Yunzhi semi hollow versus Eastman 186mx / 185mx

[ahomer1]

Hi, first time post here. I am in need of some advice and I thought this might be the place to ask. This is a pretty specific question but hopefully I'll get a response!

I've been looking for a 335 style guitar for awhile now and I went to a store the other day and played an Eastman 186mx, which I loved. It had exactly the tone I was looking for. I also played a 1970s Gibson semi hollow, not a 335 but something else I'm not sure, that costed 3500.00 and in my opinion the Eastman sounded better.

The problem is the Eastman costs 1800.00, which I can barely afford. Buying a used one is a possible option, but the ones before mid-2011 don't have Seth Lover pickups, which I think (?) might be important to get the exact sound I want. Also 186s seem to be harder to find used and more expensive than 185s.

I've come up with four possible solutions:
1) Buy a new one and take a bath walking it out the door
2) Wait for a 186 to come on the market, and buy Seth Lovers for it if the sound is too far off
3) Buy a used 185 and upgrade the pickups
4) Buy a Yunzhi and upgrade the pickups. A new Yunzhi costs about 900.00 and I could put Seth Lovers in it for about 100.00. I'm assuming I would also need a luthier to take a look at it and fix it up a little, but with these costs I'm guessing this guitar would cost about 7 to 8 hundred dollars less than a new Eastman.

So my question is basically a two parter:

1) Does anyone have any experience with Yunzhi semi hollows? How might they compare to Eastmans? I know that supposedly one of the former owners of Eastman started Yunzhi and used the same design, so they should be similar...
2) How much of a difference is there between a 185mx and a 186mx in terms of tone? Buying a used 185 seems much easier than a 186.

Thanks a lot



Here is a link to Yunzhis (terrible) website:
Beijing Yunzhi Hengwei Music Instruments Co., Ltd. - Guitar

[Spook410]

No experience with their semi's (someone said they aren't made in the same factory as the hand builts) but you could expect the hardware on the Eastman to be much better.

[ahomer1]

From the website it looks like some are made in the handbuilt factory and some are made somewhere else. They have some super cheap models and some that say "fully hand made"

[spiral]

As both an Eastman and Yunzhi owner (that hasn't played their semi's) i would buy an Eastman any day over a Yunzhi. I also wouldn't get anything with electronics from Yunzhi unless you know you are replacing it all.

I vote: #2 or #3.

Have you looked at an Ibanez Artcore? You can get one very inexpensively used and they play great. Then put in any pickups you want and still pay 1/2 of the Eastman. I actually prefer the neck on my Artcore to my Eastman but the Eastman is a finer piece overall. Hopefully something in there helped.

[ahomer1]

thanks that was a big help. I figured the yunzhi idea was too good to be true. I'll check out an Artcore next time I'm at a shop.

[JSanta]

The Artcore's a really nice for the money you spend. I had an AF105 before I upgraded to an Eastman. The AM93 retails for about $600, and the couple that I have played have been really nice.

The AF105 was part of the "Custom" series, here's the 335 equivalent: Used In Store Used USED IBANEZ ARTCORE AS103 NT WC 344 8.5 08112 | GuitarCenter

[RonD]

Not to derail, but I absolutely love my Eastman T386.

[Rich D.]

Plus 1 on 386.

[Spook410]

If you mean the solid wood models like this one:
cheap price spruce top perfect fully handcraft jazz guitar for sale, View jazz guitar kits, YUNZHI Product Details from Beijing Yunzhi Hengwei Music Instruments Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com

I'm not really familiar with these, though now I'm curious. Not sure what they would be comparable to. It's a completely different animal if a solid hand carved spruce top and maple back are involved. The electronics would still have to be replaced, but the sound should be quite different than the inexpensive laminate guitars from Eastman or Ibanez.

Going to check with Yunzhi.. if these are really like $500-$600, I may get one.

[ahomer1]

I don't think those are fully handmade. The descriptions says "handcraft." Maybe it is though because it's spruce , IDK.

