A Modern Method for Guitar Vol 1 - Lesson 12 - Pages 100 to 111

[ten left thumbs]

Thanks for listening through them Frank. The low F bear - I can't imagine ever needing to play down there fast. In real life music, that is. I understand he's putting me through my paces. As for the rest, it just needs time. My plan is to get through this book and then spend a good long time consolidating it, and reviewing, before starting vol 2.

You make the chords sound easy. The triplet exercise is a real challenge, but again you make it sound easy. Hope you feel better soon, Frank.

I'll say this again for the benefit of anyone learning from this book and just lurking on the thread. For a new rhythm, you've got to get the hang of it in a simple context first (i.e. not this page) before you start mixing it up with every rhythm under the sun. I can't think of any way of making this harder than trying to learn it from this page of the book.

[fep]

My plan is to get through this book and then spend a good long time consolidating it, and reviewing, before starting vol 2.

I'll say this again for the benefit of anyone learning from this book and just lurking on the thread. For a new rhythm, you've got to get the hang of it in a simple context first (i.e. not this page) before you start mixing it up with every rhythm under the sun. I can't think of any way of making this harder than trying to learn it from this page of the book.

I think that is a good plan. I'm with you, I don't want to jump right into the next volume yet.

To your point on advice to others on learning the quarter note triplet, those occur a lot in jazz standards, just look through the real book. I think it's useful to find a tune with a lot of them, and listen to the recording focusing on the quarter note triplets in the melody. Then learn and practice the melody. For some reason, I find that much easier to get the hang of them than playing them cold from notation.

[ten left thumbs]

To your point on advice to others on learning the quarter note triplet, those occur a lot in jazz standards, just look through the real book. I think it's useful to find a tune with a lot of them, and listen to the recording focusing on the quarter note triplets in the melody. Then learn and practice the melody. For some reason, I find that much easier to get the hang of them than playing them cold from notation.

+1

Absolutely. These are best just heard and felt, not counted.

[Langs]

It feels a bit weird to resurrect this thread, especially since it seems like a finale where two people remained and that's the histoire of it; I hope this doesn't come off too crude.

In case it doesn't, here's the first part of this lesson;

p100 - A Major Scale

relatively comfortable with this one. I don't know why, but I like the G#.

p100 - Eighth Note Study

Similar feelings here as the A Major Scale

p101 - Arpeggio's

Not as much of a struggle as my very first try, but still stiff stiff stiff. Can't say I have the downstrokes and upstrokes always as the book suggests either. It's so easy to fall back into that alternate picking doesn't it.

[fumblefingers]

Hey Langs, you have a nice tone.

Some constructive feedback from an old teacher:

1. It sounds like you're using all down strokes, but you're supposed to be using alternate picking. Are you using alternate?

2. By this point in the book you should be playing these faster - not fast, but faster. The way that you're playing these sounds like quarter notes at a very slow tempo. Can you keep up with Larry Baione on the DVD, or whomever plays on the CD? From my recollection they play slowly, but not quite as slowly as you did on these recordings.

These scale, scale with chromatics, and arpeggio exercises by Bill Leavitt are basic foundations for jazz vocabulary building, so while you needn't be a speed demon, you need to bring up the tempo.

Have you attempted to play these faster, and can you play evenly and clearly? Why not give it a shot and tell us what challenges you encounter when doing so.


Ciao.

[Langs]

Hey Langs, you have a nice tone.

Thanks very much

1. It sounds like you're using all down strokes, but you're supposed to be using alternate picking. Are you using alternate?

It's actually alternate picking all over, apart from the quarter notes of course. Even with the arpeggio's, where I'm supposed to play more downstrokes, I tend to slip into alternate picking if I'm not careful.

2. By this point in the book you should be playing these faster - not fast, but faster. The way that you're playing these sounds like quarter notes at a very slow tempo. Can you keep up with Larry Baione on the DVD, or whomever plays on the CD? From my recollection they play slowly, but not quite as slowly as you did on these recordings.

