Gibson ES-175 Models and Years

[rexi]

I don't know much about the different models/years for the Gibson ES-175.

Anything particular that i should stay away from when looking for an ES-175?

[GNAPPI]

Honestly, I cannot say theres a "stay away" issue with any year of production.

I've played used duds and marvelous selections in the same store. Others may disagree with me here but the 175 is about the ONLY Gibson I would NOT buy online, they have been too variable in my experience.

Funny thing about 175's... given that I find them variable, when you find one that speaks to you (if used) the previous owner did not find it spoke to them :-)

A good 175 is a keeper till death.

[Max405]

It depends on what you play. If you never use the bridge pickup, then consider an ES165. You will save some money and its basically the same guitar without an extra pickup bolted to the top.
To the best of my knowledge, they've never really screwed up the 175 during any model year.
The trick with a 175 is to play it for a while. Because it is so vaunted, a lot of people pick one up and expect IT to turn THEM into Jim Hall, Joe Pass and Herb Ellis combined. You will be impressed the first time you play it. But play it for a week. And then, try to play something else after that. That's when you will experience the magic of the 175.

Good Luck and have fun finding your 175. They've made a lot of them so there are plenty around to choose from.

Joe D.

[citizenk74]

Rexi - IMHO, it is important to find out how the instrument feels in your hands. Does the neck feel right? Can you reach the note you want to play without strain or pain? Neck widths and carves vary, and are important. If the neck doesn't feel right, move on - there are lots and lots of ES-175s out there to choose from. Mine, my second, was purchased new in 2006 and gigged with extensively - solo, duo, trio, and so forth up through a couple seasons with a big band. It never let me down. Some will tell you, and they are right, that you will take a hit on resale buying new. Me, I don't care. I love the instrument and will not sell it, barring extremity. I've received more than my money's worth in sheer joy playing it.
I'm kind of a fan. Good luck with your search, it will be worth it.

[rexi]

Thanks for your replies, always valuable info on this forum from players with ton of experience, Much appreciated

I think i will have to take a trip somewhere where there are more 175´s then in my town so i can try a few like you say. I have bought most of my guitars without trying them but that is always too nerve wrecking.

[goldenwave77]

Some of the older Japanese lawsuit models have a fair bit of 175 vibe and sound, for about 40 to 55% or so of the cost of a Gibson.

You need to play a bunch of different instruments. The newer Epiphone models with the Gibson pickups have also gotten some good reviews. These can be had for less than a used lawsuit model.

If you have a reasonable size amp that you use, don't be afraid to bring it to the store with you. Different amps definitely like different guitars, differently. Finally, pu swaps can completely change the sound of an instrument. Most Gibson owners don't bother or do this, but I have an older Aria Pro II lawsuit 175, on which I changed out the neck humbucker for a humbucker-sized P90 ($85 or so) from Pete Biltoft....Very quiet, stronger, more articulate and "sweeter" sounding. Total cost was about $750. (The pu swap is easy if the pu housing is the same size...snip some wires...twist the wires together and solder, with shrink wrap over it....not hard to do.) But it can be hard to predict the end result ahead of time.

Research some other threads here...LOTS of discussion on 175's. People love their carved top archtops (and I have one), but the 175 may be the single best tool ever for jazz guitar--probably more great recordings have been made on it, than any other instrument.

[vinnyv1k]

If you can't find a good one local I have found buying online new is pretty risk free. If it arrives damaged or the neck is bad you just send it back for a full refund. I have had bad luck buying online but never out any money. Just frustrating when you get a bad axe or one damaged in shipping. New is pricey though. Don't know your budget.
Most online dealers can be talked down on the price. Consider a L4CES also. Great axe too.

Class act onliner's....Chicago Music Exchange, Wildwood Guitars, Rainbow Guitars, Dave's Guitars.....IMO.

Reverb and EBay will be more of a dice roll but at times you can sniff out a smoking deal.

Another great place to get a 175 would be from a member here. Put a WTB in the For Sale section.


LOL !

[Greentone]

As Joe said, the 165 is a great way to save some money and get a good 175. (Gibson made single pickup ES-175 guitars from 1949-1971, or thereabouts. Back then, the two-pickup model was actually called the ES-175D, the "D" for double pickup model.) Except for Joe Pass, who was given his guitar by an admiring fan, the other "classic" 175 artists played single-pickup models. (Think, especially, Jim Hall and Herb Ellis.)

I also agree that ES-175 guitars are best purchased in person, or at least with good return privileges. The reason is the use of kerfed bracing on the tops of the guitars. Gibson did this in the 50s-70s, or so, because it was a production cost savings, compared with fitting carved braces to the top. I have seen the arch on the top of ES-125 and 175 guitars drop (flatten) over time due to these braces. This isn't always a deal breaker--some of the best sounding/playing 175 guitars are older ones with _some_ top drop. Still, it's best when the top is in good shape. (My '68 had an excellent arch.)

