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  1. #151

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    I don't know much about classical guitar so won't criticize this guys playing on a technical or even a musical level but from a performance standpoint those right hand flourishes at the beginning of the piece ain't gettin' it in 2016. Maybe back in the day when people were wearing powdered wigs, but not now. Maybe in some parts of the world they still do wear powdered wigs but this cowboy ain't buyin' it. IM(somewhat arrogant)O he's milking it.


    There is just so much wrong with this, but I will simply offer these were not powdered wig people.


    Btw that's not the beginning of the piece, that like 17 minutes in. The video simply starts there.

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  3. #152

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    Classical guitar needs more windmills, imho.

  4. #153

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    Yeah I found that flourishy thing he was doing to be a bit annoying and 'put on'. But y'know whatever, everyone does their own thing. Rock and roll!

    I also get annoyed by all that moving around Chris Thile does - I find it more distracting and irritating than expressive. But the man can play, obviously.

    I dislike signs of this type of thing in my own and other people's performances - looks stiff, nervous and weird. Stay still dammit!
    Loads of people disagree.

    Sometimes it can be cool though. Jimi Hendrix was cool at moving. Dizzy Gillespie too. I suppose it helps if there is some fluidity, grace and naturalness to the movement.

  5. #154

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove
    There is just so much wrong with this, but I will simply offer these were not powdered wig people.


    Btw that's not the beginning of the piece, that like 17 minutes in. The video simply starts there.
    Thanks for the correction on the start time but I still stand with my opinion that the flourishes are BS. I humbly admit that I could be wrong about everything else.

  6. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Yeah I found that flourishy thing he was doing to be a bit annoying and 'put on'. But y'know whatever, everyone does their own thing. Rock and roll!

    I also get annoyed by all that moving around Chris Thile does - I find it more distracting and irritating than expressive. But the man can play, obviously.

    I dislike signs of this type of thing in my own and other people's performances - looks stiff, nervous and weird. Stay still dammit!
    Loads of people disagree.

    Sometimes it can be cool though. Jimi Hendrix was cool at moving. Dizzy Gillespie too. I suppose it helps if there is some fluidity, grace and naturalness to the movement.
    Very true. Everyone does their own thing: I'm OK you're OK, if it feels good do it, it's all good, everything is everything,
    koo kook a joob.

  7. #156

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    Thanks for the correction on the start time but I still stand with my opinion that the flourishes are BS. I humbly admit that I could be wrong about everything else.

    Please give me a time marking on these offending flourishes. In the meantime, please check out these time marks and tell me this isn't some of the most amazing guitar playing you've ever seen.



    Here are a couple mind blowers, vid 3 21:12 just blew my mind...15:03, 18:10, 25:45, 27:55-28:18 my favorite moment)


    https://youtube.com/watch?ebc=ANyPxKpgzkgq-U4cQsGO2-yhSoRRenEhS_XINI-L17lHj9D_8zJKji0pjdZ8jEu0SQRhP1XEIuK1G5BlW1LTu9V0J 4GFYYCJ7g&v=OwmljH41B1Q



    Would someone mind telling me how to embed a video. Thanks
    Last edited by vintagelove; 12-26-2016 at 01:40 PM.

  8. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    Hey, I stated this thread, and I think a lot of very interesting thoughts have been brought up, but no one has addressed the above, you all skipped over it. Jazz pianists may be better musicians than most other instrumentalists. Do you dare to disagree? Is being a better musician harder than not being a better musician?
    OK, seeing that you guys wanna talk about other stuff, I'll argue against my own post ....

    Hmm.... so how about considering that the guitar takes so much more unrewarded effort than the piano (at advanced levels at least) as an argument to make that the guitar is harder to master? 10,000 quality hours from a highly talented player gets you less reward as a guitar player compared to the same effort on piano. 4 years at a music conservatory yields more impressive results (to the average listener) for the piano player, over the guitar player.

    So, we can work equally hard, just to end up sounding less impressive. Therefor, in order to sound equally impressive, the guitar is harder work

    Reductionism?. Or Sophistry?

  9. #158

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    OK, seeing that you guys wanna talk about other stuff, I'll argue against my own post ....

    Hmm.... so how about considering that the guitar takes so much more unrewarded effort than the piano (at advanced levels at least) as an argument to make that the guitar is harder to master? 10,000 quality hours from a highly talented player gets you less reward as a guitar player compared to the same effort on piano. 4 years at a music conservatory yields more impressive results (to the average listener) for the piano player, over the guitar player.

