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Finally I got my guitar.
An Eastman AR 371 CE
Buying an eastman in France is hard as hell, no one is carrying any stock, I wasn't able to try an AR 403 anywhere nor an AR 503 or an El Rey. Only AR 371 or T386 or expensive models way beyond my pricepoint.
My guitar has the odd pup placement where it's not located directly close to the bridge, looks odd but I hadn't much of a choice.
Without this forum I would have done the easy thing and would have bought an Ibanez or a Peerless which are commonly available. But now I have an eastman archtop and all I need is some practice.
The guitar itself cost me 750€ but I had to shell out about 200€ in train fares just to be able to find a shop that had it. If you want a lead to cool guitar shops near paris send me a MP.Last edited by Gibouille; 01-04-2013 at 06:00 AM.
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01-04-2013 05:54 AM
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hello Gibouille,
Originally Posted by Gibouille
what a trip to this guitar! where did you buy it (I'm interested I live in France), I'm interested too by your guitar shops "around Paris" list.
I have a guitar with the same P.U. location (Ibanez JP 20), at least one of the Herb Ellis models (Gibson) has the same too, some people think it has an effect on the sound, some not (my luthier for instance), it's not so odd, it's "specific"!
I hope the neck fits you (Ibanez AF is a bit sticky) and the body depth too, what eventually decided you to buy your Eastman?
I hope that you won't feel disappointed and enjoy playing your new instrument and that you learned a lot of things about jazz guitars (and guitar forums) during your "quête du Graal"
bon courage!
french Michel
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I was going for an eastman because I have some (basic) classical background so I play fingerstyle and I like a wider nut. Originally Posted by tootZ
The only eastmans (eastmen ?) I coud try were AR371CE, T386 and others which were way beyond my pricepoint (I would have been ready to pay for an AR 403 but I could never find this guitar)
So the choice was AR371 or T386
After a long trip by Train then metro then suburb train then bus... I was exhausted and had a headache I needed to take a simple decision.
I didn't like the T386, a heavy guitar, I didn't know how to grab it and it sounded too metalic unplugged.
Also finally what's the point of having a guitar that can do "a little bit of jazz and a little bit of blues" I wouldn't use the same type of strings anyway, so If I ever want to play something else than jazz, I'll get myself a telecaster (maybe add a warmoth neck) and put some roundwound strings on it.
The T386 would have had the added benefit of fitting a "fusion" kind of sound... but the AR371 felt better. Also I don't listen to fusion a lot so I may not want to play it much and if I do... I'll get myself a solid body, some are pretty cheap and are playable.
Since I wasn't going to wait a few more weeks and spend a few more hundred euro in train and I had to return the ibanez anyway... I took the eastman, simple as that.
For two thirds of the price I could have had a used one In Paris but I am not experienced enough to detect the flaws in a guitar right away so I prefer not to buy used unless it's from a close trusted friend.
About the shops I recommend I'll send you a PM because I don't know what the forum policy is about recommending specific businesses.Last edited by Gibouille; 01-04-2013 at 11:07 AM. Reason: syntax
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Hi!
I`m going to buy myself a new jazz guitar, and being my first hollowbody guitar, i want it to be cheap (about $1000 budget). I had read like thousands of of topics and heard many yt records of Ibanezes, Epiphones and so on, but i could not find THAT ONE. Loving the sound of Wes Montgomerys` Gib. L-5 (and the L5 in general), i would want to get really dark, like muted sound. Peerless Monarch is the one i am thinking about by the way. So i have decided to write here and maybe one of you guys know the guitar which suits my HUGE needs. Any variations (like switching pickups etc.) are much appreciated.
Thanks
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My humble but long experienced opinion would be to find a good reliable jazz box, used will keep the price down, Ibanez, Guild, Epi, Samick are nice candidates; Epiphone Zephyr Regent is my favourite candidate, or another decent well constructed Asian production model, and play it, try it out. If it feels good acoustically, if you feel a connection with the feel, weight, balance, response, inspiration you get, then get it and change the pickup. To what? Tailor that choice to the guitar. Don't take somebody else's advice merely because they have their own favourites in their guitar.
A good feel will make you want to pick up the instrument, a good pickup will reward you with the sound you're looking for. That's my advice.
