situation, I want to know I'm selling a 100% wonderful guitar. The Aria is great, but shows its age. Sometimes when you actually hold a guitar, even an honest description doesn't prepare you for the yellowed binding, checking, etc. This Elitist Broadway is really something that I'd be proud to say someone had bought from me. The Aria also, but its 40+ years old and shows it.

**vinnyv1k** · 03-31-2017, 06:14 PM

Just keep them all. You will regret the sale down the road.

**vinnyv1k** · 03-31-2017, 07:57 PM

Money.....you can always make more but when a good guitar is gone, it's gone forever.

**Guitarbean25** · 03-31-2017, 08:17 PM

Gah!!!...I want a total blind test.

Kahneman and Taversky are both turning over in their graves (and Kahneman is still alive!)

**plasticpigeon** · 03-31-2017, 08:23 PM

I've listened a couple of times to the new improved comparison, and I've come to the conclusion I like the sound of the Aria best, which is unfortunate, as I have an L-5 and Broadway! However they are all quite close so I bet they could all be made indistinguishable from each other with a minimum of twiddling, and I'm happy to have two brilliant guitars! Like Lawson I planned to sell the Broadway but it didn't sell immediately and then another paycheque passed and I realised I wasn't suffereing too hard, so i kept it!

**sgosnell** · 03-31-2017, 09:04 PM

They all sound very close now. The Epi seems slightly brighter, but that can easily be changed with a volume control on the guitar or the amp. I think the one to sell is just whichever one you don't want to play as much. The tones are so close I don't think you can choose by sound, just by which ones feel better to you. I'd probably be tempted to sell the L5, just because it would bring more money, but I haven't played any of them, and it's not up to me. You just have to go by feel. Good luck whatever you decide.

**lawson-stone** · 03-31-2017, 11:19 PM

Originally Posted by sgosnell

They all sound very close now. The Epi seems slightly brighter, but that can easily be changed with a volume control on the guitar or the amp. I think the one to sell is just whichever one you don't want to play as much. The tones are so close I don't think you can choose by sound, just by which ones feel better to you. I'd probably be tempted to sell the L5, just because it would bring more money, but I haven't played any of them, and it's not up to me. You just have to go by feel. Good luck whatever you decide.

The L5ces is the one I'm keeping--latest acquisition that I'm trying to "amortize" in a manner of speaking by selling one of the others!

**stringsalive** · 04-01-2017, 12:17 AM

This is really cool!

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**tonesofpgh** · 04-01-2017, 02:54 AM

Nice clip, the Aria sounds most like the Gibson to my ears. All fantastic instruments I'm sure.

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**Archie** · 04-01-2017, 06:17 AM

Originally Posted by helios

A blind test would be very difficult!

Actually having had all 3 that's not true. They are massively different and I could tell which was which blindfolded.

The Aria is big and heavy with a thick laminate top. It doesn't have much acoustic tone but plucked in it sounds warm and fat! Looks awesome, costs 1/4 the price.

The Epi Elite is also quite heavy but with a very thin laminated top which makes it very crisp and bright acoustically. Plugged in it is thin sounding. It's more like a modern D'angelico.

The L5, probably same weight as the eli but with a solid top and enhanced bracing. Sometimes a little bass heavy and temperamental when plugged in but the notes will be the roundest and deepest out of the lot.
A better quality of note you could say.

In order I would take the L5, Aria, Epi.

(P.s I've just noticed there was a sound comparison I haven't yet heard. I'm just giving you my experience from what i remembered)

**lawson-stone** · 04-01-2017, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by ArchtopHeaven

Actually having had all 3 that's not true. They are massively different and I could tell which was which blindfolded.

The Aria is big and heavy with a thick laminate top. It doesn't have much acoustic tone but plucked in it sounds warm and fat! Looks awesome, costs 1/4 the price.

The Epi Elite is also quite heavy but with a very thin laminated top which makes it very crisp and bright acoustically. Plugged in it is thin sounding. It's more like a modern D'angelico.