    So, we can work equally hard, just to end up sounding less impressive. Therefor, in order to sound equally impressive, the guitar is harder work

    Reductionism?. Or Sophistry?
    I agree that in order to sound equally impressive the guitar is harder work.

  10. #159

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    ... Pianists I know are better at hearing, better at transcription, better at discerning rhythm, better at hearing bass lines, better at composition, even better at singing, or can improvise vocally better than other instrumentalists I know. Generally speaking, and based on my own limited observations, granted...
    After reading this paragraph, I'm off to teach my self some piano. It's kinda the next best thing after menstrual pads with wings.



    Sent from VladanMovies @ YouTube

  11. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove
    Please give me a time marking on these offending flourishes. In the meantime, please check out these time marks and tell me this isn't some of the most amazing guitar playing you've ever seen.



    Here are a couple mind blowers, vid 3 21:12 just blew my mind...15:03, 18:10, 25:45, 27:55-28:18 my favorite moment)


    https://youtube.com/watch?ebc=ANyPxKpgzkgq-U4cQsGO2-yhSoRRenEhS_XINI-L17lHj9D_8zJKji0pjdZ8jEu0SQRhP1XEIuK1G5BlW1LTu9V0J 4GFYYCJ7g&v=OwmljH41B1Q



    Would someone mind telling me how to embed a video. Thanks
    I'm not sure that we're referring to the same video. In this one the flourishes are right at the start. Which seems to me to be the beginning of the piece. I still feel that it makes him look like an immature musician and takes away from his virtuosity. Other than that I don't think that I'm qualified to pass much judgment on a classical player. He's obviously a great player, but just not for my taste. He just looks and sounds like he's making too big a deal out it. I'm reminded of Hal Galper's advice to keep emotion out of playing. I posted before about seeing Sly and the Family Stone when they first started. I got to sit in on their rehearsals and remember today, 50 years later, Sly in the middle of a vamp saying into the mic to Jerry Martini the tenor sax man: "Be cool Jerry... Be cool". There is such a thing as being too cool for school though. A lot of amateur and semi pro singers can be guilty of just milking the emotional element to much. Sentimentality can be a deal killer for art. Sort of like having too much fun.


  12. #161

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    I'm not sure that we're referring to the same video. In this one the flourishes are right at the start. Which seems to me to be the beginning of the piece. I still feel that it makes him look like an immature musician and takes away from his virtuosity. Other than that I don't think that I'm qualified to pass much judgment on a classical player. He's obviously a great player, but just not for my taste. He just looks and sounds like he's making too big a deal out it. I'm reminded of Hal Galper's advice to keep emotion out of playing. I posted before about seeing Sly and the Family Stone when they first started. I got to sit in on their rehearsals and remember today, 50 years later, Sly in the middle of a vamp saying into the mic to Jerry Martini the tenor sax man: "Be cool Jerry... Be cool". There is such a thing as being too cool for school though. A lot of amateur and semi pro singers can be guilty of just milking the emotional element to much. Sentimentality can be a deal killer for art. Sort of like having too much fun.



    That video I posted is the whole piece.


    Just one thing, whatever flourishes you're talking about. Those are the notes in the score. Sometimes when you're trying to translate a whole orchestral work onto a guitar with 4 fingers and 6 strings, especially in parts that are supposed to be ugly, supposed to invoke unpleasant feelings, the limitations of the instrument make in not as effective a tool as the orchestra.

    But the notes are the notes, and the rhythms are the rhythms.


    Btw, none of this is to say anyone has to like him. It's just to help understand his genius.

  13. #162

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    The flourishes he's talking about have nothing to do with notes.

    But if they were written in the score, that'd be pretty cool.

  14. #163

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    I may not have been clear when referring to flourishes. I meant the big Pete Townshend like windmill arm swing that he uses to strike the opening chords. To me it looks rinky dink. He's too good a player to be doing showboat stuff like that.
    But I don't know much about classical guitar so maybe that's not uncommon.

  15. #164

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    Smdh...

