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That's great! Make sure to set the EQ independently to get the best sound out of each one. Don't just set everything flat and compare. They have different speakers and different cabinets.
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07-12-2013 08:49 PM
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Did you buy one or the other in the end?
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I'll be checking them out next Tuesday. I also got an email from Peter Henriksen. He said they are very similar tonally, but based on what I told him I was looking for, he said I will probably prefer the 110-ER.
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Thanks for your help, guys. I am really glad I tried both because I definitely preferred the 112 over the 110. They both sounded great though. I ordered a 112-ER which will be shipped to me in a couple of weeks. They only had the standard model in stock. Also, I tried the amps with a Gibson L-5 Custom and the cheapest (used) Epiphone they had there at the store. The amp sounded incredible with both guitars. I couldn't believe how similar these two guitars sounded through the amp given the huge difference in price between the guitars. What a great amp!
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I have both, but I didn't want to say anything about it until you tried them yourself. I most definitely prefer the 112 to the 110 with my Eastman AR403. The 110 - I put a Ragin Cajun in mine in place of the Beta 10A - has it's charms as well: I like it better with my semi-hollow and my Tele. (I recently put the Beta 10A in an open back cabinet, and running through both 10's is even better.) But the 112 has better (deeper and more defined) bass and sounds more 3-dimensional to me. I won't say anything about the reverb until after you do!
Originally Posted by Rick5
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Tom, I definitely agree. It is hard for me to put into words, but the 112 definitely had a much fuller sound to me. I was surprised that they sounded as different as they did. I think it is just personal taste though. The 110 sounded great too. I just preferred the sound of the 112.
Also, I was blown away with how tiny the 110 is. It looks like a toy! I was also surprised by how light the 112 is. I was expecting it to feel much heavier based on its size, but it is not a heavy amp at all. The 110 was light as a feather.
The reverb - I did play around with it a bit. It sounded OK to me up until about 9:00. It was awful past that. At 12, there was *far* too much reverb. It seemed like the intensity of the reverb increased way too much and too quickly past 9:00 or so. I don't know what I am going to do about that. I'll have to see how it sounds at home and on gigs and then I'll decide if I want to pick up some sort of external reverb.
All in all, I was incredibly impressed by both of these amps. I am confident that I will be much happier with the Henriksen than my current amp (a Roland Cube 60). I'll keep that one as a backup.
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Yup, that's exactly how I feel - I just leave it at 9:00 and forget about it. Originally Posted by Rick5
I can't resist adding a few more things:
The tweeter is nice to have, and you can always turn it off. I had the outboard version, and it really enhanced the sound of an A/E hybrid guitar I had, especially with chorus or delay. Some people like it with archtops and I can relate, but I found it to be superfluous to me in that context. It responds to the 10K EQ control nicely though, where the Beta 12A really doesn't. Anyway, I sold the 'Tweetey' when I sold that particular guitar.
The thing about the bottom end: you can always clean it up by lowering the 100 and 300 Hz controls a bit, but you can't add frequencies that just aren't there by boosting them. You can, however, boost the 1K and/or 3K EQ knobs if you need a bit more presence. I sometimes attenuate the 100 and 300 Hz controls and boost the 1kHz and 3kHZ controls depending on the room and the volume. And I found that this simple device works really well with this amp to help the bass tonalities sound like a grand piano without a trace of mud: Ampwedge. (It doesn't work with the 110 - the cabinet is not nearly as deep, and it seems like the amp might want to tip over backwards!)
I also had a Cube 60 as a backup, but when I had a chance to buy a used 110 ... !
Enjoy!
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Tom,
Yeah, I was ambivalent about the tweeter and did not get to try one of those. In the end, I decided to spend the few extra bucks to get it. I figured that even if I don't use it with my archtop, it may be good to have in the unlikely event that I ever want to sell the amp. I paid $949 for the amp (rather than $999) because a friend of mine works at the store. So, it only cost me $50 more than what most people are going to pay for a standard 112.
Rick
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So, congratulations for your purchase. Originally Posted by Rick5
Actually I don't find the 112 so light as you say, but that's just me.
I think the Henriksen sounds great if you put a t.c. electronic Hall of Fame reverb pedal in front.
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Jazz_175, thanks for the reverb recommendation. You know that weight issue is really odd. My impression at the time was that the 112 was significantly lighter than my Roland Cube 60 (from memory). I just checked online and they both weigh 32 pounds! So, I guess that is not true. Weird, it sure seemed like it to me. I guess the excitement clouded my perception!
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Hi Jostein! Originally Posted by Soco
I've been using my 110 with a lot of boxes for the past 3-4 years. It handles everything - long delays, layers of fuzz and distortion, oscillating fuzz/delay, rotary sims, etc. I do some noise/free improv stuff, and always bring my 110.
