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Apparently my personal ship of tone turns very slowly but I seem to be nearing the completion of my conversion back to archtops after 20 years of solid body and semi-solid body guitars. I've made peace with my long scale Heritage H575 and my tonal search has been changing to adapt to that guitar. I no longer feel nearly as compelled to use amplifiers that add acoustic content as I did with my non-acoustic guitars. Instead I'm looking for amps that will do a better job of documenting the acoustic content that the guitar already has. To that end, I'm really happy with my Raezer's Edge Stealth 10 (although I wish I still had my RE NY8 as well) but it's been a struggle finding the right amp for the cab and the guitar.
Based at least in part on some comments made by members here and a couple of private conversations (thanks Mehmet), I picked up what I was hoping would be two likely candidates: first the Gallien Krueger MB200, which I've now had for about ten days and then the Carvin BX250.
These two amps have a lot in common: they are both actually bass micro-amps; they are both class D power amps; they both have a "contour" feature that adds some scoop to the tonal response; they both have a line level direct out that can be set to either pre or post (so you can choose to bypass the pre-amp); they both have four way tone controls with separate controls for upper mids and lower mids; they are both small enough and light enough to drop in a gig bag (unike a lot of class D amps, the power supply is built-in to both so there's no bulky external adapter to carry); they are both under $300 retail in the US; and they both have a lot of power.
There are also some significant differences: while they are both small and light weight, the Carvin is much larger and heavier (the Carvin is 3.2 lbs and 3.7" x 7.15" x 10"; the GK is under 2 lbs and 1.75" x 7.75" x 8"); the GK is much simpler but the Carvin has a much more comprehensive feature set (including variable contour, a ground loop and variable level control for the line out; a parametric EQ for both of the mid controls; a compressor; and a drive control. The GK also has a cooling fan while the Carvin use the larger enclosure to eliminate that.
For anyone looking for a winner here, I'm not going to pick one of the other (at least not yet). They both have enough power to really drive the cab well. The variable level control on the line-out on the Carvin is a really handy feature for direct recording (I found the level on the low side on the GK); and the parametric EQ is useful for fine tuning the tone. The GK is an easy winner on the size and weight and is probably the best truly portable solution I've ever come across. Tonally, I like both very much. So it really comes down to need: features vs size. For my purposes, the variable level on the line out makes the Carvin more useful but I'm probably going to keep the GK as a back up where the size makes it incredibly convenient.
I'll add some more recordings later but for now here's a look at the two amps together. The Carvin looks huge when there stacked like this but that's a function of how tiny the GK is.
Thanks to everyone who helped with this and to this forum for all the great info.
EDIT .... Here's a recording of the BX250 using an AT2020 condenser mic. Other than the usual hiss that I can't seem to get rid of, I think it sounds really good. No EQ and no processing.
Last edited by Jim Soloway; 10-29-2014 at 08:38 PM.
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10-28-2014 02:01 PM
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Does turning up the drive control on the Carvin warm or compress things up a bit?
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nice!
It's good that some more people talk about micro bass heads as an inexpansive way of getting a portable amp for jazz. Do you use it with a preamp? It looks like the carvin would perform great without any preamp.
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Man, if they would just throw a decent dig verb in these they would be the bees knees.
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It definitely makes it warmer/hotter. I'm running it at three and I don't feel a need to run it any hotter. It's a warmer setup than I had expected and you can add a lot of warmth with the Parametirc EQ on the hi mids.
Originally Posted by Woody Sound
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No preamp and I don't feel like either of them really need it, at least to for the sound I'm using. Originally Posted by hans halmackenreuter
nice! It's good that some more people talk about micro bass heads as an inexpansive way of getting a portable amp for jazz. Do you use it with a preamp? It looks like the carvin would perform great without any preamp.
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Originally Posted by Woody Sound
I used to think the same way but now I really don't care. There are so many great reverb pedals now that for under $150 you can have way better options than you'll ever get in an amp. I paid $100 US for my TC Electronic Arena and I'm just thrilled with it.
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I like the idea of Carvin with GK as a backup in a jiffy. Or make them stereo with two little cabs spread out (the amps will fit in the back of an open cab) and split the guitar signal with a stereo reverb pedal.
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The small lightweight amp that has me wanting one is built by Jim Demeter "The Mighty Minnie" 100 watts at 8 ohms and 160 watts at 4 ohms. under 5lbs no reverb, but costs $900.00 Actually that's not a bad price if lives up to it's hype. It seems to be getting good press as well!
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Definitely agree, BUT, it would be one less thing (with cables) to carry and hook up. Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
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Very interesting, I've considered getting rid of my traditional combos for a nice 12" speaker cabinet and an assortment of heads for different tones/flavors, especially since I like direct outs for recording. Jim looking forward to your sound tests - as always.
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I've posted about this little guy before. 10", 3.5 lbs. 175w/300w.
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Jim,
Thanks for writing.
I read this a while back and have not had a minute to reply.
I double on bass occasionally so I have a Carvin MB Combo (with the 10"). I bought it to replace an Ibanez Promethean. I had actually been using the Ibanez as my only guitar or bass amp when I re-focused on jazz taking a page from Carol Kaye's book (who doubles on bass and guitar using similar bass amps -- she also uses a GK fyi).
