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I too enjoy Christian's videos.
Recording is a funny thing. I find that even recording direct with pre-saved settings the sound can vary drastically when using the same gear. Very frustrating
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08-19-2023 04:24 AM
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+1
Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Funny thing watching some of that vid is that I've always played Rumba that way, but never stopped to think how or why. The "mechanics" of it don't look much fun.
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Keep it short. And keep the the lesson content very short and precise. Teach one small bite sized “thing”. Start immediately with you playing that “thing” up to speed. Don’t implore everyone to sign up or click the bell. If you have good content people will follow you.
I always point to gypsy guitarist Robin Nolan as a great example of how to do a YT lesson as described above.
Too much talking in Jen’s videos for me. Sorry you too Christian and I do appreciate your posts here.Last edited by alltunes; 08-19-2023 at 09:31 AM.
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"Making money in Jazz"
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You can’t watch YouTube in a half-assed kind of way, you have to know what to look for. That means you’ve already spent time with a private teacher who has helped you build a solid foundation so you…KNOW WHAT TO LOOK FOR and to use it accordingly to the musical vision you have.
I watch YouTube mainly for the Barry Harris content that gives me insights on how to play through tunes in a unique way, for the purposes of solo, piano-style guitar. Basically a few piano players and guitarists. There’s a classical guitarist who has discovered BH and really gone to town with his harmonic concepts. His “elevator” concept of going though various musical floors in an integrated way was actually stuff I already thought about and practiced, but haven’t systematically thought about.
As for non BH, I think Jens does a good job, he has a lot of actual funny, humorous stuff. He’s a good player, who knows how to present stuff, systematically and clearly. I would never hold myself out as a teacher or instructor, I’m just a schmuck who takes his guitar to the beach and mountains because life is too short not to. But I know how to assess the qualities of a good teacher.
People may say they are beyond “beginner” stuff. But never fundamentals, if we are honest. Metheny said, in a recent interview, he’s 10 times the guitarist he was when Bright Sized Life became he practices all the time. And he practices FUNDAMENTALS all the time still.
Music is the progressive mastery of fundamental, elemental concepts.
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I like it when someone posts a comment with a time stamp and a message like, “lesson begins at ….”, or “actual content begins at….”
Because, almost always, it takes the presenter forever to get started.
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Most big YouTube guitar channels these days are very professional in visuals, sound, material, click bait, etc. Teaching online seems like a huge investment in time, effort (and money) with uncertain results for all but a handful of channels..
It does help with actual teaching though. I personally just play, and occasionally do small instructional videos for my students. I wouldn't focus on YouTube, but it's relatively easy to have a decent channel.
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Jack -
I've been wanting to stick in some comments for some time. I'm glad, on the evidence of this thread, that you've realised there's a problem.
So, if you actually want to listen, let me spell it out. I warn you I'm blunt. On the other hand, it's calling a spade a spade.
Ditch the shades. No one wants to talk to an automaton, a faceless person you can't connect with. We can't see your eyes. That's first.
Then there's the distance. Who wants to peer across a room at something we can't see or hear properly? Put your face, sans shades, in the frame. Connect with your viewer.
Then there's the sound quality. It's barely audible. The backing tracks are vague and jangle. We have to look at your fingers doing this and that on the neck, but what are you actually teaching?
There's no real step-by-step instruction. You haven't thought it out. It's not user-friendly in the slightest. You need to explain what you're teaching and why before you start doing it. Close up so we can see.
You need some notation, not little diagrams in a corner somewhere but where we can see them. And they have to be relevant.
Go slowly. Be precise. Not just about what you're doing but why you're doing it. Explain its use and advantage.
At the moment it looks as though you're addressing a whole room of students as an audience with you standing on a stage. That's not a YouTube tutorial. That's an awful presentation, out of reach, distant, with a person hiding behind dark glasses like a mask (or a drug problem) and almost completely non-communicable. You're not contacting us and we can't contact you.
I don't care about the artwork, it's the use of the room itself that's wrong. Ditch the room.
In short, the whole thing looks like it's done for your benefit and no one else's. Your ego is getting a kick out of standing there, all cool in your shades, playing very advanced stuff.
