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I just came across a online shop where tone capacitors in a price range from 32 to 59 euros are sold. The one i built in my LeGrand cost me probably less than 1 euro (can't remember exactly as it was a few years ago). Now i wonder if i missed anything - what makes these expensive ones better (sound wise) than an average cap, and wouldn't there be any more reasonable priced options in the same league?
for Gibson* guitars
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11-29-2015 10:45 AM
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I have some that are 3x better than those for 1/2 the price. Minimum order 1,100 :-)
Seriously, No! they won't make your guitar sound better.
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what makes it better to someone is that they were dumb enough to pay 59 euros for it. that's all.
Originally Posted by JazzNote
in my limited experience, there is a very slight, negligible different between cap material. there is a lot of difference between cap values. i put the ok to good stuff in there because instead of the average cheap stuff most guys use stock because: a) its annoying to change stuff out in a hollowbody so i'm not doing it again, and b) what's $5-10 of cap worth five, ten, twenty years down the line? i've been fine with rs caps, orange drops and would try emerson ones next, but you won't see me paying for more than that. even the fancy ones that gibson uses is just a regular old cap wearing a cute vintage outfit so they can charge you more for it.
as for the nos ones... well, as with anything electronic that old, the values and sound have drifted somewhat over time. they are further from spec than a brand new one. same deal with old pickup magnets, they gradually get weaker over time. so i would expect the nos ones to sound different than a new stock one. whether that's better is up to your ears, and whether its worth an extra 50 euros is laughable. to me, anyway.
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Just to let you know, those Luxe repro capacitors are just cheap PIO capacitors.
Uncloaking Repro Caps: Luxe and Gibson - MyLesPaul.com
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The outrageous price will at least make you think it sounds better!
https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/insight...fect-its-taste
I think most people buying them are just trying to make the guts of their vintage guitars look original for resale value.Last edited by KirkP; 11-29-2015 at 01:53 PM.
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Tone is the snake oil of the capacitor
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There are manufacturers out there that make obsoleted parts in low volumes. They are priced accordingly for those that want something made to the original specifications. That does not make them better. Companies often buy obsoleted parts at high prices, low volumes, rather than pay for an engineering substitution study and testing.
Danielle
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Originally Posted by mincheol.seo
Very interesting, i wonder how many other "vintage replica" products are not what they look either.
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Expensive caps (and similar items) are valid in one situation: where they are NOS parts being used as a replacement in a vintage instrument or amp and you're trying to keep it as close to original condition as possible to maintain value to collectors. In that situation, the cost/performance ration is not really relevant.
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The signal that goes through the cap on a guitar tone circuit is sent to ground and is never heard. That tells you what you need to know about expensive caps for this purpose.
The bright cap in a Fender amp circuit that is so equipped feeds the highs back into the circuit, so you do hear those frequencies. Conceivably there may be some diffence there in terms of how different caps might sound, but I have doubts about this too.
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Yes, but you have to bear in mind that if they are really NOS parts, they would have cost more like 0.59 Euros/ $/£ at the time. Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
I always can't help smiling at the thought that these " tone for days" expensive caps actually work their magic as the signal is shunted through them to ground, and never heard, as pointed out above. Cheers me right up.
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The Luxe page says:
"Each Cap is handmade, over an audio grade film cap. For sample... The repro paper wrappers and cap-ends are sealed with vintage 40-year-old paraffin (for that extra mojo!) The measurements vary, each cap is the exact size of its authentic counterpart. These really look, smell, and feel like the originals.."
That's marketing language for a cosmetic reproduction of a vintage cap, built around a modern cap. It's interesting they claim that "measurements vary". I guess that means they intentionally use different capacitance values to simulate the poorer quality control in the old days. That seems like a bad idea.
But it's got "mojo", which means it must make you play better.Last edited by KirkP; 11-29-2015 at 04:59 PM.
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A fool and his money are soon parted . . .
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I looked in my Tal this afternoon and was disappointed to see cheap 35 cents ceramic caps in a CS guitar.
I mean come on, they could have put some Sprague drops like I did in my Regent overhaul...it sounds, I mean looks much cooler!
My SG was modified by the previous owner with 500K pots and NOS PIO, it sounds great won't deny but I assume it has more to do with the specs of both the pots and the caps.
With cheap parts % tolerance to specs can vary a lot more.
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Unless you have a "way back machine", what things cost years ago is not meaningful (otherwise a Van Gough painting would be worth about $20). Many people are willing to pay very high prices for vintage instruments but only if they at least appear to be original. Old parts are in limited supply, and that creates a vastly inflated market for NOS parts. Originally Posted by Franz 1997
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Signal and coupling capacitors are simply not worth that kind of money.
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Not worth it, the caps value will only make a difference. I put vintage russian PIO caps in my les paul because they came with the wiring kit I got. They look cool in there, but it wouldn't sound any worse with caps I can get at radio shack.
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Dunno there, If I had a "vintage" git and someone grabbed a telescoping inspection mirror and told me "Listen here, you don't have the blumonium 1958 original caps in this guitar" I'd probablay kick him in the ass and send him packing :-) Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
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Nah, I would say that those "32 to 59 EUR" capacitors won't do much change in your tone, unless they are one of these
Now, that's what I call a bumblebee cap mojo, isn't it
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Wow. A recently made 50 cent capacitor hidden inside an old-looking plastic shell.
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Gibson L-5, for one. Originally Posted by JazzNote
Bwahahahahahahahaha!
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No way, nobody would do that, Oh hang on, some people are paying $60 for one? Maybe I should be looking into a lacquering machine for dipping caps right now! Originally Posted by va3ux
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this may be true, but my 2003 L5CES definitely sounds better now than my 72 L5CES and much better than my 67 L5CES did, so i don't really care about that ;-). Originally Posted by Hammertone
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In the interests of personal research I've fitted orange drop, ceramic disc and a not too expensive PIO cap in turn in one of my teles. I like to think I have reasonably 'good' ears, but I don't think there was a significant difference in response - not that I expected there to be. I think Cunamara is right. I have however changed the 'bright' caps in my Fender amps from ceramic to silver mica and I do hear the difference there. Definitely a sweeter brightness.
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In an amp a capacitor can make a difference to the tone but not in a guitar it is only acting as a type of filter, the capacitor value will have an effect.
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