  16. #165

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    I may not have been clear when referring to flourishes. I meant the big Pete Townshend like windmill arm swing that he uses to strike the opening chords. To me it looks rinky dink. He's too good a player to be doing showboat stuff like that.
    But I don't know much about classical guitar so maybe that's not uncommon.
    Seems to be quite popular move, guess it adds to "the feeling" at posh audience. Like some I know have bought sunshield caps to look more "artistic"




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  17. #166

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
    The flourishes he's talking about have nothing to do with notes.

    But if they were written in the score, that'd be pretty cool.
    1st bar is marked 'mulino a vento', check it out.

  18. #167

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    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop
    1st bar is marked 'mulino a vento', check it out.
    Well I'll be damned! I guess it's stuff like that that's the reason I'm not much into classical music. I guess we've made some progress over the centuries. imho. They used to think you could cure diseases with leeches, and that powdered wigs looked good.

  19. #168

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    mrcee:

    "Well I'll be damned! I guess it's stuff like that that's the reason I'm not much into classical music. I guess we've made some progress over the centuries. imho. They used to think you could cure diseases with leeches, and that powdered wigs looked good. "


    "..progress is our most important product.." Ronald Reagan spokesperson for General Electric''..

    as with anything that can be measured in any way..conclusions vary..even the atomic clock needs to be adjusted..

    the term "better" may and does cause much stress in communication on all levels of perception .. in general our fragile ego has an eternal need to be right even in the face of fact that it is wrong..it get out of hand-to use a gentle term-for the destruction this behavior manifests..

    though I have not personally met any of you on this forum..I would say..not bet-life taught me not too-Bill Evans can play piano better than any one here.. Steve Vai can play guitar better than anyone here..

    so..can Bill Evans play piano better than Steve Vai plays guitar...

    to even ponder the possibilities-you have to take a side..and one is better than the other..what are you using to measure..your senses are imperfect and very limited..factors like..taste and style are ever changing..inconsistent and contradictory .. you may not like something on Monday..learn something about the subject on Tuesday review it again on Wednesday and love it on Thursday and feel those that don't agree with you on Friday are limited in many ways..

    (man and/or woman:---: but 10 minutes ago..you said you liked that restaurant. Now you think it is awful..??)-the variations on this theme are endless..ask any one who is married..

    as for logic being the ultimate factor in many decisions...watch any TV commercials lately..or any of the last 50 years ??
    Last edited by wolflen; 12-26-2016 at 06:46 PM.

  20. #169

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    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop
    1st bar is marked 'mulino a vento', check it out.
    The internet has a victor, and it is you.

  21. #170

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen
    mrcee:

    "Well I'll be damned! I guess it's stuff like that that's the reason I'm not much into classical music. I guess we've made some progress over the centuries. imho. They used to think you could cure diseases with leeches, and that powdered wigs looked good. "


    "..progress is our most important product.." Ronald Reagan spokesperson for General Electric''..

    as with anything that can be measured in any way..conclusions vary..even the atomic clock needs to be adjusted..

    the term "better" may and does cause much stress in communication on all levels of perception .. in general our fragile ego has an eternal need to be right even in the face of fact that it is wrong..it get out of hand-to use a gentle term-for the destruction this behavior manifests..

    though I have not personally met any of you on this forum..I would say..not bet-life taught me not too-Bill Evans can play piano better than any one here.. Steve Vai can play guitar better than anyone here..

    so..can Bill Evans play piano better than Steve Vai plays guitar...

    to even ponder the possibilities-you have to take a side..and one is better than the other..what are you using to measure..your senses are imperfect and very limited..factors like..taste and style are ever changing..inconsistent and contradictory .. you may not like something on Monday..learn something about the subject on Tuesday review it again on Wednesday and love it on Thursday and feel those that don't agree with you on Friday are limited in many ways..

    (man and/or woman:---: but 10 minutes ago..you said you liked that restaurant. Now you think it is awful..??)-the variations on this theme are endless..ask any one who is married..

    as for logic being the ultimate factor in many decisions...watch any TV commercials lately..or any of the last 50 years ??
    Very good points.

    I mean as far as 'Vai is better than me' - well yes, but it's a wonderfully absurd example... There are so many vectors to evaluate a player. I mean how's his acoustic projection ;-) (And who cares?)

    Can you compare Bill Evans to Vai, well that's an interesting question. I daresay people who are into both are not going to be making comparisons? But then can we make comparisons between Bill Evans to Keith Jarrett, say?

    So yes, point well made, 'better' is a stupid term.

