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Here's a jazz cover of the biggest #1 hit song in the history of music and humanity (Billboard). Most here are too out of touch to put it into perspective.
Last edited by cosmic gumbo; 02-21-2020 at 12:55 AM.
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02-20-2020 04:38 AM
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Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo
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I don't think they write 'em like they used to. I know things move on but there doesn't seem to be the same soul. I'm talking about country-type songs, not jazz.
I blame the digital age, myself. I think it's made the brain shallow.
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Why isn't jazz popular? You should ask, "why isn't rock popular?" Truth of the matter is that only hip-hop seems to get traction, these days. It rather reminds me of the late-70s, when only disco seemed to matter. Hip-hop, however, has had MUCH longer legs than disco with the music listening public.
I'm not complaining--musical tastes will go where they will. I simply recognize that my musical tastes are "niche," vis-a-vis those of the music listening public. NBD, except that it keeps jazz gigs paying pretty much what they've paid for the last 50 years.
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Jazz is extremely popular - amongst those who like that sort of thing. But so is trainspotting :-)
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Originally Posted by ragman1
I am talking about grown ups, teenagers, and kids. There are a lot of ways jazz players can be more inclusive. A lot of ways they can relate. In their set list, which doesn't water down anything, and in their attitudes.
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Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo
Play Jazz and other music while you can; looks like the end time is near for music as we have known it.
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Originally Posted by pauln
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Originally Posted by pauln
This and Iron Man movies is our culture in the 21st century.
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Originally Posted by pauln
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Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo
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Finally I read the article referred in the OP. It seems it does not even try to answer its created question, instead a rant on jazz police, without describing the authors incidents or experiments with the jazz police. The repeating statements about how the jazz police is wrong, and how open is jazz. Of course any police like attitude on art or taste is a bad thing.
The very first statement about jazz is not a genre because it has 100 years history leads nowhere. Classical music also has long history, this must not prevent us to think about as a category (if one insist to not use the genre term)
I think the author in its battle against the jazz police is missing the point, and what is more disturbing, the author missing the difference between freedom and opennes. Freedom is necessary for all creative human activity, so freedom is essential element of jazz, but this does not mean limitless opennes, which would lead to resolving and vanishing jazz in the "big open music universe"
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Originally Posted by sunnysideup
in all eras, in all styles, 'pop music' tends to be that which is DANCEY....the stuff that both sticks in one's head AND gets one's feet tapping....the stuff which has a kineticism which generates a sympathic-resonance within the human body/mind/spirit.
AND it's the stuff that's 'catchy'....'catchy' is a quality i rate highly...because it's RARE, not commonplace or easy...if it was easy a zillion songwriters and tunesmiths would be making zillions of dollars in royalties....
the average joe & jill would be humming every 'classic' solo by every bop saxophonist ever....but they dont....but they DO hum 'take the A train' or 'all blues'....gee i wonder why that is?
louis armstrong for decades...heaps of swing stuff...plenty of ellington....lotsa miles, coltrane's 'my favorite things'....ahmad jamal, ramsey lewis and vince guaraldi's piano trios--these come to mind as jazz artists who reached ears and audiences far-beyond the narrow confines of 'jazz fans'....who grabbed the ears of a housewife--who knew little about jazz--doing dishes while the radio played....AND the ears & minds of the 'in-crowd'...
the 'in-crowd' versus the 'those clueless uninformed philistines' trip exists in many other genres....and many other mediums: in literature, painting etc...it puzzles me....funny how it's often intertwined-with, generated-by, and even led-by The Critics--those savants whose profession is by definition reactionary. No art, no critic.
What artist DOESNT hope to reach as large an audience as possible? (I say 'artist' as distinct from entertainer...creators--not purveyors, panderers or copycats.)
Other elements in play: when jazz WAS pop music, much of it came 'from the street': performed at joints which entire communities regularly flocked to, the bands making use of tunes which most people knew (in early new orleans jazz many tunes were also tunes which string bands (fiddle n banjo etc) and marching bands played...or were jumbled-up adaptations of songs which vaudeville and minstrel-show performers sang, when such entertainments were the TV and internet of the day.)
This is an interesting topic, one which i think about all the time, poke at, wonder about, ponder. I could write 25,000 more words about it, but this aint the place for that.
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my blab above? duke said it way better: "dont mean a thing if it aint got that swing"
why i go to jazz clubs like never (tho i listen to, and play, jazz a lot)....but go to contemporary dance joints a LOT: chasing that swing, seeking the kinetic
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What happened to jazz? I believe it is easily explained in the parable of Mr Toot, climaxing at the 2:00 mark. His music may not have been jazz, but the story is both universal and timeless.
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Pop critic Kitty Empire had this to say, which I thought was well put
KE: .... Experiencing Mahler’s Second brought up a welter of thoughts about why we like what we like. Why do people hate jazz? I think it’s because they don’t hear the fracturedness, the urge towards freedom that strains against tidy metre, the boldness otherwise denied to African Americans in the 1920s. They just hear some busker be-bopping out of context in a shopping mall, and want to wrap that saxophone around the nearest lamppost. I have been that person, but grew up some time ago. There’s an American popular song from the 1960s called Do You Hear What I Hear? – it’s indirectly about the baby Jesus, but the central thought holds. A good critic will wear their learning lightly, but build a bridge of words from raw sound to a reader’s brain.
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Here's an actual quote from a non-music board where the OP's topic was, "Great Guitarists" (I abstained from participating):
"I know nothing about jazz guitarists other than they play really fast, know a lot of different chords, and like a flat tone. Not a fan."
And now, for something on the lighter side:
Addendum: I was thinking of throwing in Jack Zucker's quote: "We think we know what we like, but really we like what we know." But I have no interest in entering into a pissing contest with a bunch of skiing fanatics stuck at home without much to do. I did make a single contribution: "Check out Julian Lage." But I'm leaving it at that.Last edited by Tom Karol; 04-13-2020 at 11:28 AM.
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Perhaps another aspect is that increasingly the allure of instant gratification is a priority, in the form of clear and concise messages via sounds and images reinforced by familiarity and so no time 'wasted' in trying to understand (there are potato chips engineered so that there's an initial burst of flavour which soon after quickly dissipates and so encouraging you to eat another) and jazz isn't as immediately rewarding for a listener, especially a new one. And that's pity, because any art forn that adds to the quality of life should be treasured.
tl;dr maybe across the board artificial stimulus in the short term is encouraging apathy.Last edited by TLR; 06-05-2020 at 02:57 AM.
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Jazz has always been popular - just not in the United States. You had to go to England, France, Poland and the rest of the old-world to find people with the musical culture to understand jazz in its many forms (true also of the old blues).
Oscar Wilde once commented, "America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between."
I think this explains a lot of things about my country. I was always amazed that it took the English musicians of the '60s to recognize and even venerate the African-American delta blues roots and their artists when Motown and later Hip-hop were totally clueless to their beginnings, one of the two truly American musical gifts to the world (blues & jazz). The European cultures were open to these magnificent genres when Americans dismissed them.
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Originally Posted by Beartooth
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Very excellent!!! Thanks for sharing!!!
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Originally Posted by steve burchfield
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Well jazz was popular, when it was called swing, it was the pop music of its day. It hasn't been popular since the beboppers arrived and lowered the danceable element while raising the "art" element.
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Originally Posted by Gillespie
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Originally Posted by citizenk74
All of Me - A7 on measure #28 (9th?)
Today, 10:24 AM in Theory