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Hi all.
My current amp is a Fender Frontman 65R (SS), through which I play my Ibanez AK-80. It has a nice clean tone but it lacks the warmth of tube amps that I've played on, so if possible I would like to warm up the tone a bit.
From what I've gleaned so far I think changing the 12" speaker might be the best (and possibly only) move. I only play at home, therefore volumes are relatively low. (Before anyone suggests buying a Fender tube amp, can I say that I simply don't want to spend that kind of money
). I would love a Deluxe Reverb, but I'm thinking maybe a Jensen P12N speaker (comes stock in the DR reissue) might do the trick for my 65R.
What do you think? I'd be grateful for any advice.
Regards ............... Poppster.
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12-15-2010 04:43 PM
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Correction ............. the Deluxe Reverb RI comes with a 12" Jenson, not the P12N!!! Ooops!!
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It sounds like you really want a Fender tube amp - for good reasons.
Originally Posted by The Poppster
(Before anyone suggests buying a Fender tube amp, can I say that I simply don't want to spend that kind of money
35 years ago I tried out amps for my Gibson 175 (which I still have). The Fender Twin Reverb stood out miles higher than all the others, and everyone in the shop could hear it - but of course I coudn't afford it as a student. Today it's still the best amp I never owned.
Big money spent on quality hurts - but only when it leaves the wallet. Afterwards one doesn't look back and only enjoys the quality.
For the last 15 years I have been playing an Evans JE 200 (also a great amp), but when it breaks down, it will likely be replaced with a Twin Reverb.
So - maybe I'm suggesting a Fender amp after all.
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You may be able to warm you sound up by using a tube boost or tube pre amp pedal. I know you don't want to spend big money but you could keep an eye out for a second hand fender tube amp.
As for changing the speaker this will change the tone of your amp but you may have to try a few different speakers before you find one that has the right tonal qualities.
Good luck,
Glen.
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Good evening, Poppster... Originally Posted by The Poppster
For 'group ' use, I have Fender and Hiwatt valve amps, but at home levels I use a small Roland Jazz Chorus. As I like valve sounds, and especially Twin Reverb, I go through a Boss 'Fender Deluxe' simulator pedal. It gives me all I am looking for as far as simulation goes, with clean valve tone, 'driven' tone, reverb and tremolo. If you like the Deluxe sound but don't want the weight, you might try the Boss pedal. It will certainly 'warm up' your solid state Fender.
My tuppence worth, hope this helps...
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Normal Ch
In 1
Volume 2.2～3 (at the home)
Treble 1(Fenders Min.)～2
Bass 3～4
Guitar Volume 7～8, Tone 10～
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I would agree that pretty much the only thing to do with your existing amp is change the speaker.
Be forewarned that if you buy a new speaker it may take quite a few hours of playing to break in properly.
Do you know anyone who has a DRRI? Can you try running your amp through just their speaker? You dont want to buy a new fender tube amp but you spend 120$ on a new speaker you dont like you arent any further ahead.
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If your only solution is to change the speaker, look at the WEBER 12f150. It gave my old Peavey classic 30 a new (jazz) live!!!
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Have you tried a pedal with a rube? I've read they tend to be more trouble than they're worth. Originally Posted by Marto
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You don't want to spend too much money on a tube amp and I can understand that, but since you state that it's only for playing at home, how much volume do you need? I recently got a small tube practice amp, a Fender Champion 600, and it only cost me $160, new. It sounds good and I don't even have to crank it up when I play with pals at home.
I don't know how much "too much" is, but there is also the Fender Vibro Champ XD and Super Champ XD which can be had for around $225 and $330 respectively. I haven't tried any of them, but the first one has one 6V6 tube for 5W and the second one has two 6V6 for 15W. They may cost more than you want to spend, though.
You can always watch for a used amp too.
Another cheap solution might be to try one of the pedals Boss make. I have the Fender '65 Deluxe Reverb stompbox and it does an acceptable job recreating the tone of the FDR in front of a SS. They also have the Fender '59 Bassman and the '63 Fender Reverb, which I haven't tried.
You're going to spend anyway by changing the speaker in your Frontman and, frankly, I am far from believing you will be satisfied with the result.
Try the Champion 600 if it's powerful enough for what you need. If not, try the pedal. With these two solutions, at least, you can resell the items if they do not please you, whereas once you've spent the money on a new speaker in your Frontman, it's gone, there is no turning back without spending even more money.Last edited by Eddie Lang; 12-16-2010 at 02:18 AM.
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You could also sell the Frontman to raise a few dollars towards another amp that you will prefer.
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I have used some tube pedals in the past. I think their reliability largely depends on how you treat them. That said I don't use them for jazz as I play through a tube amp.Have you tried a pedal with a rube? I've read they tend to be more trouble than they're worth.
I think a good tube boost like the siegmund missing link would be pretty reliable but I'm not sure what effect it would have on a ss amp.
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If it's in the budget, try a used Blues Jr., just a thought.
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You could also try a stomp pedal "compression-sustainer " to warm up your sound. If you just stick to medium settings, this would not add any dirt to your tone while making it more fluid and sustained.
I"ve been using the excellent Boss CS2 ( David Gilmour owned one) for years in order to warm and bring more flesh to the sound of my very first and cheapo SS combo.Last edited by mambosun; 12-17-2010 at 05:15 AM.
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Sometimes an overdrive set on more minimal settings will warm up a SS amp. Overdrives are way more subtle than a distortion, plus an overdrive is really meant to work best on a tube amp, so when used with SS it's easy to find lots of range where it won't even come close to breaking up and getting crunchy.
