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mattymel, I hear you on the pass thing. I gotta shut up about it, cuz i'm sure there's plenty of people who think I'm always dissing ol' joe, but man, if you put "talent" and "ear pleasing recordings" on a scale, joe's would be out of balance, IMHO!
Originally Posted by mattymel
As far as the blind test thing, I can speak to that, as over the course of the last five years or so, I've chased some tone dragons (often while telling others to stop!) While some folks jump from guitar to guitar, I've played "amp go round."
So long story short, I'm the owner of a polytone, a henriksen (head only, I use a redstone cab with it) and a zt lunchbox. They all actually serve purposes for me, and certain guitars I own sound better with certain amps, and in certain environments. It's nitpicky, but I'm actually glad I have all three. For example, gigging jazz with my tele, I really like the polytone best. If I gotta take the train, I'm taking the lunchbox whatever guitar I take. It seems like the henriksen is the best for recording--but I'll have to post some things I've been working on to try to prove that
)
Indeed, in the end, I'm shooting for the same general tone from all of them, but they all react differently in different situations...I envy folks who can be happy with one amp in every room they play in! Most of the time, I think, when things aren't sounding good to me, it's probably not the equipment.
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05-10-2010 01:37 PM
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Is there someone who compared loudness of ZT Lunchbox against some other amp like Roland Cube 80X or Fender Frontman 212 etc.
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I use quite a wide range of amplifiers so I've been able to compare the ZT to a few others. It seems to give a similar level of volume to a 30 watt SS amp, so it's comparable to a Cube 30 or a Marshall MG30. It isn't the loudest amp, but for its size it is useful.
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I used to have Cube 30 and it wasn`t loud enough even for a small gigs, so if Lunchbox is not louder than that, I can`t understand that some guys claimed that they played with big bands with horns.
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With the volume absolutely cranked and a little breakup when you dig in on some chords it'll keep up fine with 3-4 horn players. But anything bigger than about an 8 piece band it won't keep up, unless the rhythm section are quiet.
It doesn't work at all for big band (at least in my experience).
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Is it work for rhythm only or you can push trough some solo too?
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For rhythm work in a big band it's fine, sits well in the mix even. However it's hard to cut through for a solo.
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i use an acoustic lunchbox at all my gigs...... for my archtops
for small gigs i use just the amp as is....... meaning thru the built in speaker
but when i play with a loud drummer i have a 1x15" cab i use and drive it with the ZT .... sounds awesome .... and fat
and if i need to be really loud (which is so seldom as a jazz muso ) i just line out to the house PA and i have never had a problem and get great tone ( or lets just say the tone i like) useing the ZT is all gigs....... from intimate to small club to concert stage ......
after getting my ZT acoustic lunchbox .......and let me just say the acoustic lb does have a more jazz sound than the original one ............ so be aware there is a noticable difference and the accoustic one has 2 channels better eq and reverb and still as compact ........ (the supplier loaned me both before i bought and i gig tested both and loved the accoustic one for my needs )
anyway i have since become a huge ZT fan and that acoustic lb is on all of my stages .......and has never let me down .....
love the fact that the amp is tiny/lightweight /fully featured/ can be used as a stand alone amp or as a head with cab........
but look at the acoustic lb ......... before you buy they radically different .then decide depending on your needs
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I am intending to use it with FX pedals, so I wonder which is better for that, acoustic or normal version?
I am not a jazz player, mostly I play blues, rock and hard rock (I am an old school player
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definitely sounds like you'd enjoy the original more.
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I bought myself a Lunchbox for Christmas.
First impressions:
- Massively overbuilt - you could probably knock out a rhino without damaging it.
- Unbelievably light. Twice the wattage of my Polytone at half the weight.
- Incredibly loud. Seems like it could hold its own at jam sessions or small gigs
After playing a bit:
- It's a bit bright/nasal. I need to run the tone controls on the amp and on my guitars to the bass side. This could be because the speaker is new and not broken in, or it could be a general tonal characteristic of the amp. Even so, it's not a bad sound.
- I really wish it had reverb.
- Plugged it into my 1X12 Mesa Theile cab. This gives it more umph in the bass and a very satisfying cab thump. The Ambience control helps to open the sound up a bit. I'm running it at about 11:00.
- With a little tweaking, I was able to get a very nice jazz tone out of my Strat. It still had a distinctively Stratty sound, but was full enough to be a credible jazz tone.
