Getting a Jazz Tone from my Fender Stratocaster

[rpguitar]

I realize the thread may have reached its conclusion for now, but here's my bare bones Warmoth Strat that I love for all styles of music including jazz.

Alder body, one piece maple neck (both minimally oil-finished), hardtail, Lindy Fralin pickups, and... it weighs only 6.75 lbs! The light weight is a key to its great vibe. It's almost impossible to find a stock Fender even close to that weight.

[Tal_175]

An alternative to replacing the Strat pickups with humbuckers is getting a pedal that has a good bass boost feature or a fat switch. I'm using spark booster which has a bass boost option. It really fattens up my Strats well into the humbucker domain. With heavy gauge strings and the right pick (like the jd jazztone 208) you get great jazz tones.
Sometimes I wonder if I really need my ES 175, should I just sell it. When I feel that way I cover my ears and say la, la, la, la ... very loudly until those morbid thoughts go away.

[mr quick]

As you can see in my other post, I learned the value of a good setup today.

I have a Fender stratocaster that's assembled from a few different things, but the neck is a Mexico standard with a rosewood board. It's the only guitar I have which I just can't really get to work in my hands - which is peculiar, as this is one of the first electric guitars I ever played. The truss rod broke in the original neck, so it was easier to just get a second hand mex neck.

Now, is it possible to do a good setup without any of the fender-specific tools like a radius gauge?

[deacon Mark]

Well it is but do you have the experience. You can us plain ordinary tools that you buy from any hardware store and you can make you own radius gage if you want. It is very simple and can be done with card stock and an compass. You need to have general idea of what action heights are at various points on the neck and frets. Also the truss rod is something that while not a complicated matter it is not always something that "fixes" everything. A truss rod keeps the proper relief in the neck but it is not really suppose to be adjusted all the time as if it were a machine head winding the string. Once dialed in with the particular gauge of strings it really should not need any adjustment to any great degree. If if does then that could be a problem but time will tell eventually. What happen that the original truss rod broke. That can happen but it requires some doing to break one usually.

It has a rosewood board which makes it much easier to work on since you do not have to mask the fingerboard to dress frets. I charge a premium for maple fingerboards because they require masking off to do almost any fret work. Why someone would want a maple board is beyond me, I just hate them for a players and repairmen's standpoint both.

In the end you can look a many video's of setting up and guitar and they are good for sure. The thing they cannot do is bring experience that can only happen over time. Over time I have modified how I do fret jobs and set ups but that is over a period of years. Just yesterday I finished refretting a Seventy Seven guitar with jumbo jescar frets EVO gold. The change I can see out of this last refret was the Jescar EVO gold frets are really nice and I would probably use them almost exclusively now if I were to fret my own guitar. The long and short is take your time, better to quit and come back if things are not going well.

One last point you need a lot of files. I have a huge box of every kind of file you can imagine. In fact I should take a photo of the drawer they are in it is amazing. Again acquired by time and need. Some files I hardly every use but when I need to do something specific they are the only one. Nut slotting files for instance are not completely necessary but they make things a whole lot easier and faster. Finally my favorite tool right now is the Jescar Fret TANG nipper that is incredible. It saves me huge time over the old one the Stew Mac sold. This puppy is not cheap at about $130 with attachments...…….but now essential as strings on a guitar for me.

[rpjazzguitar]

As you can see in my other post, I learned the value of a good setup today.

I have a Fender stratocaster that's assembled from a few different things, but the neck is a Mexico standard with a rosewood board. It's the only guitar I have which I just can't really get to work in my hands - which is peculiar, as this is one of the first electric guitars I ever played. The truss rod broke in the original neck, so it was easier to just get a second hand mex neck.

Now, is it possible to do a good setup without any of the fender-specific tools like a radius gauge?

Fender's website has setup instructions which are very well done and easy to follow. Just a few tools are required, screwdrivers, the appropriate Allen wrenches and a ruler in mm or 64ths. I like a metal one.

I've never used a radius gauge and I've watched some pros do setups without one, instead eyeballing the curve at the bridge.

I have had the experience of eyeballing it and then finding myself uncomfortable when I'm playing, requiring some fiddling with the saddle heights. But, it wasn't difficult and it may even have an advantage, i.e. that what I ended up with felt great -- and I never checked whether it was what would have been predicted by the radius gauge, because I never bought one.

All that said, there are real luthiers on here who may have a more educated view.

[TedBPhx]

This will get it close enough to dial in to your exact needs.
I use a feeler gauge and a caliper.