Anyway, the Carvin is ultra portable and the price is ridiculous. It's one of the few amps I never liked flat lined so I found some goofball on a forum that wrote this:
"I’m getting thunderous tone with these settings;
DRIVE on 5 (12:00 or straight up)
CONTOUR at 10:00
TWEETER on DIM
BASS on 3 (like 1:00)
COMPRESSOR at 9:00 (1/4 on for slight compression)
LOW MID FREQ at 100, LOW MID LEVEL on 6.
HI MID FREQ at 450, HIGH MID LEVEL on 6.
TREBLE on 3 (near 10:00).
MASTER to desired volume.
This really makes the amp come to life with deep burly low mids but also punch and clarity."
Anyway, I knobbed that up about 5 years ago and have not really touched it since. Seems to work fine for bass.
As far as guitar goes, I think it's a perfectly fine amp for a solid body straight in. I don't have anything semi or hollow at the moment. I have some more pricey boutiquey stuff like an AI > Redstone setup and a Quilter. The AI setup is a "flatter" system that would work better if I was going for a Martin Taylor thing and really wanted bright acoustic-y sound. The Quilter gets more of a Fender chime, so you can channel Ted Greene with a tele if that's you're deal.
That being said, my Roland Cube 80X gets the most use in the house because it's DEAD silent and it's the easiest to run a line into so I can play along with my iPad and iRealBook.
Back to the Carvin, my most frequent venue is a church where there's "built in" reverb in the venue so I am delighted to grab and go. I can't say enough great things about it as a "do it all" amp.
And lastly, I had that same GK micro head, but the fan noise made me nuts so off it went.
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The "drive" on my carvin (the MB10 combo) is nothing like the the normal "distortion" drive on other amps. Jim's description is accurate. I think it is more like a presence control. The contour is a scoop at 350hz, which is an area where guitar and bass overlap; cutting there can reduce muddiness, and perhaps give you a more blackface tone. I would never claim that this totally replaces a guitar amp, but if you are playing live, you won't feel badly about the tone, and the price, size, and versatility (it will amplify bass, keys, vocals, etc.) make it a good choice for folks who double up with other instruments.
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I tried the MB10 a couple years ago. I couldn't get comfortable with it at all and sent it back after a few days. Running the head with the RE Stealth 10 has been a very different experience (of course it's also with a very different guitar). I should stress that the the Stealth 10 is about as far from a flat response cabinet as I can imagine. When I run a direct line from any device for recording with a second line to the cab, what I hear in the cab and what I hear in the recording are almost unbelievably different. If the sound through the cab seems natural, then the recorded sound will be so bass heavy that it can't possibly be used. On the other hand, EQ'ing appropriately for the Stealth 10 seem to make almost anything amp sound right, especially if it has a lot of power.
And Wiz, that fan is the #1 reason that I ordered the Carvin. I may yet sell the GK and get a second Carvin as a backup. The price makes them almost interchangeable.
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I still don't understand (maybe I'm deaf) the complaints about the fan in the MB200. I've been using it as my only amp for going on 3 years for both guitar and pedal steel and with a variety of cabinets in many different situations from orchestra pit to steel guitar jams and I have never heard the fan - not once - never!! That's why I posted the blurb from the manual about it being temperature controlled. I can't think that I'm not driving it as hard as the rest of you and steel puts a lot on an amp. Even my friends who play C6th tuning with a bottom string in the 0.075" range don't report any problems. I'm just stumped about this.
That little Genz Benz looks interesting - any reviews on it from anyone?
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Is this available as a head only? All I see are combo rigs but it appears to slide out? Originally Posted by Woody Sound
I've posted about this little guy before. 10", 3.5 lbs. 175w/300w.
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There may be some big differences between different MB200's. I know there there have been a few minor feature changes but more importantly I believe the country of manufacture (and I assume some internal parts) has been changed at least once and possibly twice.
Last edited by Jim Soloway; 10-30-2014 at 09:46 AM.
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Here's a recording of the BX250 using an AT2020 condenser mic. Other than the usual hiss that I can't seem to get rid of, I think it sounds really good. No EQ and no processing.
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Sounded real good, Jim! What was the speaker cabinet?
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Yes, you can get the head alone, or an 8" Combo, or a 10" Combo. Originally Posted by Skip Ellis
Shenandoah Compak 300 | GENZ BENZ
Shenandoah Compak 300 | GENZ BENZ
I have the 10" Combo.
-W
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Thanks Skip. That's a Raezer's Edge Stealth 10. I've had it for a few years now and I think it always sounds great. Originally Posted by Skip Ellis
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Jim this sounds really beautiful! I like it a lot!
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Thank Hans. I'm very pleased with the result, enough so that I think it may be worthwhile trying to get a more appropriate mic. I did some testing with the line out on the Carvin and was actually surprised to find that I preferred the Direct out on the GK but the sound in the room is much better with the Carvin (in fact the sound in the room with the Carvin with the Stealth 10 is early wonderful). Originally Posted by hans halmackenreuter
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Apologies. I just found out that Fender bought Genz-Benz, then killed it last year. Originally Posted by Woody Sound
http://www.rexbass.com/2013/11/genz-...4-to-2013.html
Too bad, they had a nice line (the shuttles, etc). I hope Jeff at least made a nice profit. I'm glad I bought my Compak 300 and the AmpSac to fit. Great little carry and go, especially for acoustic stuff. Now to keep it going...
RIP Genz-Benz
Last edited by Woody Sound; 10-31-2014 at 01:24 PM.
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