    Classical guitar is somewhat narrower in that you have about 12 pieces which everyone plays, and even then some people like this approach or that approach.
    Last edited by christianm77; 12-26-2016 at 07:26 PM.

  22. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan
    After reading this paragraph, I'm off to teach my self some piano. It's kinda the next best thing after menstrual pads with wings.



    Sent from VladanMovies @ YouTube
    I forgot to add that they are better readers and are better at playing drums than we are. Hell, I'm sure I even knew that before I chose to play the guitar instead, so you gotta ask yourself why, right? Well, for me, I didn't like that there were too many mechanisms between my fingers and the strings....

  23. #172

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove


    Would someone mind telling me how to embed a video
    Strangely nobody's answered that unless by PM.

    Just play it on YouTube and copy the URL. Paste it on here in the message and the site does it for you. It's amazing :-)

    The YouTube URL for your vid before is xhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwmljH41B1Qx. Remove the two x's (added by me so it won't display) and...bingo!

    Last edited by ragman1; 12-26-2016 at 09:50 PM.

  24. #173

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    OK, seeing that you guys wanna talk about other stuff, I'll argue against my own post ....

    Hmm.... so how about considering that the guitar takes so much more unrewarded effort than the piano (at advanced levels at least) as an argument to make that the guitar is harder to master? 10,000 quality hours from a highly talented player gets you less reward as a guitar player compared to the same effort on piano. 4 years at a music conservatory yields more impressive results (to the average listener) for the piano player, over the guitar player.

    So, we can work equally hard, just to end up sounding less impressive. Therefor, in order to sound equally impressive, the guitar is harder work

    Reductionism?. Or Sophistry?
    Or simply different preferences? I love the sound of a bent double-stop with a little bit of dirt on the amp. Try that on the piano.

    "Less reward", "more impressive" ... these are entirely subjective valuations.

    By the way, your point was discussed, earlier. The conversation simply moved on.

  25. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus
    Or simply different preferences? I love the sound of a bent double-stop with a little bit of dirt on the amp. Try that on the piano.

    "Less reward", "more impressive" ... these are entirely subjective valuations.


    .
    No. If most people will have the same impression that A is more impressive than B, then it moves beyond subjectivity. It's not apples vs oranges, it's watermelons vs grapes - as in, which is heavier....

  26. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus
    ...
    By the way, your point was discussed, earlier. The conversation simply moved on.
    Really? My point that perhaps piano players become more complete musicians because their instrument is a better "teaching machine"? Or that maybe it is harder to become a more complete musician than it is to become a less complete one, regardless of of what instrument you play?

    I must be too stupid to have noticed, forgive me, but then, I'm only a guitar player.....
    Last edited by princeplanet; 12-27-2016 at 10:11 AM.

  27. #176

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    By the way I always wondered why this Mozart's theme is always referred to as from 'The Magic Flute'...

    I can't remember it in the opera...

  28. #177

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus
    Or simply different preferences? I love the sound of a bent double-stop with a little bit of dirt on the amp. Try that on the piano.
    They have a thing for that now:


  29. #178

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    They have a thing for that now:


    Arrgh .. You beat me to it

  30. #179

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    The internet has a victor, and it is you.
    Gotta watch this guy, he almost got me with that, until I remembered "vento" is "wind."

  31. #180

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    And molino ​is Spanish for mill.

  32. #181

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    Watch this from 25:35 and tell me Yamashita isn't the greatest interpretive genius our instrument has ever seen.



    Mussorgsky: Pictures at an Exhibition Orchestra with Full Score, çµ„æ›²ã€Œå±•è¦§ä¼šã®çµ µã€ã€ã‚ªãƒ¼ã‚±ã‚¹ãƒˆ ƒ©ç‰ˆã€‘ - YouTube



    Btw, the score markings are Allegro con brio, feroces. I would argue he achieved that perfectly.

  33. #182

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    They have a thing for that now:


    Lol. He lost me at 0:17 with that vibrato.
    So many videos, so little time.

  34. #183

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove
    Watch this from 25:35 and tell me Yamashita isn't the greatest interpretive genius our instrument has ever seen.



    Mussorgsky: Pictures at an Exhibition Orchestra with Full Score, 組曲「展覧会の絵」〠ã‚ªãƒ¼ã‚±ã‚¹ãƒˆãƒ©ç‰ˆã€‘ - YouTube



    Btw, the score markings are Allegro con brio, feroces. I would argue he achieved that perfectly.
    Maybe this is the right vid. You're right he is a phenomenal player even if he's not for everyone's taste. And I have to admit that maybe classical music needs more of this type of thing. He's young and may go on to make a considerable contribution to the instrument if he hasn't already.