The fully handmade (maple) one I was looking at supposedly goes for 1300:
Discount fully handmade electric jazz guitar stock with solid wood., View wholesale hollow handmade jazz guitar with solid wood, yunzhi Product Details from Beijing Yunzhi Hengwei Music Instruments Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com
but I was told that if you ask for a quote they are around 900.

[Spook410]

Spiral- Eastman's are certainly nice. However, they now cost about twice a Yunzhi and you can't specify custom neck width, inlays, woods, binding, ports, any color you want, or the other custom options. Hopefully everyone knows by now that the electronics are truly awful and must be discarded. Was there something wrong with yours beyond electronics or setup?

ahomer - Going to have to ask them what the real price is. $900 sounds right. Figure in another $250 to replace pups and pots. Total that's $300 more than the Eastman but it's pretty much an apples to oranges comparison. A hand carved solid wood guitar with whatever electronics you choose to install vs a laminate with factory electronics. The Eastman vs. Ibanez would be a better comparison. Both seem to be very popular with their owners.

Since you brought it up, now I'm kind of curious what to compare a solid wood thinline too. Wonder what it would be like with just a smallish block under the bridge. Or maybe a regular floating bridge with a trapeze and rely on the thin body width to keep down feedback. Maybe no F holes to manage feedback further? Some of the options are interesting but certainly move away from the 335 paradigm or even a 330. So many guitars.. so little time.

[ahomer1]

The Eastman thinlines are solid wood as well, and I believe this makes them get more of a traditional jazz tone than a 335. The one I played seemed like something along the lines of a 330. It was really a full sound, kind of reminded me of Grant Green. Like I said, I thought the Eastman sounded better than "higher end" Gibsons when I tried them out. They are also quite versatile guitars. Pretty heavy though.

My hope is that the Yunzhi with new pups/pots would sound similar to the Eastmans, because they are both solid body semis and I'm fairly sure the Yunzhi's bodies are built on the same design as the Eastman's semis.

However Ive decided I'm just going to hunt for a used T186 or get a new one if I have to. If the Yunzhi didn't work out I would essentially be screwed because I need a guitar to gig with. The laminate guitars that have been mentioned don't seem like a good possibility for me because I really want a boutique level guitar.

Maybe down the road I'll try out a Yunzhi though it does seem like a pretty crazy deal...

[Spook410]

Sorry.. asleep at the wheel looking at price range. The solid wood Eastmans are a lot more expensive but certainly look great and the resale would be a whole lot better. Not sure about the pups if those are the Korean Kent Armstrongs. Hope you find a good deal on one.

[Gabe]

I have a T186 with the Kent Armstrongs, they're not bad pickups. Definitely a step up from the stock pickups in a lot of other guitars but not quite the Seymour Duncans.

They are a bargain second hand though, I bought mine for £700, and new in the uk they go for £1500+.

I really want to try some Kent Armstrong Handwound jazz humbuckers at some point though, but they're quite pricey.

[ahomer1]

Have you compared the 186 with the 185? I'm having a hard time finding a cheap used 186 but I've found a 185 for 950 that seems like a good deal...

I figure I can always switch the pickups out and I'll still be saving a pretty big chunk of cash

[furtom]

It had exactly the tone I was looking for.

I say always go with that. Otherwise, you'll always regret it if the upgrades don't duplicate the sound you want."A bird in the hand," and all that.

[spiral]

Spiral- Eastman's are certainly nice. However, they now cost about twice a Yunzhi and you can't specify custom neck width, inlays, woods, binding, ports, any color you want, or the other custom options. Hopefully everyone knows by now that the electronics are truly awful and must be discarded. Was there something wrong with yours beyond electronics or setup?

Definitely true on price for new ones. Both of my Eastmans were under $1k used: an amazing 605 ($950) and an ar371 ($500). I think Eastman will build you partially custom guitars for not much more money (than new). I don't know the extent of the customizing though. You get what you get more than what you pay for in both cases. If you are wanting to build something custom, then yes Yunzhi is the way to go.

