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Not about the generic ones. That's for the special respected professionals only.
But when you have to give the opinion to.. not maybe even a friend but someone who really tries.
Mine have changed over the years. When younger, I was pretty blunt. But that was awful because of the "taste" variable.
Can't be blunt.. So, got to have rules. Have you made to yourself a few of those?
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04-06-2024 03:54 PM
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Only when I can point to something specific they're not doing well, and only if I could provide help when they follow up.
Originally Posted by emanresu
Though honestly, I only do even that if they ask.
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What is the situation in which I have to give a review?
What comes to mind is a joke I heard a comedian tell. "No matter how weird somebody is dressed, you know that, earlier that day, they were in front of a mirror going 'looks good to me' ".
People are generally trying their best. That's the parade you have an opportunity to rain on.
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The situation is that when you are asked. By a friend or by someone who really tried (that could be yourself, you know). Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
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You have to learn how to disambiguate objective criteria and taste criteria.
It’s also about learning what is useful to say for the other person - what will help them improve and develop, which is not always a stark appraisal of their shortcomings or strengths.
It’s an art form. You have to practice and reflect.
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I know two pros who just say "can't play" about almost everyone.
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They sound like fun people who are cool and fun to be around and who like to have fun. Originally Posted by sgcim
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If I didn't know the person, I'd keep negative thoughts to myself. I'd point to whatever I liked.
If it was a friend, and I thought I had something helpful to say that wouldn't damage the relationship, I'd first compliment everything worth complimenting and then say something like "if I was forced to tweak one thing, it might be ...".
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We all know some of them haha Originally Posted by sgcim
Then to say “what terrible things do you say about me then?” And then they look very uncomfortable but get the point lol.
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I wouldn't know they're both internet/phone friends. I met one of them twice about 20 or 30 years ago, but he doesn't remember me. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
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What? WHAT??? WHATTT DO YOU MEAN ONE TINY THING??? Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
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Although I think I should point out as a Brit I am really not averse to a bit of cathartic negativity.
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Only if asked, and then I try to complement the good and not mention the bad... the old "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all" rule. If then pressed further, I would be truthful about their shortcomings, but phrasing in ways such as "well you could work on..." rather than "you really can't do x, and you need to" (as an example)
Id REALLY pressed, like if they asked a yes or no question, like "am I good enough to play in a band?", I would be brutally honest, but also preference it with THIS IS ONLY MY OPINION.
If this is a goods friend, all bets are off, I'm just dead honest, perhaps even a little ribbing... because good friends "get that" and it's not a problem. "Your scales are good, but your chords suck... almost as bad as your chili" LOL
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I do this for a living.
I tell them a positive up front and one at the end too.
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"You sure have a nice guitar. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Too bad your playing sucks.
But your Mom is smokin' hot!"
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Lol, I think those are definitely words I typed here... Originally Posted by starjasmine
For the record, I never told a student their mom was hot. Even if they were.
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When I first came here about 17 years ago everything anybody posted was showered with likes and everybody told each other how wonderful they were. Like a self-satisfied mutual appreciation society. It was fairly disgusting. No genuine appreciation, no discernment, nothing. Just a lot of false back-patting even when the stuff they were praising was obviously awful.
So I began to put critiques in. Good stuff got told it was good but the rest got suggestions about what might lift their performance a bit. Soon the hordes rounded on me and the threats and insults started. I know they were all sending each other nasty little private messages because I could feel it, like a bunch of old women. One person said he was leaving the forum because I'd completely ruined his enjoyment of it, all by myself presumably. Funny thing was he was a very good player and I'd told him so. Figure that one out. Incidentally, he apologised later.
So I stayed and it slowly got better because younger players were coming in and the more stuffy traditional people were dropping out. Friendly critiques became more commonplace, the atmosphere became more open and less fear-based like before, and we are where we are now. Which is very nearly tolerable... just :-)
Anyway, re. the OP's post, I have no rules. Why would I need rules? I wouldn't criticise beginners who are trying their best. If I genuinely like something I say so and I don't mind a bit if I'm criticised myself. Good lord, they might be right, and quite often are.
Personally, I don't see how we can learn anything if we're always being told we're wonderful. Only idiots would welcome that. It's that simple, basically.
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The other thing is, I avoid criticizing anything unless my own performance in that medium reflects that my criticism is coming from a place of knowledge/experience.
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Which, in your case, it does. Actually, if I have any criticism of you (which I don't really) it's that you're not forthcoming enough. So there
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Nah, when I say I don't know about stuff, I really don't. What I don't know could fill a book. Originally Posted by ragman1
Which, in your case, it does. Actually, if I have any criticism of you (which I don't really) it's that you're not forthcoming enough. So there
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Crusaders for truth!
For what it’s worth, my memory of ancient JGO was that it was quite a bit more of a cage match than it is now.
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The use of criticizing someone's playing, for me, is only to help make it better. So taking under consideration how the person plays, what they can do, how they would receive the critic, what our relationship is, if it's a friend or a student etc, if I can think of something that would practically help, I say it. That could be mentioning the strong points as well, not only the weaknesses.
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I haven't read any of the replies yet but my first reaction would be that "having to" does not occur, unless your a professional writer, a music critique, I guess. That said, of course you may criticise, you don't "have to".
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Ok, I've just read post #1.
If someone asks for an opinion about their playing I give them my point of view, assuming that they've asked for it because they want to improve but keeping in mind that they also want to be encouraged...
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Years ago I ruined the morale of some dude by giving the opinion about an aspect of his project.
He attempted several times to improve, last one was almost there. That's what I told him, "almost there"...
He said "ok, that's the best I could do, gonna give up!". The project was very cool, that's why I tried to help, but made him miserable instead.
I think best behavior would be to just list the things that could help to improve and shut up with the opinions early.
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