    Last edited by mrcee; 12-27-2016 at 02:16 PM.

  35. #184

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    I just checked his bio. He's not that young although he was when this video was made.

  36. #185

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    I just checked his bio. He's not that young although he was when this video was made.

    I really hope he revolutionizes pedagogy someday. Not that there is anything bad about the traditional methods.


    BTW I meant to compare the video I posted with the score and orchestra, to the video you just posted. He managed to get soooooooo much of that score onto the guitar, that his knowledge and understanding of the guitar (at 23 years old) is incredible.
    Last edited by vintagelove; 12-27-2016 at 03:18 PM.

  37. #186

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    Then will you agree that Jazz pianists are better musicians than Jazz guitarists?

    On average of course... I agree and that was the point of posting the Art Tatum piece in the first page of this thread.

  38. #187

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    Hey, I'm getting into this dude. I can hear he's a bit of an original, which I always like. You might hate his very Romantic way with Bach, but I think it sounds amazing. What a fantastic sound.

    “You have to know how to be vulgar. Paint with four-letter words.” Picasso...


  39. #188

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    Hey, I'm getting into this dude. I can hear he's a bit of an original, which I always like. You might hate his very Romantic way with Bach, but I think it sounds amazing. What a fantastic sound.

    “You have to know how to be vulgar. Paint with four-letter words.” Picasso...

    Bravo!

  40. #189

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    (snip)

    I'm reminded of Hal Galper's advice to keep emotion out of playing. I posted before about seeing Sly and the Family Stone when they first started. I got to sit in on their rehearsals and remember today, 50 years later, Sly in the middle of a vamp saying into the mic to Jerry Martini the tenor sax man: "Be cool Jerry... Be cool". There is such a thing as being too cool for school though. A lot of amateur and semi pro singers can be guilty of just milking the emotional element to much. Sentimentality can be a deal killer for art. Sort of like having too much fun.
    Keep emotion out like this guy?

    Which is harder, high level piano or high level guitar?-gettyimages-85232805-jpg

  41. #190

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    I never warmed to Metheny, don't know why.

  42. #191

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    Quote Originally Posted by zdub
    Keep emotion out like this guy?

    Which is harder, high level piano or high level guitar?-gettyimages-85232805-jpg
    Yeah man, it is the JAZZ FACE!

    Seriously, I think the 'keep emotion out' thing is a little misunderstood.

    One of the biggest things players struggle with once they have got the basic stuff together is actually stepping back and trying not to make something happen, or else letting the music excite them too much. This is a real problem. Trying too hard, or else getting wound up by what you are doing.

    It's like comedians not corpsing on stage. Comedy is technical.

    If you find yourself feeling this on stage, you will be rushing. Improvisation is particularly brutal in this regard because there is absolutely nowhere to hide. A professional has to find ways of countering these problems, stepping back. Minimising emotion is a good way of dong this, counter intuitive and cold though it might sound.

    On the other hand, if you play in the right zone, on a good night, without expectation, you may find emotion flowing through you music and into the audience. You don't make it, it happens. But that's certainly NOT every night.

    The other thing that music find hard to stomach is that a musician might move them deeply with their music, while the performer themselves might actually be feeling something totally different. The fans want it to be a two way love affair!

    I've had people come up and say how moved they are by the music I am making when all that's been going through my head is that it's not quite gelling etc. I don't mean to cheapen or discount the audiences reaction - that's wonderful and why I play. But it's not always true that everyone feels the same way. But the music isn't for me. I'd rather I feel a bit out of sorts and the audience feels transported, that's why I get paid!

    But then, sometimes everyone feels the same thing.

    A consummate performer like Metheny will always do the Jazz Face, although he certainly feels that he has played plenty of 'shitty gigs.' But you put the Jazz Face on anyway, because the audience doesn't want to know about the crappy on stage sound, or the mistakes that you notice which no one else does, or the fact that you didn't sleep well last night. You are for them.

    But sometimes... just sometimes... The Jazz Face is genuine!
    Last edited by christianm77; 12-28-2016 at 12:40 PM.

  43. #192

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    Quote Originally Posted by fep
    I think piano is harder. The music that the masters play is just way more complex than can be played on guitar. Mentally much more challenging.