In my case i bought an acoustic and added a K&K myself. There were some minor things that i paid to fix above the cost of the guitar but overall it was a good deal. I was in Eastman price range after the shipping, $80 import fee, and $200 at the luthier for setup and fixes. It sounds like i'm being down on them but i love the guitar they made me. I play it as often as my others.

[ahomer1]

Eastman T185 - Bernunzio Uptown Music

This one looks like a good deal, but I was wondering what they mean by "the binding has shrunken around the body." Does anyone know what that entails?

BTW- the one you linked is the laminate model, which in my experience is a mile behind the carved ones.

Thanks

[2bornot2bop]

Spiral- Eastman's are certainly nice. However, they now cost about twice a Yunzhi

Actually, an Eastman 910CE, a 17" archtop with Eastman's max trim, is $3k. That's 3 times what the same guitar would cost in a Yunzhi...A $2k difference for trim and better electronics? Eastman is fast pricing themselves out of the market, for at $3k one can buy an all carved American archtop.

[monkmiles]

The Artcore's a really nice for the money you spend. I had an AF105 before I upgraded to an Eastman. The AM93 retails for about $600, and the couple that I have played have been really nice.

The AF105 was part of the "Custom" series, here's the 335 equivalent: Used In Store Used USED IBANEZ ARTCORE AS103 NT WC 344 8.5 08112 | GuitarCenter

I have an AM93 and really dig it. I think it was a smidge less expensive when it first came out I believe (maybe $549~). I stole mine as a "B-stock" (aka customer return probably) and got it for significantly cheaper, but no case. It's a perfect tweener guitar for me for both jazz, rock, and anything in between.

[ooglybong]

Actually, an Eastman 910CE, a 17" archtop with Eastman's max trim, is $3k. That's 3 times what the same guitar would cost in a Yunzhi...A $2k difference for trim and better electronics? Eastman is fast pricing themselves out of the market, for at $3k one can buy an all carved American archtop.

Unfortunately, I'd have to agree with that.

[Hammertone]

Actually, an Eastman 910CE, a 17" archtop with Eastman's max trim, is $3k. That's 3 times what the same guitar would cost in a Yunzhi...A $2k difference for trim and better electronics? Eastman is fast pricing themselves out of the market, for at $3k one can buy an all carved American archtop.

New or used?
I see used carved top/carved back Heritage archtops under 3K.
Occasionally a used carved top/laminated back Gibson L-4C or L-4CES
More rarely, a used carved top/laminated back Guild A-series archtop

Other examples?

[2bornot2bop]

New or used?
I see used carved top/carved back Heritage archtops under 3K.
Occasionally a used carved top/laminated back Gibson L-4C or L-4CES
More rarely, a used carved top/laminated back Guild A-series archtop

Other examples?

Used of course. I've owned 5 GE's, each purchased for well under $3k. One purchased for $1750 delivered...the archtop was an absolutely MINT '98 model Golden Eagle!

...yes, those buys don't grow on trees....but they're out there...oh, and lets not forget the hand carved Bourgeois A-350 for $2400...L4's, I've seen a half dozen of them sell between $2100-$2500...good buys are to be had...one merely must be persistent in their search.

[ahomer1]

Update:

Bought a 2009 t185 from a dealer online (Bernuzio) for 950.00. What an awesome guitar. Sounds incredible and looks incredible. Plays absolutely fantastic. And I feel like a got an awesome deal on it (even though it I paid "market price") which makes it that much sweeter.

For this price you seriously can't go wrong. A used heritage would cost 50% more and the guitars are similar in quality. What's your next best option option? A mij Ibanez or Epiphone? A 335 for 2.5k? Hah. The Eastman is similar in quality with any of these and you can get them for less than a grand.

If you're in the market for a semi-hollow I would suggest hunting for a used eastman.

[Rich D.]

FYI: there is a Eastman 185 for sale at Guitar Center for $899. Check the used section, the guitar is in a California store.. They will ship it to your local GC.. & you get a 30 day trail. Looks real nice, not sure of the year.