I had a really nice old Gibson, but one day I was in a music store, they had an Epi Zephyr Regent, like a single pu 175, and I fell in love with the compact feel, easy access and general vibe. I didn't so much care for the stock pickup. I picked it up the next week, put a duncan jazz in it and it was absolutely perfect for me. Other people like a warmer pickup sound, not so acoustic... so it's a personal choice. If possible, put everyone else's advice aside at some point and try a bunch out yourself. Good luck!
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The sound is not so much in the guitar in itself as it is in the setup, strings, pick, playing style, picking position, amp settings etc. With a suitable setup, even a Strat can sound very warm, jazzy and "un-Stratty" (I know, I have one myself set up for jazz). A Gibson L5 WesMo is a fine guitar but it won't make you sound like Wes. Wes would have sounded very much like himself on anything. On one of his recordings, he plays a six string solid body bass/baritone guitar - and guess what, it sounds like Wes. There was a post here a little while ago where several different guitars were played side by side by the same player. The were all sounding much the same - because the player had them set up the same way and played them the same way. When Wes got that "dark" tone (which was not so dark after all, it just had a different attack) it was not due to the guitar but to his use of the thumb instead of a pick. Jim Hall used a Les Paul Custom at one point of his carreer.
I think you will get a long way with the Peerless, Epiphone or Ibanez that you mention. After getting a guitar, experiment with strings, picks and you playing style. Medium gauge flatwound strings and a fairly thick pick could be what you'd like to try out. A later pickup swap can also be an option when you have worked your way through strings and picks - but not before that. There are differencies bstween different pickup, but they are less than many prefer to believe, and most pickup swaps won't change things more than what a minor turn of a tone knob on the amp could have provided. Strings, picks and playing style affects the sound much, much more than the pickup.
I even venture to suggest that before buying a new guitar, you could experiment with the guitar(s) you have alredy to see how you can get a jazzier tone. I figure it must be a solid body (?). Try heavier flatwounds, for example D'Addario Chromes 12-56 or Thomastik Infeld Swing 13-53 (those are two high quality safe bets which are commonly available, at least from web shops). Use a heavier pick, for example Dunlop Jazztone, Dunlop Jazz III, D'Andrea Proplec, Planet Waves Icepick heavy or extra heavy. Use the neck pickup only and pick more or less over it. Currently I use D'Daddario Chromes 13-56 (with 13 and 17 replaced by 14 and 18 but that's an aquired taste) and a D'Andrea Proplec 358 pick (small teardrop shape which many will find too small, but most picks come in several sizes and shapes). In the end, you may well find that your mileage varies from what other people recommends. For example, I have a higher than average string high action on my guitars, because I find that it gives a cleaner tone (no slap and buzz) - with a wider dynamic range as an added benefit. The fretting resistance is harder, but one gets used to that.Last edited by oldane; 01-06-2013 at 08:56 AM.
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the peerless is a much better guitar than a current epiphone or ibanez art core.
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Yes, if talking about build quality, but mayby not when we speak about the tone the OP wants. I believe he can have that with an Ibanez or Epiphone too. The Peerless Monarch is also almost three times as expensive as the lower end Ibanez and Epiphone guitars (and abit above the OPs maximum).
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Peerless and Eastman might be in the mix, but if you have a chance to check out The Loar. It's another in the range low-cost, Asian jazz boxes. Eastman also make a nice ES-175 single pickup clone for under $1000.
You really have to sit down and play them to see what you like. You may not like one in a particular shop but like the same model in another.
As far as Peerless goes, where do you find them other than NY and Chicago?
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Good advice. And I too have a Epi Zephyr Regent (1998) and feel the same way about it that you do. Originally Posted by SearchForMeaning
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Mr Beaumont, Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Did you have a particular Peerless in mind?
By the way, the fit of their cases (at least here in Oz Land) is woeful.
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I live in the Midwest and Peerless and Eastman are not available outside Chicago. A local shop does sell Heritage, which is a bit above your price range and likely hard to find in Europe.
Among the guitars easily available in Europe I would check out Epiphone, Ibanez, Washburn, Hagstrom and Hofner. Also Godin. A upgrade in strings and maybe pickup will likely get you the sound you're looking for.
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Have a look at the Eastman 371. With the right combination of technique, pick, strings, amp settings, ... it is capable of a lot.