Overall thoughts:
- This is a jam session dream. At 15 pounds, there's no reason not to throw it in the car at a moment's notice.
- I'm not sure that I'd gig with it unless the tone mellows out as the speaker breaks in. My Polytone sounds fuller and rounder without the honk in the upper mids.
- I'm looking forward to testing it out with a delay and/or reverb pedal in front of it.
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I had one during my "travels." I generally had the same impression and ultimately ended up selling / swapping mine for a random assortment of Cubes, Quilters and a recent CL'd Henriksen.
I thought it was at its best in a mix with drums and other instrumentation where it could hang in a nice midrange/upper range. It did have a nasal-ly sound to me though and it was hard to dampen. I found that the smaller cubes (like my old Cube 30 or my Cube 80XL practice amp were more versatile and offered just about as much economy/portability...well, at least the 30 does).
The Henriksen/Quilter stuff is in a different league sound-wise (as was the AI gear that I used to own).
Overall though, it's a perfect "grab and go" leave in the car as a safety net type amp. Yes, with the right patience and guitar/amp settings, you can get a very passable tone.
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I tried the Lunchbox for a few days, owned a Club for a while, and now have a Lunchbox Acoustic (which mysteriously died the other day, but I'm sure ZT will fix it under warranty).
Both the Lunchbox and the Club have incredible weight/size-to-volume ratios. I didn't really like the nasal mid-rangey sound of the Lunchbox, but it sure could cut through, even in a band rehearsal. The Club was a bit dry sounding, but if moved off the floor, tonally well balanced. And it could effortlessly handle any performance volume requirement I encountered. The Lunchbox Acoustic is not particularly loud, but it sounds great with my archtop, has 2 channels, and better reverb than the Club, and it still weighs only 12 pounds. (I think the original Lunchbox is just under 10 pounds.) I've actually gigged with it in low volume contexts a few times with excellent results.
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well i am a ZT user and own a ZT acoustic lunchbox and a ZT club .... and i use them almost exclusively cos they so light and touch wood neither has given any trouble in hard gigging conditions (Tom sorry to hear your LBA died, hope it's something small)
i am a pro muso and use the ZT's with my archtop/tele/thinline.... and it sounds great with all
at the moment i am doing a residency (as a muso ) at the famous Sun City resort in south africa and my acoustic lunchbox is gigged 3 hours a day consistantly ... i play venues from small restaurants(100) to huge restaurants (500 people) and for bigger gigs just line out the LBA to a powered PA speaker or two
anyway my ZT's give me good jazz tone/ light weight cos i move gear daily and they werent expensive ....
so yes i will agree the "original" lunchbox tonally is not as good as the LBA or the club for jazz ...i gigged one for a while before deciding on the LBA ....
BUT and this is what i tell everyone about the ZT's who ask .... owning a ZT requires a slightly different mindset , and this goes even or especially for the original one.... "think of the lunchbox as an amp head that has a speaker attatched for convenience /emergency/rehearsal ect ...BUt if you want the best out of your lunchbox just add the external speaker and i mean any 8ohm cab .... a while back i used my LBA with a super loud drummer... i used a 15' external cab and it was super fat and loud...... or even use a good 1x 10 cab and hear the lunchbox open up .... cos any small 6.5 inch speaker will sound midrangey it's pure science.... BUt add a good external speaker cab and the lunchbox will impress... so think of it as a head that you bought for $200 and now buy a 1x 10 cab and even a reverb pedal and for less than most boutique amps you'll have a 100W (manual says 130W ) amp that sounds great and is lightweight and compact
so yeah when i read reviews about the lunchbox and how some boutique amp costing 5 - times the price sounds better i just shake my head ...cos of course it will .... thats what you paying for .... so think lunchbox by itself as a practise tool/or small gig amp (like i do) and then add a 1x10 or even a 4x12 and the amp will lose all the nasaly tone and sound huge.... and add a reverb if you want one.... but that whole package will be cheaper and sound incredible and also be lightweight ...and don't forget high powered cos weight wise (lunchbox + reverb pedal + 1x 10 cab ) you will have about the same weight as a roland 30w cube BUT with 3x the power (headroom)
a lunch box will never sound better than your mambo or AI or henriksen but it will give you giggable jazz tone if you want it for a fraction of the cost .....Last edited by Keira Witherkay; 12-26-2013 at 05:10 PM.
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I'm thinking at this point, I might return the LB. (If I can find the receipt). That nasal honk really gets on my nerves after a few minutes.