To be honest, you haven't thought it out at all. It's like you're just fulfilling some sort of emotional need and desire of your own.
Nothing wrong with that, if you really need to do that, but don't expect anyone to be that interested. And certainly don't expect them to pay for the privilege.
If you want to make good instructional videos face the camera. Let's see your face in good light. Talk to the listener directly. Explain slowly and carefully in a graded, sequential manner. Provide examples. Work it all out carefully beforehand and present it clearly, very clearly. With any luck you'll get a good reputation and people will follow you.
If you're lucky, that is. Good instruction is rare.
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(I'm mostly talking about the videos where you're standing in the room, of course. Some of the others, like the blues one, are better).
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This is actually good advice. It’s a shame you feel the need to be so mean throughout the rest of the post. If it were just this, it might get a listen.If you want to make good instructional videos face the camera. Let's see your face in good light. Talk to the listener directly. Explain slowly and carefully in a graded, sequential manner. Provide examples. Work it all out carefully beforehand and present it clearly, very clearly. With any luck you'll get a good reputation and people will follow you.
(And no, blunt doesn’t need to be unkind. Blunt is when you don’t take the time to needlessly soften your criticism. When you take additional time to speculate about the emotional state of your subject in order to needlessly pad your criticism, you’re being the opposite of blunt. You’re pontificating and being pretty unpleasant while you’re at it.)
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I agree Jens is good (and he has done a few BH videos) but I prefer how he used to present his videos - a few more recent ones I notice he tries to be funny but whether he is funny or not is irrelevant. I don't know why people - teachers, that is - will try to be funny, that's not what they're there for, it strikes me as a bit indulgent, and I'm not sure why they feel it's necessary. If I sit down to watch one of these videos I take it seriously and will make notes so I can practice it - simple as that. All you need is good content - flashy production values and jokes are unnecessary, IMO. Originally Posted by NSJ
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Ummm, that's incorrect. I think I already said I'd be happy about getting students and I fully realize that it's a pull through thing for sales moreso than the $0.0008 / play that you get on youtube. Originally Posted by AllanAllen
I just created a patreon and when I populate it, I think it will be a better source for making money targeting lessons, downloads, etc.
In the meantime, i addressed some complaints and recently did this video without the background distractions...
Interesting sidebar - back in the days when people actually bought books, I always noticed a correlation between posting youtube video lessons and people buying my books. However, it doesn't make a lot of difference these days. Despite releasing dozens of videos over the last month or two, my book sales netted me a whopping $48.00 USD !
Can't even take my wife out to dinner on that...
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FWIW This is my platonic ideal for a musical YouTube video Originally Posted by James W
plenty of humour but it never feels forced and the content is unfailingly highbrow haha. The playing and musical content is front and centre. There’s so much info, and you have to pause it and dig through it sometimes, but it’s worth it.
Same for anything by Early Music Sources
I don’t think he’ll be massively successful lol. But this is the sort of thing I like. But I’m a flipping weirdo.