How do I set up my Stratocaster(R) guitar properly? – Fender

[jcayer]

You can check out this guy on youtube.

FruduaTv
- YouTube

Lots of videos on adjusting Stratocasters with simple tools and techniques !

[sgosnell]

To get a good setup, it's essential to get the nut cut properly. Nuts with slots that are too high won't permit the action to ever be as low as it could be. I make sure the nut is slotted properly, at the same height as the frets, maybe a thousandth of an inch higher, then string the guitar up and set the truss rod to get the neck straight, maybe a thousandth of an inch of relief (others like more relief, especially if they pick and strum hard, but that's my preference) and then set the saddle heights. I start with them low, then raise them just enough to get rid of fret buzz. But no matter what you do with the truss rod or the saddles, if the nut slots aren't right, the action will never be right.

[mr quick]

What happen that the original truss rod broke. That can happen but it requires some doing to break one usually.

Hey Mark, nothing really "happened". The guitar was played a regular amount and took no blows, and this problem came years ago when I was learning to play -- I must have been 14 or 15. It had a terrible back bow, so we took it to a travelling Fender tech whose travels happened to coincide with the issue. He did what he described as "as good a setup he could do on this guitar", alluding to a neck issue but not identifying the broken truss rod as the issue. After that, we kind of just let the guitar stay in its case. Years later (2 or 3 yrs ago) we took it to the luthier I usually go to, and he I.D'd it as a broken truss rod -- so we got a new mexico neck and put it on.

Curiously enough, the only other person I know who had one of these strats (1998 California strat), said his truss rod also broke.

--


Thanks for all the advice in the thread. I'll use the Fender specs as a reference and see how it goes.

[JCat]

I don't know what to say...maybe I misunderstand... ...you have about 1000 posts...you have one guitar, your first electric, that doesn't work...you replaced the neck because the truss rod broke... you suspect there's a design flaw...you wonder if you need any special tools...you are located in Norway...

I would love to say "take it to a tech" but I know how hard it can be to find one these days when on-line sales has taken over. So here we are, your on-line set up service...Free of charge, satisfaction hardly guaranteed.

I have a 97 California Strat. Never had a problem. On the contrary it's well built, plays and sounds great, easy to set up (I tweak the truss rod about two times a year).

You absolutely need keys with the right dimension for the neck and the bridge saddles (but you don't have to buy them from Fender.) You absolutely do not need a radius gauge for this guitar, you're better off without it when setting up a guitar with individually adjustable saddle height. (It's good to have when filing the slots on a ToM bridge, but that's another topic.)

I bet my mother in law on that you need to shim the neck. Under all circumstances you need to align it. Whatever you do, stop tweaking the truss rod before you break this one too. You'll find plenty of instructions (free of charge!) on how to shim a neck on-line.

Good luck to you

[mr quick]

I don't know what to say...maybe I misunderstand... ...you have about 1000 posts...you have one guitar, your first electric, that doesn't work...you replaced the neck because the truss rod broke... you suspect there's a design flaw...you wonder if you need any special tools...you are located in Norway...

I would love to say "take it to a tech" but I know how hard it can be to find one these days when on-line sales has taken over. So here we are, your on-line set up service...Free of charge, satisfaction hardly guaranteed.

I have a 97 California Strat. Never had a problem. On the contrary it's well built, plays and sounds great, easy to set up (I tweak the truss rod about two times a year).

You absolutely need keys with the right dimension for the neck and the bridge saddles (but you don't have to buy them from Fender.) You absolutely do not need a radius gauge for this guitar, you're better off without it when setting up a guitar with individually adjustable saddle height. (It's good to have when filing the slots on a ToM bridge, but that's another topic.)

I bet my mother in law on that you need to shim the neck. Under all circumstances you need to align it. Whatever you do, stop tweaking the truss rod before you break this one too. You'll find plenty of instructions (free of charge!) on how to shim a neck on-line.

Good luck to you

No, I have many guitars - but only one strat. Pardon the way I phrased the original post.
It's one of the guitars I learned to play on. There's nothing "wrong" with it in its current state, but I wanted some tips before fiddling with the saddle heights in search of the ideal setup - the neck relief is fine, I don't intend on doing anything abt it.
re: tech: there's plenty good techs enjoying a resurgence in the appreciation for skilled craftsmen, but it's a luxury I can't afford -- I do the setups on my other guitars, but haven't done a strat before

side note, does your cali strat have a maple or RW fretboard?

[pauln]

I have mentioned this before, but this thread is a good place to cover it again...

