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My first guitar gig ever was jazz on a Paul with a sax player, it can work very well.
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05-31-2013 01:57 PM
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No doubt they are fine enough guitars for jazz. I have no problem with that. You can play jazz on any guitar, really, if it's intonation is ok.
My problem with Les Pauls is the 10,000,000 gimmicky types there. How can one cost $800 and another $5000? Makes no sense to me. How much is due to marketing? Personally, I've never gotten past to the Gibson marketing hype.
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There are millions of Les Pauls in existence, so buying used is easy. The decisions were quite simple once I had played a bunch of them and figured out what I liked best in terms of feel, playability and sound. That allowed me to ignore the noise and seek the ones I wanted.
I don't use them for jazz, but I can easily get a suitably lush sound out of any of my Les Pauls when it's called for, usually when a chick singer sitting in at a rock/blues gig calls a standard.Last edited by Hammertone; 06-01-2013 at 12:24 AM.
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I bet Les Paul would be turning in his grave if he knew some folks were using his guitar for jazz....
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I have epiphone LP studio. The sound is really nice but not jazzy... I'm using d'addario 11 rounds.
I don't like neck pickup tone rolled off. It doesn't really give me jazz tone and all I do is making it trying to be a jazz tone but it isn't. It gets very quiet and more like "half-muted" with tone rolled off... If I roll it off half way then highs don't sound right... I just can't find the right sound for jazz.. and that's why I think Les Paul is perfect for blues and rock. Little bit of gain and you got that blues sound, it's just what you want. Give it more drive and you got AC/DC sound, give it insane drive and you can go to metal if you like...
Now, I don't know how good all the high end gibson LPs sound for jazz or even epiphones with P90s, I haven't played them, but what I heard is pretty much the same...
I prefer tele for jazz. tele's single coil may give you more jazzy sound than LPs humbucker.
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i just noticed that you never hear about the les paul as viable option for a clean guitar, let alone a jazz guitar. yet teles and such come up all the time. i see it as a misconception, or user error, perhaps. not that you should run out and get one for this sort of thing, but i figured that if you already have a les paul lying around, give it a shot.
i figured the weight would be a big issue with you guys. i know how lazy you all are, with your 6.5 lb guitars and your 15 lb amps.
but since most of you guys do this sort of thing sitting down, i think that is largely mitigated.
as for mine, its a bit over 9lbs, which i think is toward the top of the medium weight range for a les paul. ive dealt with a few over 10lbs and it became a problem. but i've put rs pots/caps, a callaham bridge and a swapped out the bridge pickup and it sounds amazing. lots of depth and overtones and all that. "piano like" is a vague term that gets overused a lot, but that kind of describes it a bit. i definitely recommend the callaham and tearing out the guts if you have one. its simply a different instrument now, one that i like so much more.
to address (acceptable) "jazz tone"- well, i guess i can't speak to what that is or isn't. i just find a tone that i like and then i play what i like. but i don't think its too far off from what i've heard in that milieu. i'm not after someone else's sound. i'm not trying to recreate the past (nor am i denigrating those that are, because there is a lot of that out there with guitarists of all stripes).
for some reason, i'm against the idea of chambering a les paul, but i've never heard or played one. i guess i see it as a neither/nor kind of thing. i'd rather have a les paul and a sheraton/335 than something somewhere in between, like a 339 or those heritage milleniums or whatever. i could be wrong. i wouldn't know. i like my guitars to be drastically different, and not variations on a theme. it assuages my guilt about having more than i need.
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My Les Paul Supreme (chambered) was still too heavy standing, and unbalanced sitting. So I sold it.
My SG (fat neck) is better in both circumstances, although neither of these guitars is as nice as my ES-175s.
The SG is seriously overlooked for jazz - the mahogany body makes for a very clear, resonant tone and is much nicer than a tele.
Check out Anthony John on Youtube.
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Times have definitely changed. I purchased my Les Paul in 1968, that was the year they changed back to the traditional LP body from the (Mary Ford inspired) SG style body. Gibson only made two models in 68, The Standard - gold top with P90s or The Custom - black (beauty) with gold humbuckers and gold hardware, both were referred to as re-issue models. I still have the LP, and the P90s growl compared to every other pick-up, single coil or humbucker, I have - it's a great guitar.
Originally Posted by NSJ
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There are so many models of the big name guitars. I just checked Gibson & Fender web sites:
Les Paul versions = 146 (USA, Custom and Epi)
Tele versions = 97 (Fender, Custom Shop and Squier)
Strat versions = 131 (ditto)
A grand total of 374! I know they do it to gave guitars at all prices points, and choice is good, but that makes my head spin. We don't need that many different kinds of ketchup.