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Try an equal pedal.
That said, I never use my lunchbox for playing by myself. But with a group, the tone works great.
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I have an acoustic Lunchbox and I've gigged it with gypsy guitar and it's really loud for such a tiny little box, but I don't like it for practice because it's pretty hissy. These days I use a Phil Jones Briefcase for my gypsy amplification needs. For my archtops, it's Fender all the way
I personally don't like using head/ext. cabinet systems, preferring combos instead. To me, using an extension cab with the Lunchbox to get a fuller sound defeats the purpose -- i.e. ultra-portability. A combo is one less trip to the car compared with a head and ext. cab.
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I have a ZT Lunchbox and love the tone I get out of it. I run a TC Electronics HOF Mini Reverb in front of it. At some point I plan to get the extra speaker cabinet to go with it.
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With a reverb pedal and an extension cab, my ZT LB sounds quite full. However, if I'm going to the trouble of carting all of that around, I far prefer my Polytone Mini Brain and a simple 1x12 I built. The Polytone has reverb that sounds quite good when wound up, and overall I prefer its tone.
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Originally Posted by D.G.
hissy? thats quite odd since my LBA has maybe a bit of noise but definitely not hissy that it would make soft practising uncomfortable.... but maybe yours ears are just more sensitive in the upper range which is quite likely ... but my LBA is as quiet as any ss amp i have used and definetly a lot quieter (when just left on ) than a princeton or DLR which i have used ...what i do hate is both my ZT club and LBA have a pop when i switch on or off...irritates me to bits
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That apparently comes with the ZT territory Originally Posted by Keira Witherkay
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There’s a loud ‘pop’ noise when I turn the amp on and off. Will that damage the amp?
No, the noise is perfectly normal. It’s essentially the result of switching on or off an incredible amount of power in an instant. This does not damage the speaker at all.
http://www.ztamplifiers.com/support/faq.html
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My AI Corus has always popped when I turn it off, too. It's a little disconcerting at first, doesn't seem to hurt anything. I guess that's just part of the territory for high powered SS amps.
I'd love to try an LBA, but nobody in my area seems to actually carry them. And I'm only about 100 miles from the company HQ.
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Along with Tom Karol, I took part in the ZT Lunchbox and Club evaluations. I greatly preferred the sound of my Blues Jr NOS. The Lunchbox was a little shrill and the Club worked as an ensemble amp, but not so well solo. If the form factor were removed from the equation, I wouldn't care for either one.
Ultimately I traded off the BJ after I acquired a Fender Jazzmaster Ultralight; in my music room I use a Deluxe Reverb reissue head plugged into a Weber California Ceramic 15 cabinet. The former is almost as portable as the Lunchbox or Club, and sounds so much better. The latter sounds best of all, and doesn't have to be moved.
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I find the excitement over LunchBox has died down and they really need to come up with something new. I wrote them ages ago that there is a big Jazz market for small full sounding amps they are mid-range heavy with a small speaker that's how they cut thru a mix. That something like their ZT Club amp with 8 or 10" speaker. a tone stack with middle control, and decent reverb would be a good selling amp. They also need to do something about their production, they have the amps made in China in very large batches to keep costs down. Problem is they get quite a few bad amps, they customer service is good as replacing bad amps, but it is a frustration. I went thru three Lunchbox Acoustic before I finally gave up and got my money back.
Be sure to checkout the Quilter Tone Block 200 before you commit to the LunchBox it's a lot of amp in a small package.
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A student of mine had one (original lunchbox) when they first came out. He ended up never using it, he prefered his Super Champ. I agree, it was a dry, boxy sounding little amp with no substantial low end at all. A local player a few years ago that I heard occasionally on the scene had the 1x12 Lunchbox Club, and it was better than the original, but nothing special IMO. I'd rather hear an old Polytone or a Deluxe Reverb. I suppose they will continue to appeal to a few players based on either size or wattage (greatly exaggerated IMO.)
On the subject of small Jazz amps, I tried a Mark jazz amp today, a little cream colored amp with what appears to be an 8" speaker with a foam surround. It was mediocre. The bottom end was not as satisfying as my Polytone Baby Brute, and the mids were blah sounding. It was not nearly as loud as I expected. The price was about $600, so I was disappointed. I will say that, for such a tiny thing, the reverb wasn't too awful. It still sounded far far better than the lunchbox amps I've heard.
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