Setting up my hollow body action?

[phatjazz]

I have a new-to-me Ibanez AMH90 small- and fully hollow-body guitar. It is a very comfortable size for me, and the pickups sound very nice. I'm trying to figure out how to improve the action (or make it to my liking). Right now, as it came to me, the bridge is down as far as it will go. The action in the lower frets is nice and low (the way I like it), but the action up at the higher part of the fretboard is higher than I like. Any tips to lower / even-out the action?

Here's a link to what the guitar is like:Used Ibanez AMH90-CRF Hollow Body Electric Guitar Cherry | Guitar Center

[mr. beaumont]

Bridge all the way down is usually not a good sign. Is the neck straight?

[MCh]

Nice guitar, congratulations!

If you cannot set it up by yourself, I would suggest that you refer to your luthier.


I won't go into details here, but whenever I get a guitar, new or used:

• I check if the parts are original. It may happen, in your case that the bridge has been swapped for whatever reason. It could be thicker that the original?
• Then I will check the neck alignment. If it is wrong, when the guitar as a removable neck (Fender), it is a matter of shimming. Your guitar has a set neck. That is much more complicated, sometimes impossible or too expensive to fix, depending on the guitar value.
• I remove the strings and straighten the neck with a straight edge via the truss rod. Is the truss rod adjustement working smoothly?
• Time to clean and oil the wood.
• I check the frets. Are they worn out? How about fret sprout? Are there any high frets that need to be hammered or filed down?
• Once this is done, I put strings on it, the gauge I intend to use. I tune the guitar and adjust the neck relief.
• Then I check the height of the strings at the first fret. Is the nut ok? Any slots filing to be done?
• Now comes the action at the 12th fret. This is done with the adjustment of the bridge. If your guitar still has too high a bridge after all that, then there definitively is something wrong either with the bridge, or worse, the neck alignment. Can the bridge be filed down? Or the saddles?
• If everything is ok at that point, I take care of the intonation.
• Finally, I check pickups and pickups screws height.

Good luck with your guitar.

[Jimmy blue note]

Good post Mch! If it's a new guitar and nobody removed the foam scratch protector from between the guitar and the bridge, do that ASAP before you set your action. That's just there for transit and never meant for playing.
If you are tempted to polish or wax the guitar while the strings are off, DON'T put anything in the area where the bridge foot and top meet; you don't need anything that will cause that bridge to slide as you're putting tension on the strings.

Remember that there is no "right" action. There's only what feels good to you. On an archtop especially, do experiment and raise or lower the action to what feels, sounds and responds well. Play it a little and play around.
Adjust your action and intonation as needed. Strings will change over time. Keep it playing true and expect to adjust intonation each time you put fresh strings on it.

Enjoy your new guitar!!!

[Cunamara]

About the only adjustment you can make, with the bridge screwed all the way down, is to check whether the neck has too much relief. Hold the low E string down at the 1st and 15th or 17th frets and look to see how much gap there is at the 8th fret. It should be about .010" (for my tastes- the thickness of a light gauge high E string) gap between the top of the fret and the underside of the string. If it's higher, tighten the truss rod in 1/8 turn increments. If it was setup for .009s and you've put .013s on it, a truss rod adjustment is to be expected.

If that doesn't fix it, then there are other problems beyond the scope of simple adjustments. Is it returnable?

[Cunamara]

Good post Mch! If it's a new guitar and nobody removed the foam scratch protector from between the guitar and the bridge, do that ASAP before you set your action. That's just there for transit and never meant for playing.
If you are tempted to polish or wax the guitar while the strings are off, DON'T put anything in the area where the bridge foot and top meet; you don't need anything that will cause that bridge to slide as you're putting tension on the strings.

Remember that there is no "right" action. There's only what feels good to you. On an archtop especially, do experiment and raise or lower the action to what feels, sounds and responds well. Play it a little and play around.
Adjust your action and intonation as needed. Strings will change over time. Keep it playing true and expect to adjust intonation each time you put fresh strings on it.

Enjoy your new guitar!!!

According to the photos online, it's a Gibraltar TOM style bridge.

[Jimmy Smith]

If the neck is angled like that, you can tighten the truss rod. This will both bring the action down and straighten the neck.