  44. #193

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    just to add my two cents: one big difference between the piano and the guitar is that with the piano one uses the fingers always the same way. If one plays classical or jazz or pop or rock or any other genre it doesn't matter, the fingers are used always the same way.
    With the guitar you have a lot of different factors. You can play with a pick, and with that you can learn the alternate picking, the palm muting, the sweep, the gipsy technique that it's a completely different thing. There's the thumb pick. There are different kind of fingerpickings. There's the slap. There are different kinds of tappings. There are a lot of different ways to play harmonics. There's the slide. There are different ways to play legato. There are those percussive techniques used by Michael Hedges and similar guitarist, there are flamenco techniques like rasgueados or alzapua. You can play with fingernails or with the finger, or with the thumb like Wes Montgomery. The chicken picking. Bendings. Alternate tunings. Slides. And, on top of that, you can still learn to master the indipendence of two hands like a piano in several different ways.
    That's why I think that the guitar is harder. I think that it's impossible to master everything. Even Yamashita can't play like Holdsworth, and Holdsworth can't play like El nino miguel, and El nino miguel can't play like Scotty Anderson, and Scotty Anderson can't play like Michael Hedges.
    While I think it's perfectly possible for a pianist to master classical and jazz and other styles, because the fingers are always used the same way (the only possible exception I can think of is when one has to pluck the strings, but I don't think it makes all that difference).

  45. #194

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    Are you for burger, or for something fancy ...



    VladanMovies BlogSpot

  46. #195

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    Oh yeah, the "rewarding" thing, well, have you been playing guitar long? Ever tried playing the piano, even for a short time?....

    Yes to both questions -- 36 years on the guitar, and piano about ten, formal lessons on both.

    Is there anything else I can help you with?


    Quote Originally Posted by princeplanet
    Most people will think that Marilyn Monroe is sexier than Ma Kettle, but I suppose you'd argue that it's "subjective" wouldn't you?

    (Hint: if you answered no, then I won't need to support my "claim", if you answered yes, then there's no point arguing with you ...)

    ... which is just a fancy way of saying you got nothin'. Guess there's nothing else I can help you with -- cheers.

  47. #196
    Quote Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus
    Yes to both questions -- 36 years on the guitar, and piano about ten, formal lessons on both.

    Is there anything else I can help you with?





    ... which is just a fancy way of saying you got nothin'. Guess there's nothing else I can help you with -- cheers.
    Yup, I guess not....

    Meanwhile, for those of us left that agree that the guitar suffers a less favourable effort/reward ratio, does it ever bug you that non guitarists can never appreciate the difficulties that need to be overcome, particularly in Jazz? Personally I'm not bothered, but I get the feeling that some guitarists feel under appreciated.

    The other instrument that suffers in this way seems to be the trumpet. Trumpet players I know seem to be a dour bunch, so much practice for so little improvement. I asked a friend, a seasoned pro, recently how things were going on the instrument. "Ughhhh..." he said shaking his head "It's a cross to bear..."

  48. #197

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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenwave77
    Point of information here (never played piano). What do you do to produce ..."in between" tones? Sound, two adjacent (half-step apart) keys at the same time?

    Guitarists can bend strings, but what does a piano player do?
    Piano pedals

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  49. #198

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee
    Let's not forget Bud Powell.
    Probably my favorite jazz pianist. Him and Monk! I really like the stride players too like Waller and the Lion Smith!

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  50. #199

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonah
    Piano may be easier at the very beginning (no problems with sound production vizualization and all) ... especially with kids: just press the button and it sounds...

    But after this beginning level it's the same sh't for every instrument...



    Gould is by far on the other level But not beacuse he played piano...
    Why Perlman? Heiftz is way more the violin virtuoso!

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove
    Ive played classical guitar and piano both at a high level, it's not even close.


    Start here with this seemingly silly thing. The piano does not move. A guitar does. It's much harder to hit a moving target. End here 10 fingers vs 4.


    Ive literally had a professor in music school who played everything (all strings, all brass, etc) say.


    "You play classical guitar? I tried to play that, it's too freaking hard!!!..... and how do you read on that thing anyway?"





    Lastly, how many child virtuoso piano players are there (playing Bach Mozart etc)? Countless
    How many child virtuoso classical guitar players are there? A handful?
    That's a very interesting point!

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