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That strange. I have a Peerless Renaissance and the factory case is a perfect fit. And it's a decent case too. Being a '335 type' guitar, maybe it's easier to get a perfect fitting case from suppliers than it is for some of the other models. Originally Posted by MaxT
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hi everyone,
i'm a bass player, in school for music education. long story short, i just got a job as a guitar teacher recently.
half of my students have nicer guitars than i do. i play a beat-to-hell squire thats literally falling apart. it sounds awful, too.
so i need a better guitar, and i decided i'd like an archtop. something with a nice jazz sound, but it's not my primary instrument so i have no need to spend crazy money. one pickup is fine.. two is cool, also. i'll probably put flats on it.
i could spend around $900 or so, but would rather try and keep this under $600 if i can. even something thats good value (used) in the $300 range i'd be happy to go for.
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If you're looking for a good deal AND inexpensive the most surprising guitar I have ever bought was the Dean Palomino. I got mine for $300. It has three P90's and is as warm a sounding as you can get with those pups. There's always a few on Ebay ~$450 with a best offer option and free shipping.
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The AR371 is not carved, it's one of the laminate models Eastman introduced last year (the other is the AR403). It's gotten pretty good reviews - do a search on the site and you'll find it. Originally Posted by Groooooove
Don't know about the Agile, although I would doubt it's carved at that price. I know a couple of people who have had that brand (although not that model) who have been favorably impressed with the quality and playability. Price seems high to me, though... I'm not sure it sold for that much new.
In your price range, you might also look at the Epiphones and the Hagstroms.
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I've had good luck buying guitars on EBay, but it's a little iffy to buy a guitar site unseen. That said, I'd second the Godin Kingpin and also throw in the Epiphone Joe Pass - both can be had for $400-450 used.
A lot of folks here like Ibanez archtops - Artcore series, etc. There seem to be a good selection of those around town. I wouldn't hesitate to replace pickups on an Ibanez or Epiphone if I wasn't happy with the stock setup.
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Definitely. Originally Posted by Groooooove
Laura and Quiet Room (the electric) on my website are a single pickup Kingpin. Gray Seargeant, who plays with Tony Bennett, uses one, and check out our own member here Sylvain Courtney.
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Well I have two of the Eastman 371s and thoroughly love them.
Other suggestions on here that I like for what you want are the Oscar Schmidt OE40, Godin Kingpin, Hagstrom 550, and Epi Joe Pass.
If it's just an occasional-use guitar, then the OE40 and the Joe Pass can be found used pretty frequently for less than $350.
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Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
nice sound, awesome playing. especially on laura.
whats a "good deal" on them? i can't seem to find any for less than $600.
i'm still very in love with the sound here;
but am hesitant to spend that much.. however.. that tone is (to my, less-discerning orchestral bassists ears) complete perfection. i guess if i wanted a sound like that even cheaper i'd be asking far too much, eh?
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I feel fairly qualified to comment on your specific choices, since I own an AR-371 and also own a higher-end Agile LP copy.
I love the AR-371. It will definitely serve the purpose you describe and will be readily available on the web for less than $900. Mine projects well acoustically (with a pick) and I consider it to be an excellent value for its price range.
Higher-end Agile guitars are also unbelievable values for the money. I love my LP copy to death and there are definitely people who swear by this brand as the best "steal" on the market.
The Cool Cat I believe is made more along the lines of a Gretsch hollow body aimed more at rockabilly than pure jazz as compared to the AR-371, which is a classic laminate, single pickup archtop. So if that makes a difference to you, I'd consider that factor... Though I could be wrong about that, they did offer a few Cool Cats with Bigsbys a few years ago.
The issue for the Cool Cat may be availability. But, if you can find one on the Rondo site I'd definitely buy it there since you can basically return it, no questions asked.
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If you want something that will command the respect of your students and sound good, I would recomend just getting a nice solidbody for the same money rather than a "cheap" archtop. You can still get the jazz tones if you know what you're doing, and have a lot more vesatility.
If I were buying an archtop I would have the budget for a nice one, but with your budget you can get a nice solidbody.
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i went with the eastman for $680 off of ebay.
im sure i'll be happy with it.
thanks for all the input guys,
t
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sorry for the offtopic but what do you guys have to say about Washburn J5?
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