One thing is certain: the ES-175 is one of the sweetest sounding and playing voices in jazz guitar.

[lawson-stone]

While this or that ES175 might not be "my" guitar, I have rarely seen one that wouldn't be loved by somebody. Their goodness seems variable, not so much in quality, but in appeal. My VOS1959 model to some sounds "bright" but to me it just sounds a little "hot" with a bit more dig-in feel, a tad more dirt, though I have learned to make it purr as well as growl. I had a 175 back in the 1990's that I thought was not so great, but I dug out recordings of me playing it, and to my amazement, my playing sounds way better than I recalled it, and the guitar sounds wonderful (to my ear). I just missed it at the time.

So I tend to think if you can get a solid ES175 at a decent price, even if in the end it doesn't grab your heart, hang on to it, because either (a) your heart will change or (b) you'll find someone else for whom it's "the" guitar and you can sell it, make a fair profit, and delight another player.

I imagine there are universal dogs among the ES175 population, but so far I actually haven't found one, just guitars that didn't do it for me.

[jdaguitar2]

I had a 2010 es-175 for a few years that never would keep a straight enough truss rod for me. I loved the sound and the instrument overall but never could get it straightened out. It's very much an electric archtop, not a lot of natural acoustic projection as compared to a solid top instrument. Suppression of feedback was a design goal from what I understand. If you want a straight up jazz tone put flatwounds on a 175, use the neck pickup and play through a fender Princeton, deluxe, or twin, that's THE sound to my ears.


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[mr. beaumont]

There are great sounding 175's from many eras...just something to consider though, the neck profiles on some (70's? someone who knows better will chime in) can be very slim. You may love it, it's just something that doesn't work for me personally, so I mention it in case neck profile is something you're particular about too.

[vinlander]

+1 on neck profile inquiry, for me it is a critical thing just after neck width.
It can ruin a good guitar for me, I just sold my SG Standard yesterday after 2 years trying to cope with its rounded '50s to no avail.
My Warmoth parts caster waiting to be assembled, has a bounded thin standard neck very much like my 92 Les Paul slim '60s.

[jim777]

Back in the 80's I had two 175's (doing my best Steve Howe at the time) and couldn't bond with either. On a whim, I got a '78 Ibanez FA-100 and bonded with that instantly. I LOVE that Ibanez and will absolutely never sell it. To be totally honest though, I have no idea if it sounds like an actual 175 or not, just that its a great guitar IMHO.

My point, you might well ask? There are great guitars out there not made by Gibson that look a lot like 175s. But whether they play and sound like one is a different matter. If you've played a Gibson 175 and loved it then you're set, if not, don't assume all the 175 look-a-likes will be the same thing only cheaper. Most are decent, some are great and a very few are superb, but they will not be as consistent (from one brand to another I mean, not within a single brand like Aria or Ibanez) one from the next as the Gibsons tend to be.

[rexi]

excellent point jim777, that is what i have also been thinking. I have 2 eastmans, t186 and an 805ce with a mounted humbucker, i actually sold my Gibson chet atkins tenneseann to get the t186 and don´t regret it at all.

-so i´m not too fixed on any specific brand, just a good guitar. But i haven´t (yet) found a guitar with the 175ish sound that is on par (similar) with the Gibson 175 that i have tried. But that being said, i haven´t tried many gibson 175, just a few but those were very good, and i also haven´t tried many similar guitars from other makers. I will keep looking with an open mind for different brands.

[Herbie]

I live in a country that has about two ES175s for sale per year. Other jazz guitar even less. So I had kept the "play as many You can before buy" and "buy only after playing" rules I would not have had any jazz guitars at all.

And those that I have played without testing have been totally weird in the beginning. Maybe after a month or six months I have understood what they are. My curren no 1 is a VOS 59 which I was about to sell after one year of playing. But then we found each other!

So don't hesitate, buy Your first ES175 now!

Only bad years for me are the standard 2000–> ones. They don't have that weird grommet around the pickup switch, which is an important detail in a 2-pickup jazz guitar IMHO!!

[2bornot2bop]

And don't forget that you can find Gibson L4CES' priced even less than many ES175's...just sayin'

[FredH]

I agree all 175s are not created equal. I got one from 1989 Mahogoney with a fairly slim neck. Best playing guitar I've ever owned. I've played others from the 70s through the early 2000s that disappointed me. But the first time I played my 89, it was love at first site. I have had it since 2010 and the old wood only gets better with age. I plan on taking it with me to the afterlife :>) I got it sight unseen and unplayed from ebay at a great price. But I knew exactly what I was looking for and the previous owner had a satisfactory return policy, so had nothing to lose.

[christianm77]

I'm in love with my 1968 ES175D (which I bought from 55bar). Craig sold it for less (much less) than a brand new one.