I just have the book. The very slow speed is actually on purpose, taking the advise many times to practice very slowly just to get the relation and evenness hammered in thourougly? The big idea is to up the tempo each time I'm reviewing this book. The tempo I'm playing at is mostly 52 Bpm. Should I try 72 or something?

Have you attempted to play these faster, and can you play evenly and clearly? Why not give it a shot and tell us what challenges you encounter when doing so.

Technically, I'm pretty sure I can play faster than 52 Bpm and still sound even. I'll try and see what happens at 72 Bpm and post it up. Mostly the hard part is reading the notes though. Of course, less of a problem when I start memorizing everything, which brings me to another consideration; aren't you supposed to be able to play those at the tempo you're practicing? I can assure you the reading studies throw me when tried any faster than 52 Bpm though...

Really appreciate the feedback very much, fumblefingers!

[fumblefingers]

Yes it's OK to memorize, or semi-memorize these 3 exercises. Yes, bump up the tempo a little 72, 80, 100 even. The second two exercises will be more difficult of course.

[smokinguit]

I think you sound relatively good at 52 bpm. You didn't let the few errors throw you off. Work on smoothing out those errors. As fumblefinger pointed out your next step is to bump up the tempo gradually. Each day add 2 to 3 clicks. You have to push yourself if you want to improve.

[Langs]

Each day add 2 to 3 clicks. You have to push yourself if you want to improve.

I do this with things outside MMfG. This is a study group in which you can't spend weeks on end on 1 exercise and you bump a few bpm as you go each day. That's why chose to even out the errors slowly and thoroughly during my first iteration, then when it's time for reviewing I start bumping. But yes I'm familiar with the philophy that you have to challenge yourself if you need to improve;

[Langs]

So anyways dispite being aware that you need to bump speed gradually while yet having my set of reasons why I'm sticking to a snail's pace conciously, I couldn't help accepting the challenge from your feedback.

So here's A major scale from page 100 at 68 Bpm


Cheers,
Kevin

[Langs]

Long hiatus: Moving houses and turning my life upside down will do that. The idea with the new life is more time on the guitar, so that should pay off eventually I guess.

p102 - Reading Studies - A Major1 - Fingering Type4

p104 - Tres Sharp - Rev1 - 52 Bpm

[Langs]

p105 - Sixteenth notes

A couple of notes were shakey, but no real missed notes. A bit of ritard, unwillingly at the end.

p105 - Chord forms

Same typical hesitation because of the left hand having trouble chording at times. Been paying more attention to using reststrokes though and these are gaining shape.

p106 - Speed Studies

I like how these things are spidery and how there's endlessly more room for improvement in the coördination department. That's why I love slow tempo's.

p107 - Chord forms

Just struggling I guess. A long way from playing it relaxed and musical.

[Langs]

Not the idealest piece to tackle after having lost momentum due to hiatus....

Man, I struggled forever with this. The chording; I never had to play so many chords and never played such a long piece on my own in my life. I definitely experience it a serious chording workout as chord changes do feel easier after this.

Melody: a couple of sharps or flats where there should be a natural and vice versa.

p108 - Second Position Review

[GuyBoden]

Great stuff, well done.

You probably already know, but there's a great post by HighSpeedSpoon showing the finger patterns here:




Some great info about using the Leavitt Finger Patterns here by Joey Goldstein on RMMGJ:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...Y/nebRhk_dfwcJ

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...Y/ZfbxgwiPZh4J
Quote:
"Joey Goldstein
Guitarist/Jazz Recording Artist/Teacher

First a recap of Leavitt's rules:

1. Position number is determined by the fret number that the 1st finger
USUALLY falls across. So if the 1st finger usually falls across the 5th
fret you are in Pos V. Any notes you need to play in the 5th fret are
played with the 1st finger only. The first finger is also used to
stretch down 1 fret. So in Pos V any notes you want to play in the 4th
fret will be played with a 1st finger stretch. If the 1st finger plays
in any other fret a position shift has occurred (which is not
necessarily a bad thing but should be done with awareness).