[Jimmy blue note]

Pictures are worth a thousand words. phatjazz, could you take some photos of the guitar and post them here? Bridge, sighting down the neck, neck from the side, body from the side, neck from the side with the 14th fret depressed?

I think that will help us in helping you.
THanks

[MCh]

Good post Mch! If it's a new guitar and nobody removed the foam scratch protector from between the guitar and the bridge, do that ASAP before you set your action. That's just there for transit and never meant for playing.
If you are tempted to polish or wax the guitar while the strings are off, DON'T put anything in the area where the bridge foot and top meet; you don't need anything that will cause that bridge to slide as you're putting tension on the strings.

Remember that there is no "right" action. There's only what feels good to you. On an archtop especially, do experiment and raise or lower the action to what feels, sounds and responds well. Play it a little and play around.
Adjust your action and intonation as needed. Strings will change over time. Keep it playing true and expect to adjust intonation each time you put fresh strings on it.

Enjoy your new guitar!!!

Thank you,

Your thing about the foam protector makes me wonder if the guitar, being an hollowbody, could be bulging inappropriately either by excessive humidity or something inside the guitar that pushes on the top.

You're right about action. To each it's own! It depends on the guitarist, and it depends on the guitar, strings gauge, picking style, etc... A schredder guitar will usually have a lower action than a big traditional jazz box. The recommended action specified in the guitar specs is probably a good starting point. Then, tweak to taste.

[phatjazz]

You're right, Jimmy. Here are some photos. Thanks so much for the help, all! - Mary

[Jimmy Smith]

Did you get the action to your liking?

[Jimmy blue note]

Kinda looks like a back bow. If you can't get a clean vibration with the string depressed, back off on the truss rod a little until you can get a little clearance.

[sgosnell]

Action okay at the lower frets, too high at the upper frets might be a symptom of backbow in the neck, in which case the fix would be to loosen the truss rod to allow the neck to straighten. With a string fretted at the first and 17th, you should be able to tap any fret and get a slight ping, meaning there should be at least a tiny gap between the string and every fret. I prefer minimal relief, but not everyone does. Backbow is unacceptable to me. The photo posted seems to show no relief, but it's hard to tell for sure. I think I would try to loosen the truss rod very slightly, probably about the amount the wrench would move between the D and G strings without moving either. Then a little more if necessary. Every neck is a little different, and will react differently to different amounts of adjustment, so it's impossible to say how much would be required. Just loosen a little at a time and see what happens. If you go too far, tighten it a little at a time.

Obviously this is all without actually handling the guitar, so it's just a guess.

[Jimmy Smith]

It's not back bow. Look at the friggin picture of the string height at the 12th fret. There's a substantial amount of bow. If she wants to bring the action down, she needs to tighten the truss rod. Someone was asking me why I hassle the forum..

[Jerzy]

I have a new-to-me Ibanez AMH90 small- and fully hollow-body guitar. It is a very comfortable size for me, and the pickups sound very nice. I'm trying to figure out how to improve the action (or make it to my liking). Right now, as it came to me, the bridge is down as far as it will go. The action in the lower frets is nice and low (the way I like it), but the action up at the higher part of the fretboard is higher than I like. Any tips to lower / even-out the action?

Here's a link to what the guitar is like:Used Ibanez AMH90-CRF Hollow Body Electric Guitar Cherry | Guitar Center

You are not the first to have problem with this model.Original bridge is massive and you need to find different(smaller)one.I've replaced it with some aftermarket(Wilkinson?)and that solved the problem.I sold the guitar anyway.There was a long thread about this guitar on this forum.
Has anyone seen the new Ibanez AMH90 yet?

[phatjazz]

Ah. SO I first tried to loosen truss rod. Action just as high, possibly higher? I'll try tightening it later and see what that does. I'll let you know!

As for the bridge, I don't know! For now, I'm trying to get it so it plays a bit more comfortably (for me, lowering the action a bit if I can). Eventually I'll take it to my luthier (he's not available for a couple of weeks) and get the scoop. He's awesome, so if the bridge is unworkable for what I want, he'll figure that out.

Addendum to say that I'm very, very happy with the sound and the overall ergonomics. Amazing sound for the price, and I love how light it is. Once I sort out the action, I'll be super pleased I believe.

