uncomfortable with my Gibson ES-335

[nion]

That's it guys. I've been playing a Gibson ES-335 for the last 4 years and just can't get used to play the damn thing, specially standing up.

I feel that the body is too big for me, the strap feels awkward and makes the neck go away. I have tried different strap heights but nothing, I haven't found the sweet spot.
I think one of the reasons is the double cutaway. I'm pretty sure that if the neck joined the body sooner, like on a 175, it would be a bit shorter and that would make it a bit more comfy.

I'm not tall (5'6), and it's alright for me to play sitting down but it's a total pain in the ass every time I play standing, specially on gigs, where sometimes I feel like I can't play, or that my playing level has decreased quite a lot.

So, even though I love how the guitar sounds, I'm terribly frustrated and sick of how uncomfortable and sloppy I feel when playing standing.

could you guys tell me which guitars you know that are a bit smaller than a 335 and still can get good contemporary jazz tones? (Ben Monder, Rosenwinkel, Mike Moreno...)

I only know about the gibson 339, which I didn't like when I tried it.


Thanks a million in advance.

[seanlowe]

solidbodies, heavily chambered, can get 335-ey, although if you're content with the sound of a 335 but not 339 its probably psychosomatic - theyre the same guitar with different neck profiles afaik.

In terms of comfort, work from a chambered klein-style up - as a compromise, if i were you id try a chambered or fully hollow tele, if thats too bright maybe see if theres one with a non standard set of pickups near you. Slightly more trad would be the hollow les paul types but ive never been keen.

[jorgemg1984]

Hmm lets see if I can help..

1 - do you practice sited or standing? I practice sited and play standing but I set my guitar pretty high. Not very fashion but its the only I can get the same feel I have when I practice at home...

2 - Is the guitar properly set-up? Have you tried other 335? I have played with similar guitars that had very different feelings...

3 - You can get a good modern sound from an archtop. Guys like Lund, Hekselman or Kreisberg do it. Even Kurt did it with his Moffa on the Standards Trio tour and album. I have a Guild X-500 and with the right amount delay and reverb I can get in that area... so why not a 175?

I practice a lot with my archtop and gig a lot with my 335 clone because I don't like to bring a good old archtop to all the gigs... It feels weird in the begging but after sound check I am already used to the 335 feel!

[marcwhy]

Too many options, actually. Do you have a budget, "sound" that you like, etc.?

[Flyin' Brian]

Check one of these out. I've owned one for a few years now and use it all the time. It's an inch smaller than a 335.


Heritage Guitar, Inc. of Kalamazoo - Semi Hollow Body - Prospect STD

[Atticus]

I'd try a Tele Thinline Deluxe.

[Kuz]

Check one of these out. I've owned one for a few years now and use it all the time. It's an inch smaller than a 335.


Heritage Guitar, Inc. of Kalamazoo - Semi Hollow Body - Prospect STD

+1 a Heritage Prospect is great guitar and my buddy's #1 guitar. It looks and sounds incredible!

[Klatu]

Eastman El Rey

[mambosun]

I currently play standing an Ibanez AS120, a 335 clone actually, without any problem.
Perhaps you could check this one?

[nion]

thanks a lot for your comments, guys.

Jorge, my guitar is perfectly set up, it plays good when seated, and it sounds beautiful.

I know I can get a modern sound with an archtop, but I haven't found myself comfortable playing any archtop I tried in the past. I like the size of the 175 but it's too thick to me.

I've been doing some research about all the models you said and I came to the conclusion that I think what I need is a 14 inch body guitar.

I would like to try the Eastman El Rey, but it's going to be impossible to find one near me.

I found the Sadowsky ss15, loved it, but it's too expensive. That size and shape is great for my needs I think. Lage Lund is using it now instead of his Jim Hall model and he sounds beautiful.

In terms of budget. The idea would be to sell the 335 and get the new guitar (adding some cash if necessary).

thanks a lot guys

[jorgemg1984]

Glad we could help! One more thing - why don't you play sited? Not very fashion also but it might solve your problem... (personally when I play sited I lose my focus a lot but it might work for you... I only play sited if I am doing some duo with a singer or something like that)

Good tip on Lage Lund - love his playing (when he leaves the chorus off) and I thought he loved the Jim Hall guitar! He is probably doing it to keep the Jim Hall at home... wise move! Will have to do the same with my X-500 one of these days.

[nion]

I only play seated when playing at home, or in duo gigs and at some recording sessions, but most gigs I do are standing.
I like that because I have more direct eye contact with the rest of the band and it's more natural to me to manipulate effect pedals (I use volume and expression pedals).

yeah Jorge...the ss15 is just...gorgeous!

[BigMikeinNJ]

Slighty smaller bodied double cutaways that quickly come to mind

Ibanez AM__ series, an array of model numbers, the higher the number the nicer the woods/inlays. Many of my Ibanez Collector buddies really like they AM series because they are shorter guys and don't feel dwarfed by the AM's smaller comfortable profile.

Also worth a mention are used Eastman T184 or T145 (single cut) are really swell guitars, and good deals can be had on the used market, many already having had their pickups and wiring upgraded. You'll find what you want, I am sure the guys here will have other ideas.