Everytime I think my 110 has reached it's limit, I'm proven wrong.
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I'd go with the 12 for solo work but I'd be very happy with the 10 if I was playing alongside in a duo or a small band. The 12 will give you just a little more bass that you need for solo work. There's quite a big differrence in the surface area of a 12 v a 10 - air moved by the cone.
Last edited by ChrisDowning; 10-06-2013 at 02:43 AM. Reason: typo
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It's funny that this thread just popped up again!
I was trying out my new guitar (Godin Montreal Premiere) in a rock context with my 110 yesterday. Ragin Cajun (75 watt power-handling capability) in the 110 on top of an open-back box with the Beta 10A (250w power-handling). I had the volume on 11:00. The amp supposedly puts out 160 watts at 4 ohms. Then I hooked up my Carl Martin Quattro. Everything was fine until I added the compressor set for clean boost probably doubling the effective power being sent to the speakers (i.e. adding about 3 db in volume): blew the Ragin Cajun - well not completely, but enough for it to distort noticeably. Uh Oh! But I took out the Ragin Cajun and put the Beta 10A back in. Whew - every thing was fine - and I like the Beta 10A better with the new guitar anyway.
I'll still use the stock 112 with my archtop. I still maintain that the bass is better - deeper and clearer - and easy to attenuate if there's too much of it, and the high end is fatter, and there is more depth to the sound. And I'll use the again stock 110 for pop with the semi-hollow - a bit punchier. For rock, on the remote chance that I need to be really loud, I can use both together (the Quattro has dual mono outputs) or just augment the 110 with the PA.
And I guess I'll sell the now empty 1x10 speaker box.
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Shame about the Ragin Cajun - its a better speaker than the Beta. The Beta is just a stock Eminence speaker for genral purpose PA and stuff - the Ragin is specifically for guitar - albeit probably not jazz.
Pity nobody was there to take a picture of your face when the pedal kicked in! Was there actual smoke! Haha.Last edited by ChrisDowning; 10-06-2013 at 02:32 PM.
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Really? I'm surprised to hear that the folks at Henricksen would use a PA speaker in their great guitar amps. Originally Posted by ChrisDowning
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Well here is the description from Eminence. It's one step from the bottom (bottom being the Alpha) of their American Standard series - the ones with the pressed steel frame (not the cast frame of the Pro Series) of general speakers. Whereas the Ragin Cajin comes from their range of speakers designed specifically for guitar. http://www.eminence.com/speakers/spe...el=Ragin_Cajun
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The description of the Beta 10A (which is under Pro Audio - American Standard series) says:
"Recommended for professional audio, bass guitar, mid-bass or floor monitor applications in sealed enclosures. Also works well as a mid-bass or woofer in vented enclosures."
But this is not strange at all, because it is probably a very good choice if you want a "JazzAmp" specifically voiced for archtop, hollowbody guitars.
The Rajin Cajun is actually mounted on the other product, which is the "BluesAmp", more suitable for semi-hollow and solid body guitars.
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And this is the reason why I avoid plugging a Telecaster in the JazzAmp. It sounds like plugging a Tele directly on a PA.
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The beta is a pa / bass speaker... guitar speakers makers don't invest in 200w products because we (jazzers) don't provide the necessary demand. Evans and Mambo also use these speakers, with better results than Henriksen.
Some solutions on the 12 area: an EV (200w) sounds much better than the Beta. A 16 ohm 100w guitar speaker (there are plenty like the WGS Blackhawk) should also sound better. And Eminence has some 140w speakers like the Tonker.
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It's the same amp, just a different speaker... the Henriksen even trough an EV still sounds like a PA, only a much better one. Without a Barb EQ I avoid plugging any guitar there
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In this video the BluesAmp, which, as you said, is the same amp as the JazzAmp, except for an Eminence Legend 1258 speaker, is compared with a Fender '57 Deluxe, using a solid body gtr.
The BluesAmp does sound good, I think. Maybe even better with a Barb Eq in front.
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Dumb question: what makes a speaker a guitar speaker, in particular, a good speaker for clean jazz guitar? Originally Posted by ChrisDowning
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I like the Fender much more... the Henriksen has a 1k spyke that makes the first two strings too fat. But taste is taste, I actually like the sound you get with yours on your videos a lot
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Ha ha! No smoke - it just got real 'farty' in the bass ... and stayed that way even when I turned down. I was just relieved that it was a $70 speaker I blew and not a $900 amp! Originally Posted by ChrisDowning
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I also think, over time we have learnt to like particular sounds of guitar which, in the past, were dictated by what was available. For example the original Celestion Blue was developed from a radio speaker and fifty years later it has become a 'traditional', an 'original' sound. Generally we are still not using the three speaker - woofer, mid, pressure driver - approach of the hi fi World. It's about a 'vibe' rather than accuracy.
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