Personally, I'd prefer an old instrument that looks like crap and sounds amazing than a new guitar with no soul. That said, my 175 looks lovely, even if someone did carve their initials into it in 1990. It's a player's instrument :-) I'd suggest keeping an eye out for an old one with a few knocks. the good ones get played - right?

The new ones, IMO, are basically not the same guitar. No resonance. Everyone who plays the '68 is surprised at how loud it is unplugged. Not quite real acoustic guitar volume, but remember that Joe Pass miked his on Virtuoso. It has a SOUND.

(I've also tried an L5 of a similar vintage, and that guitar was a LEGIT archtop.)

Gibson I think have forgotten how to really make archtops. They are in the furniture trade now. They can turn out a well made guitar, sure, good build, lovely finishing, great pickups; but the new ones are like a different instrument acoustically. Does it matter? Maybe not. My 175 isn't a smooth modern electric archtop. It has character and quirks. It's bright and airy - evn nasal and twangy.

Might not in fact what you are looking for, but I LOVE it!

(Same goes for the L5's, everything. I would describe this pickup-less instrument and super quiet instrument as essentially useless (tune-o-matic bridge Gibson - really? Have you seen an acoustic archtop before?) for instance, but some people really like the new L5's more electric vibe. Not me.)

Now, a guitar that gets close to this brightness for much less money IMO is the Eastman 371/372 series. Pretty impressive guitars, and definitely worth a try.

Also, Heritage 575.

Also - never try a guitar before you buy or you have a good returns policy.

[Stringswinger]

175's do vary quite a bit in construction, specs (especially the necks) and materials. Even those examples from the same year will vary as no two pieces of wood are the same and different playing styles will break a guitar in differently.

Try before you buy (or buy it right enough to resell without taking a big loss).

In general, if you like slim necks (1960-1982)

If you like fat necks (1949-1959, 1983-present)

If you like a somewhat "acoustic" sounding electric archtop (1949-1970 with the single PUP variant being the most acoustic.

If you are on a budget get an ES165 with the built in PUP.

There are other brands (Guild, Eastman, Ibanez, D'Angelico, Gretsch) that will cost less, but none sound like a 175

There are more costly hand made 16 inch laminate electric guitars from Jimmy D'Aquisto on forward that will cost more and still sound nothing like a 175.

A fine 175 is all the jazz guitar one needs, and if your budget is 3K, you can find one. Good luck!

[skykomishone]

And don't forget that you can find Gibson L4CES' priced even less than many ES175's...just sayin'

2B, I can't believe it's still there. What a great deal. If I hadn't just bought the '55 175, and Jack's Martin, I'd have been all over that guitar. Just Wow! The OP would be getting the best deal around!

Merry Christmas Bro!

[2bornot2bop]

2B, I can't believe it's still there. What a great deal. If I hadn't just bought the '55 175, and Jack's Martin, I'd have been all over that guitar. Just Wow! The OP would be getting the best deal around!

Merry Christmas Bro!

Me too. Like the ES175, I bought it right, and at $3k selling it for what I have into it. Not bad for a Mahogany L4CES. It'll be my keeper 'til it sells

Happy Holidaze BRO!

[Dutchbopper]

Here's my 175 in action. Recorded it a while ago.

Regards,

DB

[rexi]

ahh thanks for posting dutchbopper! fantastic tone

[Dutchbopper]

ahh thanks for posting dutchbopper! fantastic tone

Thanks. Yes, mine has great tone. It's a 1982 model. It must be one of the earliest mahogany neck/back/sides 175 ever made by Gibson. If you check the internet for mahogany 175s you usually see 1983 as first year of production.

The mahogany 175 really sound a bit nicer to my ears than maple topped ones. A bit darker and woodier. Jack Zucker is playing one too. I think they were made until 1990.

A mahogany 175 is probably one of the unsung Norlin heroes!

Mine is called Joe. I wrote a Blog entry about him. Click here if you are interested.

Regards,

DB

[yebdox]

I have no opinion about this, really, but I was amused that someone remarked that 'it must be the old wood' or words to that effect when speaking about a Lam top 175 from 1989!

I don't think we should try to set rules about what should or shouldn't sound good, so I'm not arguing. If that member loves his guitar, I'm happy. But when people (in general) rhapsodize about old wood, cured properly, old growth, straight grain, seasoned, aged to perfection, I get caught up in the fantasy and envision following some Gepetto-like builder around his ancient shop, while he carefully picks up and reverently inspects a dusty blank of fragrant spruce or maple, as I sip hot chocolate laced with schnapps and dream of the amazing axe he's going to build for me that will practically play itself.

Pressed top laminate from corporate assembly line Gibson facilities kind of disturbs that daydream a little. No right or wrong, just not in my fantasy script.

(And I have a 175 VOS, sadowsky JH, GB 10 and a 335, so clearly, I believe in Lam!)

Merry Xmas, y'all!