2. The 2nd finger ALWAYS plays one fret above the usual fret of the 1st
finger. So in Pos V the 2nd finger plays any notes in the 6th fret. The
2nd finger ONLY plays in the 6th fret. If the 2nd finger is used in any
other fret a position shift has occurred (which is not necessarily a bad
thing but should be done with awareness).

3. The 3rd finger ALWAYS plays 1 fret above the 2nd finger. So in Pos V
the 3rd finger plays any notes in the 7th fret. The 3rd finger ONLY
plays in the 7th fret. If the 3rd finger is used in any other fret a
position shift has occurred (which is not necessarily a bad thing but
should be done with awareness).

4. The 4th finger USUALLY plays one fret above the 3rd finger. So in Pos
V the 4th finger plays any notes in the 8th fret. The 4th finger is also
used to play any notes needed in the 9th fret via a 4th finger stretch.
If the 4th finger is used in any other fret a position shift has occurred
(which is not necessarily a bad thing but should be done with awareness).

5. Position is also partially determined by placement of the thumb in
that when playing within a single position the thumb remains at a single
spot the back of neck just behind the 1st finger's fretboard position.
Position shifts require the thumb to be moved up or down the back of the neck.

6. Two notes in the same fret on different strings are played with the
same finger by "rolling" the finger across the strings or by flattening
(i.e. partially barring) the finger across the strings. To do otherwise
(i.e. to use two different fingers in the same fret) would cause a
position shift (which is not necessarily a bad thing but should be done
with awareness). My own preference is for partial barring rather than
rolling. This requires you to think a few moves ahead but is much smoother.

7. Never use a finger stretch for a note that is available without one
unless it vastly improves execution of a particular passage.

So Pos V effectively covers a 6 fret span from fret 4 thru fret 9.

Most structures (scales, arpeggios) in all keys can be played by
following these rules within a single position and that is why they are
still so popular. "

Also some good info quoted below from Steve Carter who worked with Bill Leavitt:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...M/WV29fyq02hUJ



"Steve Carter

When I was teaching at Berklee, and Bill Leavitt was my boss, I asked
him that question. He said:

"Well, fingering type 1 has first finger stretches and fingering type 4 has fourth finger stretches.
Fingering type 2 makes sense since it starts with the second finger. So I named all those,
and I had this one fingering type left over. I'd used 1, 2, and 4, so I said, 'What the hell. 3'"

I'm not making this up.: -)

Leavitt's rules are: use the fingering determined by the fingering type.
For other out-of-position notes, use finger-stretch one, if the next note is higher, finger-stretch four if the next note is lower.
A quick review of pages 60 through 102 of Volume One will confirm this.

As for improvising and fingerings: to this day I still practice Leavitt's scale fingerings.
I warm up with all twelve keys in one position and/or one key in twelve positions.

But if someone asks me:"Do you use those fingerings when you improvise?
I have to answer, "I don't know. I don't think about fingerings when I improvise. I can't.There's too much else going on."

Steve Carter
www.frogstoryrecords.com"

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...o/mZNJ6p510V4J

"
One of Bill Leavitt's pet sayings: There are two words you
should not use when discussing music: "never" and "always."

Steve
Steve Carter
www.frogstoryrecords.com"

[matt.guitarteacher]

Great post, Guy. The way I remember type 3's labeling is that it starts on the 3 of the scale (major scale, from the 6th string). Completely arbitrary and unrelated, but it's just a memory thang.

Love the story of his naming them. Thanks for sharing.

[Langs]

Great stuff, well done.

You probably already know, but there's a great post by HighSpeedSpoon showing the finger patterns here:

Thanks so much for listening and the feedback man!

Also appreciate the elaboration on William Leavitt's fingering patterns. They came right at a time when I was wondering what the deal was with these fingering type codes.

Finished off this lesson a couple of days ago as I'm moving towards finishing Vol 1.

Here's the rest:

p110 - Chord forms Ex 1


p110 - Chord forms Ex 2


p111 - Quarter Note Triplets