Be sure that after you put on the neck and strings that you perform the "neck pop" procedure to insure that there is a firm pressure contact of the butt end of the neck in the neck pocket of the guitar.

- tune the strings up to pitch
- slowly unscrew the neck bolts, each a little at a time
- continue carefully until the friction between the neck and pocket is overcome
- the pop is when the neck will slip a tiny bit to seat more firmly into the pocket
- tighten the neck screws

If you just screw on the neck and string up the guitar, there is no firm pressure between the neck and body; loosening the screws allows the combined string tension of about 60-70lbs to really make that firm contact, then screwing the neck tight again captures the neck in that position.

So, this means you will likely want to perform final action and intonation adjustments after the neck pop.

[JCat]

No, I have many guitars - but only one strat. Pardon the way I phrased the original post.
It's one of the guitars I learned to play on. There's nothing "wrong" with it in its current state, but I wanted some tips before fiddling with the saddle heights in search of the ideal setup - the neck relief is fine, I don't intend on doing anything abt it.
re: tech: there's plenty good techs enjoying a resurgence in the appreciation for skilled craftsmen, but it's a luxury I can't afford -- I do the setups on my other guitars, but haven't done a strat before

side note, does your cali strat have a maple or RW fretboard?

OK, very well then,

The Stratocaster design is pretty pedagogic in terms of set up in the sense that it's easy to follow cause and effect. The bolt on neck allows adjustment of the neck angle, also the floating tremolo enables adjustment of several parameters that are not available on hard tails/stop tails etc.

As a rule of thumb, every neck is unique to some degree (profile, flex point, heel etc). Therefore one should expect the guitar to feel different when the neck is replaced. (Many would think of the neck as the ID of the guitar and that a replacement would be like a transplantation of a vital organ)

When I play one individual guitar exclusively for a period of time, I need some time to feel at home with my other guitars. Good to know when I evaluate a set up or a new guitar.

Analyzing a set up is an art that takes years of practice. Checkpoints, conclusions and recipes are different depending on type and model of guitar down to idiosyncrasies of the individual guitar.

Guitars are sensitive to climate and humidity. I bet you are heating your homes in Norway in this season which means that the indoor climate is usually very dry and guitars will react.

My best advice (in no particular order):

Learn how to set up a floating tremolo. Experiment with decking/floating the trem. Adjust the number of springs and the claw and evaluate the different outcomes with sets of different string gauge.

Learn about neck angle, fretboard height and the impact on geometry and response. (Basically, chances are slim that a replacement bolt on neck would just drop in the neck pocket without the needs of shimming or sanding when your goal is to reproduce the feel of the previous neck)

Learn how to assess a nut (chances are slim that the nut of a replacement neck would meet your needs prior to adjustment)

Study the wider concept of "action" as it relates to string height across the entire fretboard depending on nut action, relief and bridge height

Study the concept of compound radius (even though your replacement neck may be of fixed radius) and you'll understand why your ideal bridge radius may be different from the fretboard radius.

Learn why you should not set up your electric solidbody following some guidelines for an acoustic western guitar. Avoid measuring relief with tools and numbers. Never try to copy relief from one guitar to another. Remember that a factory set up is just a starting point with little bearing on individual preferences.

Learn how to intonate. Remember a minute to learn - a lifetime to master.

Never spend more time tweaking your guitars than playing them.


Maybe you know these things already, maybe something is useful to you or somebody else following this thread.

PS: My Strat has the maple board, but with the same skunk stripe and rod like yours. The script logo includes "Made in USA". The serial number prefix is AMX.

[mr quick]

Thanks for all advice, folks. No doubt it'd benefit from a shim, but I did as best I could for now. There's a James Tyler strat coming my way soon to replace this one, so I'll try to put away some cash so I can have them both set up by a pro later this spring. Cheers

edit: to be clear, I did not buy a tyler, my father's been kind enough to lend me his main gigging strat. picking it up when I visit this easter

[Aant]

I'm curious: has anyone tried the PRS Silver Sky? The pick ups sound smoother than on a regular Strat, and the neck looks quite big.

[P.J.]

My most Stratty guitar is a Parker Nitefly, which is s/s/h. Playing on the neck pickup with the tone rolled almost all the way down gets me a decent jazzy tone. I think the key with single coils is to use the tone control on both the amp and especially the guitar.

[Bach5G]

I put a set of Fender Vintage Noiseless pickups into my Strat recently. I think they sound terrific and I’ve been through a lot of pickups over the years.

[P.J.]