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Mmmm....ketchup......
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Unusual number of wraparound bridges there. The one on the left isn't a Gibby, is it?
Love the custom! Original?
Little info, please!
Nice collection!
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I like the big necks.
Left to right:
- Guitar Clinic
- '94 R4BB
- '06 CR4JB (Chambered, Jeff Beck)
- '04 R4TQ (Tonequest)
- '97 R4GT
Wraptail? Unusual?
It's a better design, and there are various intonatable wraptail designs available for those who care about such things. Intonation on these is good enough for me.
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That is a VERY tasteful collection. That Tonequest is semi-mythical. I've certainly never seen one. Originally Posted by Hammertone
I just meant it was surprising for one person to have so many wraptails.
I've suspected they might sound better, but I'm not sure it's a better "design." Even with the intonation option. The strings pull at the bridge at a funny angle. 90 percent of the time it works, but if the wood isn't stable, it can cause problems. I believe that was the reason Gibson abandoned it for the stoptail. Fewer warranty claims.
Anyway, my LP has a wraparound and I love it, so I'm with you.
The BB must be VOS? It's fabulous.
I can't imagine a better collection! Best with it.
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The R4TQ is very unassuming.
The editors of Tonequest agreed that their ultimate Les Paul would be a Jeff Beck model with covered pickups, GT finish, and standard tuners.
And a really big neck.
The TQs all hover around 9 lbs. This one is 8.8 lbs.
When a nice one came up.....carpe diem.
The R4BB predates the concept of VOS.
It's from 1994.
It weighs 8 1/2 lbs.Last edited by Hammertone; 06-07-2013 at 11:08 AM.
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For those who really are torn between a Les Paul and an L-5WES, there's always this:
...a Wes Paul
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you would think it would have a nicer TP
where did you find this?
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Same tailpiece as on the equally cool but less fancy Gibson ES-446, but gold-plated. Originally Posted by SamBooka
It makes sense for such a small-bodied guitar, although I suppose a first generation ES-5 or ES-350-style gold TP would be good as well.
Only two of these were made by Gibson, in 1998.
I saw pix of them at the time and thought they were tres cool.
Florentine-style chambering (which is the same as Cloud 9 and subsequent Gibson CS chambering)
This one just showed up at Maverick a couple of weeks back, from the original owner.
Rounded '50's neck, perfect condition (never played), with a Tom Holmes humbucker.
Asking $7,500.
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Hah, I like the reversed HB.
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Mine's a little newer. A '78. P90s sound wonderful for jazz. I like combos of blending both pups. Neck sounds really nice alone. Oddities with this one: Ebony fingerboard and 3pc maple neck.
Oh yeah, it's in the avatar too.
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. Originally Posted by Phlatt Wound
Nothing odd about it - that's a dead stock "Les Paul Pro", produced @1977-1978 with ebony board, maple neck, Schaller tuners. Very cool (albeit heavy) guitars. TRC cover says Pro, right?
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Yep, that's it. Heavy is right. I just never saw any others around. Never saw any other LPs with maple necks. Doesn't mean they aren't out there. I just never saw 'em.
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Hi, I'm kinda new around here, although I've been lurking around for bit. I'm looking to get a guitar that can cover a few different genres like jazz, blues, and maybe even rock, and have been wondering if a Les Paul would fit the bill. But while I've seen plenty of posts around here about archtops (understandable), I don't think I've seen any posts about Les Pauls. Does anyone here use one for jazz? How does it work? And if you do, of the many pickups Gibson offers for Les Paul, which? Thanks!
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If you search Ulf Wakenius with Pat Metheny or Oscar Peterson, he plays a Les Paul copy in those clips. Many others can be found playing jazz pieces on a Les Paul(like) guitar but it is used less frequently than a Tele or Strat I believe.
There is no special Les Paul Jazz pickup I think. Even the hot ones can be turned down and made suitable for cleaner sounds.
Originally Posted by kenhan
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I've seen a clip of Jim Hall playing a Les Paul guitar in an early TV appearance with Chico Hamilton.
Pat Martino played a Les Paul guitar in his early career, I think it was stolen. He still plays what could be considered a Les Paul copy.
The Benedetto Benny is an expensive Les Paul copy.
http://benedettoguitars.com/guitars/...enny%E2%84%A2/
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