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Yeah.. it sounds tough making a living doing jazz teaching online. I wouldn't consider myself a good jazz player yet but I have made some beer money (just a metaphor I'm sober lol) doing the bare minimum with online surveys on prolific while practicing. I made around $50 the past 5 weekdays doing short studies though it will probably vary depending on which demographic you're on and whether a bunch of studies show up or not by luck. It might be worth looking into streaming too but in my case I'm not sure it will be worth it since I practice mostly technical stuff and it will most likely get boring to watch someone practicing technical drills all day. But who knows? People probably watch anything nowadays
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It seems to me that this is one of those pursuits in which there is a very small percentage of those who give it a shot, who are able to make a go of it. I really wouldn't want to live or die on how many "likes" or views I get. The whole thing just seems too outside my control. A successful person would not only have to be able to deliver the goods as an instructor, but also be a bit of a showman with some kind of shtick that attracts enough people to make a go of it. Those of us who went through college probably remember those professors who could make a class interesting and those whose classes were famously dry. Both types probably had the goods in terms of subject knowledge, but not all had the ability to put it across well. So it seems to me to be that a person who intends to try to make money off of teaching via youtube videos would have to take serious stock of his or her ability to do what is necessary to consistently draw those all-important views. In college, we had to take certain classes so there wasn't much choice about which professor we got, but with youtube there are too many choices. I am not that showman type and I know that, and have no interest in trying to be. Fortunately, I had other marketable skills to build a good career from which I was able to retire. Originally Posted by jazznylon
Tony
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Yeah and the professor analogy also maybe is a bit simpler because a lot of material could be recycled year over year and, aside from the planning, the performance itself was just a real-time thing. Originally Posted by tbeltrans
So much of the video (youtube, TikTok, Instagram) lesson thing is in the production. The actual production and planning of the videos and stuff is such a time suck and I never really had to do any of that. I haven’t talked to a bunch of people who do that work, but I bet if you asked, they’d say that’s the big mistake people make: underestimating the behind the scenes time it takes to literally put the video together. Not the content knowledge, not the planning, not the performing, but the actual stitching together of clips, making them look good, developing a strategy, and sticking to it.
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I think you missed my point. The analogy of the professor was not about what s/he is teaching or the amount of prep, but about the personality s/he brings to the class. I said that here: Originally Posted by pamosmusic
Those of us who went through college probably remember those professors who could make a class interesting and those whose classes were famously dry. Both types probably had the goods in terms of subject knowledge, but not all had the ability to put it across well.
I am sure that to do a decent video, there is a lot of work behind the scenes. But even with all that work, it takes a certain type of personality to put it across in an entertaining manner and that is what I was talking about. As I mentioned, in college that aspect is less important because we had to take the class as part of our major, while with youtube, if you aren't hooked in within the first several seconds, you can move on with a mouse click. That part is personality, not well thought out content. An important part of this is that the presenter will need to be part sales person to sell the prospective viewer on the video as being worth watching for 8 or 15 minutes or whatever.
There certainly situations in which a prospective viewer is keen on learning some specific thing and just maybe there aren't many youtube videos to choose from, so s/he will sit through a less entertaining video to get the material being presented. But since it seems difficult to attract and keep viewers, this is probably not as prevalent as having to attract viewers with some sort of shtick.
Tony
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Didn’t miss your point. Wasn’t disagreeing either. Just adding to it. On top of deciding whether or not you’re the kind of person who can be engaging, you also have to decide if you’re the kind of person who wants to put in loads and loads of work to put the product out. Almost certainly more than a person imagines before they get it going. That’s also a certain personality.
Im honestly pretty good at explaining material in lessons. I’m kind of funny on a good day. I’m usually as engaging as a person can be while talking about articulation or whatever. But I just do not have that behind the scenes stuff in my personality.
Wasn’t disagreeing with you in the least. It’s just such a specific skill set and such a specific personality.
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Funny video...
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OK. Gotcha. Originally Posted by pamosmusic
I fully agree. I suppose one way to know if one is the type of person who would be willing to put in the work required, would be to give it a shot.
On the acoustic guitar forum (AGF) some time ago, I started a thread for those who were interested in arranging fingerstyle renditions of pop tunes and standards to participate. Not surprisingly, there ended up being only a very few of us, but it was fun. We would make videos to put up on youtube of us playing the tunes and explaining how we went about making the arrangements. I tend to write mine out with pencil and staff paper in standard notation and in these, I added TAB because many folks don't read music. My experience with that process of making the video and preparing the notation was much more work than I would be willing to do on a regular basis. We only did a few tunes and then pretty much drifted away fro the thread, which was fine by me. I realized that I would rather play my guitar than show other people how to play theirs. I sure am glad there are others who feel differently.
I do stuff as a volunteer such as being on our condo board now for 30+ years, mostly as president and helping around the building maintaining the security and FOB/garage door opener computer system, the security cameras, and other tasks as they come up. I also teach ESL and computer skills at the library as a volunteer. But these are interactive things and (at least to me) quite a bit different from making videos and preparing that sort of lesson.