Last edited by cosmic gumbo; 12-17-2010 at 12:15 AM.
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Hey, big thanks to everyone for your excellent suggestions!! (On an aside, I need to check my settings because I didn't receive a single email notification of any posts. I came on to see why no-one had responded!
)
So many options, thanks again! But I think the best choice, in the long term, will be to save up for a used Fender tube amp. I've noticed that the bigger models, such as a used 'Twin', seem to be better value than say a used Princeton. On that note, I've read quite a few comments here and there about reissues being nowhere near as good as actual vintage. Surely that's an exaggeration! Does anyone have any opinions on that?
Regards . . . Poppster.
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Yes you're right: for instance a vintage SF Twin Reverb isn't that much more expensive than a Deluxe or Princeton from the same generation: maybe the back-breaking Twin is a key issue here, being not the best option to bring everywhere for small gig or rehearsal. But having played on both, for me, the Twin plays in another league: deeper tone, far bigger headroom, more versatile etc...I've noticed that the bigger models, such as a used 'Twin', seem to be better value than say a used Princeton. On that note, I've read quite a few comments here and there about reissues being nowhere near as good as actual vintage. Surely that's an exaggeration! Does anyone have any opinions on that?
Regarding reissue, I briefly tested some in a shop but didn't compare them side to side with their vintage brothers. Price is really high, and funnily enough, according to many posts from RI amp owners in other forums, swapping the stock tubes and loudspeaker is a mandatory hence extra cost for an already expensive amp.
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Good evening, Poppster... Originally Posted by The Poppster
Just checking... Is this for home use, or for stage? The Fender Twin (imo one of the all-time mythical great amps...) is not at its best in a domestic environment. They are VERY loud, and, when turned down, don't give the tone that they are reputed for. It is not (again, imho...) suitable for 'bedroom' playing levels. The Deluxe is also at its best at stage volumes. I understand wanting (needing..?) that tone; that's why I have the amps I have, but at home, a 'Twin' will be either wasted, or 'enjoyed' by the neighbours (my nearest neighbours are nearly 1 km away; they know when I'm playing my 50w Bassman...).
Of course, if stage (and I really mean big stage...) use is your goal, then go for it, even if it takes time.
I maintain my previous post here; the Boss Fender Deluxe pedal gives me satisfactory Fender tone through my JC20, and doesn't weigh 45 kgs. To each his own, of course.
Hope this helps...
(perhaps it's just as well you've not become stricken by the need for the 'Hiwatt' sound; as far as I know, there is no substitute for a 70's DR103 and a Fane-loaded 4 x 12 ...)
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Mambosun and Dad3353 ..... thanks very much. I think both those pedals would be well worth trying out. I'm going to keep an eye out on Ebay, see what might turn up. You see, I've only just managed to free myself from the grip of G.A.S. and I really would like to stay out of there for as long as I can!!
On that note, I hadn't realised how expensive speakers are!
A pedal would definitely be the better option!
However, Kawa's settings suggestion (thank you Kawa!) gave me an idea which seems to have worked quite well. There are two inputs on the amp, number two being for active pickups. So I figured that it might take the edge off a bit .. and sure enough it does! Having just tried it out I would say the tone has been more 'dulled' than 'warmed', but at least it's not 'shrill' anymore. But hey, I'll take 'dull' over 'shrill' anyday!!
Regards ........... Popps.
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You might want to consider an amp/speaker cab simulator with effects. A while ago I got a used POD 2.0 for $100 and found that it works very well plugged into several of my cheap solid state amps. There are 32 different amp models and I can dial in a fair facsimile of the Deluxe Reverb, turn the Drive up a bit and the Reverb just a touch and pretend I have the real thing. Its got other tones including a very impressive Mesa Boogie clean that sounds really huge through my $20 pawnshop keyboard amp with 15" flat-response speaker.
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+100 as modeling as improved a lot , see the Roland Cube Cosm for exemple.. Originally Posted by mongrel
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1. Input : As you like, Jim hall likes the Low(2) Input, I like input 1's dynamic tone.
2. Channel : Drive - Ch has Mid Control and available to various tones, Please try it.
Input : 1
Ch - Select : Drive - Ch
Drive : Use to as a volume
Volume : Max
Treble : 1～2
Mid : 6～8
Mid-Contour : ? as you like
Bass : 3～4
3. Speaker : At last, replace the good unit, Weber 12F150 or Jensen C12k.Last edited by kawa; 12-19-2010 at 02:51 AM.
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On most fender amps with 2 input jacks per channel, one jack is attenuated for lower gain than the other.
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It help a lot if you put some tube overdrive pedal between your guitar and amp, a bit of reverb, delay or even chorus also can warm up the SS sound. It worth to try, I have good experience with that kind of "warming". Originally Posted by The Poppster
Hi all.
My current amp is a Fender Frontman 65R (SS), through which I play my Ibanez AK-80. It has a nice clean tone but it lacks the warmth of tube amps that I've played on, so if possible I would like to warm up the tone a bit.
From what I've gleaned so far I think changing the 12" speaker might be the best (and possibly only) move. I only play at home, therefore volumes are relatively low. (Before anyone suggests buying a Fender tube amp, can I say that I simply don't want to spend that kind of money ). I would love a Deluxe Reverb, but I'm thinking maybe a Jensen P12N speaker (comes stock in the DR reissue) might do the trick for my 65R.
What do you think? I'd be grateful for any advice.
Regards ............... Poppster.
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You folks are so helpful! Thank you so much for all of your advice and suggestion. I'm going to try as many of these suggestions as I can. I certainly have gained a lot of knowledge here in a very short space of time! Thank you again
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