The L5, probably same weight as the eli but with a solid top and enhanced bracing. Sometimes a little bass heavy and temperamental when plugged in but the notes will be the roundest and deepest out of the lot.
A better quality of note you could say.

In order I would take the L5, Aria, Epi.

(P.s I've just noticed there was a sound comparison I haven't yet heard. I'm just giving you my experience from what i remembered)

The Elitist has a solid pressed top, not laminated. But that's otherwise a very apt description.

**Guido_59** · 04-01-2017, 02:49 PM

Good demo lawson, thanks.
IMHO the best of three to my ears is Epi Elitist second Gibson and last Aria.
This if amp and guitar setting are the same.

**lawson-stone** · 04-01-2017, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by Guido_59

Good demo lawson, thanks.
IMHO the best of three to my ears is Epi Elitist second Gibson and last Aria.
This if amp and guitar setting are the same.

Yes, all the guitars have volume/tone set to 10. Amp is a Polytone Minibrute II with EQ flat (at zero, 12 o'clock position). Microphone is a Bluebird, set about 3 feet from the speaker.

**rio** · 04-01-2017, 06:34 PM

Interesting - I thought the Epi was a craved top but that was just inferring from reading "solid top" over the years. How does it sound acoustically vs the L5?

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**Marty Grass** · 04-02-2017, 08:37 AM

If you want to do a variant test that will screw everyone up, show the Gibson while we hear the Epi. In other words, let the visual info not always correlate with the audio. Then have a contest to see if anyone can accurately associate the sound with the actual guitar that made the sound.

We all have biases. As soon as I see the Gibson headstock, my expectations are set.

I've done such a test with two old Les Pauls (1959s), a Heritage 150 and an Epi LP. It is surprising how hard it is to tell which is which when the visual cues point in another direction.

**lawson-stone** · 04-02-2017, 08:42 AM

Originally Posted by rio

Interesting - I thought the Epi was a craved top but that was just inferring from reading "solid top" over the years. How does it sound acoustically vs the L5?

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I think it's a pressed top, but I have never had a final word on that subject. I sure looks carved--the recurve makes me think if it was pressed, it was still hand-shaped at some level.

I'll check the acoustic sound for you and see what I think. I never compared them that way before.

**lawson-stone** · 04-02-2017, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by Marty Grass

If you want to do a variant test that will screw everyone up, show the Gibson while we hear the Epi. In other words, let the visual info not always correlate with the audio. Then have a contest to see if anyone can accurately associate the sound with the actual guitar that made the sound.

We all have biases. As soon as I see the Gibson headstock, my expectations are set.

I've done such a test with two old Les Pauls (1959s), a Heritage 150 and an Epi LP. It is surprising how hard it is to tell which is which when the visual cues point in another direction.

I thought about that. I don't like to put people to "tests" but it would be a fun way to put the guitars to a test.

**LtKojak** · 04-02-2017, 02:11 PM

The Epi is crying for a better set of p'ups.

From the three, I'd pick the Aria. It has an evenness of tone, maybe due to the older wood, that the others didn't have.

The best-sounding is the L5, although with better p'ups, I'm positive the Aria would've won.

HTH,

**Flat** · 04-02-2017, 03:57 PM

I'd like to put in a good word for the low end of that Epiphone. Perhaps my ears are as perverse as the rest of me, but I was really enjoying its thunky warm bottom. Sounds (to me, over the net, through Macbook speakers, etc.) like a laminate, an ES-350 or something similar (even though it's not actually a laminate, as Lawson described).

The nice bottom is not enough to overtake the L5, imho, but I was digging that 6th string every time it came around.

Great show. Thanks for putting it together!

**lawson-stone** · 04-02-2017, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by LtKojak

The Epi is crying for a better set of p'ups.

From the three, I'd pick the Aria. It has an evenness of tone, maybe due to the older wood, that the others didn't have.

The best-sounding is the L5, although with better p'ups, I'm positive the Aria would've won.

HTH,

So maybe Seymour Duncan Seth Lover?

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