I also worked as a full time musician for about two years touring constantly and was able to realize that the life really didn't appeal to me. The good thing is that I was able to try it, get it out of my system, and get on with my life early enough to build a nice career elsewhere.
So, for me, it has been some fortunate events in my life that I could try things and find out what suits me and what doesn't. Making youtube teaching videos wouldn't suit me and your points about the work involved is a big part of that.
Tony
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[QUOTE=alltunes;1281888]Keep it short. And keep the the lesson content very short and precise. Teach one small bite sized “thing”. Start immediately with you playing that “thing” up to speed. Don’t implore everyone to sign up or click the bell. If you have good content people will follow you.
I always point to gypsy guitarist Robin Nolan as a great example of how to do a YT lesson as described above.
Great advice! I would just add that it's essential to leverage modern technology and make the most of it. Cold emails are not as effective anymore, for example. It's much better to use tools like slack sms for more efficient and direct communication. Embracing these advancements can significantly enhance your outreach efforts and keep your audience engaged in a rapidly evolving digital landscapeLast edited by benhatchins; 12-28-2023 at 05:22 AM.
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No, not really. I don't mean this to say Alltune's advice is ill meant or not constructive, but I wouldn't take it as a template on 'how to make videos'. Originally Posted by benhatchins
There's a lot of factors at play. I'm not just saying that because he doesn't like my videos haha. (I certainly think they are not beyond critique lol, I agree with some of his criticisms.)
But, consider - Jens is one of the most successful jazz guitar YouTubers. On balance he's obviously doing something that works really well. You can't please everyone.
At some point I might post a compilation of my most negative and most positive comments (it's pretty funny) so people can appreciate how little help a lot of this stuff is. It's tempting to pay too much attention to either extreme. You have to view a lot of it as 'white noise' tbh.
If I've learned anything (which is questionable), if you get one persons opinion on your youTube videos, you have one person's opinion on your YouTube videos.
For the same reason, I'd be wary of drawing too many conclusions from polling your subscribers on your content if you want to grow your channel. These are people who already like your videos and want you to keep on what you are doing by and large, but this may not attract new subscribers if the aim is to grow your channel. If you detect a patten in constructive criticism that can be helpful - but I do think that can push your channel into becoming generic if you're not careful. It's important to hang onto the things that are distinctive.
I'm not saying this because I think my content is unimproveable - actually I've been changing my approach quite a bit in recent months. But there are people out there who like long form content and have it on at work etc. I enjoy video essays on non-music topics for instance.
So there are no easy answers. I think you have find a style of video making that works for both you and your audience. That's a LOT harder.
So what IS my advice?
Well, for sustainable YouTubing you do have to find a sweet spot between pleasing yourself and pleasing the audience*. Too much of the former and your videos will hit a ceiling of popularity, too much of the latter and you may burn out. Some people are lucky to have that out of the hatch, for the rest of us it's a longer search. There's a lot of stuff completely unrelated to how well you play or make videos even.. what works for someone else may not work for you. But don't be afraid to shake things up and try stuff that seems out of the box. Try to find something honest.
Bit like music really.
*actually pleasing your audience is only, depressingly, one model of YouTube success.Last edited by Christian Miller; 12-18-2023 at 06:43 AM.
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I mean, if you watch my most recent video, you'll notice I've moved towards a more generic style of YouTube lighting etc as suggested in the video Jack posted a while ago. But there's people who find this annoying and cringe. Purple/pink lighting and guitars in shot? Deconstructed clickbait title and thumbnail?
Sigh.
In contrast, one of my favourite music YouTubers Pat Finnerty (What Makes this Song Stink) gently mocks the conventions of Guitar and Music YouTube while creating his own deconstructed approach (which amusingly must take FAR more work than your average hyper-polished Paul Davids video).
I mean I have no idea what he's saying 30% of time, but don't matter to me.
TBF he's only got 165K subs, but it's more than me (not more than Jens tho.)
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Great sorta "unknown" jazz guitarist Mark Elf got an early start on online teaching. Had a nice long chat with him at one of his road gigs. Wonderful dude, and a fabulous bopper.
Jazz Guitarist Jazz Recordings Mark Elf
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