[mr. beaumont]

I think...and this is without guitar in front of me, so it's just speculation...that the tighten will do it. That's my gut feeling.

I've found a lot of guitars these days are shipped with very little tension on the truss rod, if any.

I'd tighten a little bit at a time, give the guitar a little time to settle in, check action, before tightening again. Sometimes a little can do a lot.

[JazzerEU]

If the truss rod is adjusted properly and the bridge is as low as it goes, I would guess that it has a bad neck angle. I once taught a student who had a vintage epiphone broadway from his grandparents but it a horrible neck angle and the rosewood bridge was as low as it would go. I ended up sanding removable saddle down and the action was then playable. In your case, with the bridge being made out of metal, I would see if you can find a tune-o-matic style replacement that is lower in profile.

[stringster]

first check the neck and make sure it is straight..if not tweak accordingly
sometimes frets move and need to be dressed/leveled
sometimes the top will move requiring a bridge base to be trimmed or even replaced to compensate
take to a luthier

[Jimmy blue note]

It's not back bow. Look at the friggin picture of the string height at the 12th fret. There's a substantial amount of bow. If she wants to bring the action down, she needs to tighten the truss rod. Someone was asking me why I hassle the forum..

That photo with the string pressed at first and seventeenth fret. It just looked to me like the frets were touching the string in between.


If there was enough relief, there would be clearance. But that's just the way I see it, photos can be deceptive. Plus, Jummy Smith, I defer to your expert advice an everything that goes behind your authority in these matters.
One thing I've learned around this forum is, if you make your case more assertively, it means you're right.
Thanks Jimmy Smith. :-)

[garybaldy]

That photo with the string pressed at first and seventeenth fret. It just looked to me like the frets were touching the string in between.


If there was enough relief, there would be clearance. But that's just the way I see it, photos can be deceptive. Plus, Jummy Smith, I defer to your expert advice an everything that goes behind your authority in these matters.
One thing I've learned around this forum is, if you make your case more assertively, it means you're right.
Thanks Jimmy Smith. :-)

Good post. Looking at the photo, the neck is either dead straight or has a back bow.
Not a good sign with that action and the bridge as low as it'll go.

[phatjazz]

Tweaking a bit with the truss rod, it's at least playable now, and sounds great. When my luthier is back, I'll take it to him. I'll report back if he decided it needed a new bridge, or a nut shim, or what have you. I think to make the action much better than it is at the moment will be beyond my pay grade.

[Jimmy blue note]

Tweaking a bit with the truss rod, it's at least playable now, and sounds great. When my luthier is back, I'll take it to him. I'll report back if he decided it needed a new bridge, or a nut shim, or what have you. I think to make the action much better than it is at the moment will be beyond my pay grade.

Hey phatjazz, if you're taking it to your luthier (I hope you do, that's the only way to really know), might I suggest that you have him take the string height down at the nut when everything else is put in order? I worked at Hoshino (Ibanez) and I'll tell you straight out that the action at the nut is ALWAYS set unnecessarily high so many issues that are revealed with a better set up guitar are hidden by high string height (not to mention better intonation.)
I won't get into it, but to say I've QC'd, set up and trouble shot literally thousands of Ibanez guitars and they are set to a height that is specified and does not necessarily promote easy playing.
Have him set it right, do a quick fret level crown and adjust the nut action to comfortably approach zero fret clearance. He'll know. This is the last step in a good set up and must be done when the action at the bridge is set where you want.

Just a suggestion that, all other things being set correctly, will give you a million dollar player. Well worth the effort. Have fun.

[sgosnell]

It's not just Ibanez. Every factory guitar comes with the nut slots way too high. It's just a given. The perfect height isn't always a known quantity, because it depends on the relief in the neck and personal preference. If the slots are cut down to what seems perfect with relief in the neck, and then the relief is removed, the slots will be too low and buzzing will result. If there is no relief, and some is added, the slots will then be too high. All this, combined with the time it takes to get the slots perfect and the danger of going too deep and requiring a new nut for the new guitar, makes it not economically feasible to get them any deeper than somewhere north of perfect. This affects intonation especially at the first few frets, and playability throughout the neck. Anyone who purchases a new factory-built guitar should automatically expect to need a setup. Some of us can do it ourselves, but not everyone has, or wants, the skills and tools necessary.