[Tom Karol]

Interesting post! I have the same problem - sort of in reverse. I have a full-size 335 clone that I feel comfortable with while standing, but it feels awkward when sitting. My main guitar is a Tele clone, and it feels comfortable both ways. I also have an acoustic-electric hybrid that's basically a thinline semi-hollow but 15" wide; it feels good both ways, but doesn't quite 'fit like a glove' like the Tele does. So here's what I've been thinking on and off:
1) Just play the 335 clone standing, and upgrade the electronics (see https://www.jazzguitar.be/forum/guita...335-clone.html.)
2) Sell it ... and possibly the hybrid as well and get one of the following.
3) Heritage Prospect Standard.
4) Eastman T184MX or 185MX.
5) Reverend Manta Ray HB.
6) Tele Thinline with a neck humbucker.
My ideal choice would be a Sadowski Semi-Hollow or possibly a Collings Soco Deluxe, but they're both way too expensive. I've tried a 339, and it was OK, but I didn't want to pay $2K for it. I guess the new Epiphone version with some upgrades might be a candidate, but I just can't get exited about owning an Epiphone at this stage. So, I don't know what I'll do yet either. Oh, and check this out: Text.

[Jweele01]

You could also just buy something to sit on for gigs. No shame in sitting down!

[valriver40]

how about a gibson 137?

[marcwhy]

In terms of budget. The idea would be to sell the 335 and get the new guitar (adding some cash if necessary).

thanks a lot guys

Check out Rob Engel's archtops -- he makes 14" and 15" models with a big sound.

[nion]

there's no shame sitting down, it's just not the way I like to play at gigs.

The 137 is as big as the 335, same 16inch body.

I just checked Engel's guitars and I didn't like them. I'm sure they sound great but they're pretty ugly to my taste.

anybody know where I can try some Eastman guitars in London?

again, thanks everyone for your contributions and help

[Bluewyatt]

I've got this...a wonderful guitar.

http://www.soundpure.com/p/jimmy-fos...op-guitar/2510

[NSJ]

Smaller guitars are great!

Gibson ES-339
Heritage Prospect Std
Ibanez GB10
Eastman El Rey

Try em out, you seriously cannot go wrong!

I'd love to try out the Sadowsky SS15, but no way I can afford it, at this point. Hard financial times.

[cjm]

I'm not tall (5'6), and it's alright for me to play sitting down but it's a total pain in the ass every time I play standing, specially on gigs, where sometimes I feel like I can't play, or that my playing level has decreased quite a lot.

The ES-335 doesn't fit me either, but I'm taller and it's more a matter of weight and balance for me...16 inch hollow body archtops with bodies a bit thinner than an ES-175 (2.5~3 inches) and a 25.5 inch scale are sort of the "sweet spot" for me.

That said, I know a damned fine player who is your height and now that he is 70 years old, he is getting to be a tad bit round in shape...and mostly doesn't play any more.

Back in the 1970's he stopped fighting big hollow body archtops and began using a Telecaster thin line semi hollow for most gigs. Has worked out fairly well for him. The stock humbucker at the neck position gives an adequate jazz tone...couldn't tell you what amps he used, because there were too many to keep track of.

[lpdeluxe]

This thread is proof, if any were needed, that there's no one perfect guitar. I have reduced my collection of electrics to an ES-335, and it's just right. I had a Les Paul and an SG (and a Chet Atkins Country Gent and a Stratocaster and a Ric and a lot of others) but small guitars don't fit me at all. The only flaw in the 335 is the location of the strap button on the back. Conversely, that's the single feature the Country Gentleman had that was superior to the Gibson: it had its strap button (and a sensible one that you removed the cap from and then screwed on over the strap) where it belongs, on the upper bout. That's the problem with playing the 335 while standing. The guitar doesn't balance well on its strap and wants to tilt forward.

I play sitting down, so it's not a big deal. For what it's worth, I attended a jazz concert Friday evening (my lady friend sits in on percussion, so I enjoy it, whatever they play) and the guitarist was playing his George Benson while seated. I don't think anyone in the audience noticed.

[Patrick2]

Here is a link up to a Heritage Millenium Ultra. Thin body, semi hollow, smaller overall size, 24-3/4" scale. Very versatile, very comfortable. We affectionately call these guitars .. . "Millies". Might be just what the doctor ordered!

Heritage Guitar, Inc. of Kalamazoo - Semi Hollow Body - Millennium Ultra STD

Just edited and added to this post . . . the Heritage Prospect. Considerably smaller than the 335/535 type semi hollow. The Prospect also has a 24.75" scale length.

http://www.heritageguitar.com/models...ectstdosb.html

[Jabberwocky]

I used to have a beer gut and playing a 335 hurt like hell. Now that I have lost 45 pounds, it sits a lot better where the beer gut used to be.

(I don't have a real Gibson ES-335 but a Japanese clone. Didn't have the money then.)

[nion]

thanks a lot guys. I made a list of those guitars and hope to start trying them out, which I think it's gonna be a problem. I never saw any of those guitars in person before, because there are not too many around here.

we'll see. Thanks a lot