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01-06-2017 05:16 PM
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Nice!
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Nice indeed.
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Very nice. It is interesting that with years of playing, even when we're not 'thinking' tonally, we wind up playing tonally, perhaps with just different means of organization. Because, there's a difference between not thinking of a key and intentionally trying to compose atonally.
At simplest we can also just try to intentionally avoid something 'normal' or what we would normally do, which is hard to do on the spot.
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That was VERY cool!
Can you please say a few words about how you recorded this piece?
Like what Guitar/Amp/Interface/Effects/Recording-Software did you use?
Thanks!
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Yeah! This was very interesting try. I compose a lot parts of songs by using non-music related imagination (you can listen Korpijärvi or Spring's diversity on my youtube channel if you want). But here I tried not to think anything just produce a song where I don't know key and things like that. I have to practice this more.
Originally Posted by JakeAcci
Thank you for your comment!
Cheers, Mikko
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Hello Christoph R.! Originally Posted by Christoph R.
I use the cheapest equipment available. The guitar is my only electric one. It's Tokai stratocaster that was build for music store to try-guitar for Seymore Duncan mikes. Amp is Peavey Classic 30 little bit modified (I don't know how). Then it was recorded with Zoom h2 (like all of my videos are) and GarageBand. I made three tracks of the one track and used some effects like chorus, reverb, compressor, stereo and delay on different tracks and panned them to different speakers.
I don't have money for good recording equipment so I try to invent ways to some how handle with these cheap ones.
Thank you for asking! If you are interested you can check out free lessons from my site:
http://mikkokarhula.wixsite.com/mikkokarhula
Kindest,
Mikko
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Hey Mikko!
Thanks for the quick reply and detailed answer!
Great Sound you got there and on your other youtube-videos also!
Best regards, Christoph
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Thanks Christoph! Originally Posted by Christoph R.
Keep on playing!
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Just putting your heart in the music is good enough for me.
Great Approach
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After reading this thread last night, I sat down with my Ibanez and started working on being less beholden to key and scale. Thanks for the kick in the ass.
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Thank you! So true! Originally Posted by beetle_rist
Cheers,
Mikko
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You are welcome! Theory, technique and music leaning overall is very important. But it's very interesting to find balance with things and try methods like this. Originally Posted by Thumpalumpacus
Keep on playing!
Here is some free lessons that might ins pirate:
http://mikkokarhula.wixsite.com/mikkokarhula
cheers, Mikko
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I get this...I find myself starting in a key....thinking....ok your in Eminor...then drifting off somewhere...trying to finish up in Eminor.......What is really happening is we are using are ears...as we should......we may be drifting in and out of keys or something modal.......But the concentration is on the composition......Not a problem if playing solo.......
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Being too hung up on key is a deal breaker for an improvising jazz musician imo. Jazz by nature, even at it's most conservative, is outside compared to other genres. I've told this story before but I used to play with a horn player who was way tripped out on what key the tune was in. And he was too good of a player to be thinking like that. He told me that he was once playing with some people and he asked one of the guys "what key is the tune in?" The guy just told him to make up his own key.
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Being too hung up on key is a deal breaker for an improvising jazz musician imo. Jazz by nature, even at it's most conservative, is outside compared to other genres. I've told this story before but I used to play with a horn player who was way tripped out on what key the tune was in. And he was too good of a player to be thinking like that. He told me that he was once playing with some people and he asked one of the guys "what key is the tune in?" The guy just told him to make up his own key.
Nice story and I'm happy that you shared it. Music is full of interesting aspects. It's never ending trip.
I have published this video in Finnish forums and people has told stories like this:
Barnie Kessel has practiced in dark room and also Finnish guitarist Rauol Björkenheim does this and teaches it. That way they try to get out of the visual aid and rely only their ears (I think). I think this is interesting. IMO darkness can interrupt concentration. But this is worth of trying.
Another idea was to re-tune guitar maybe in random tune. And then play and get new harmonies that you are not aware of when taking certain chord form with your fingers.
Interesting ideas.
Cheers,
Mikko
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Improvising is an art form..it seems to me everybody takes a different approach...I guess based on how our brains are wired......If you listen to various pro's masterclasses you get that.....
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I think that playing in the dark sometimes and to a lesser extent retuning the guitar are good ideas.
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You are right! Originally Posted by artcore
What I have worked out already is: IMO we are partly what has happened to us, good and bad things. Memories are attached to our feelings. And if we are not enchaining us to theory-only and technique-only thinking we might find different way to choose notes. When I compose often some memory comes to my mind and it's loaded with feelings. I try to carry with that feeling and choose harmonies that support it. So I think that we choose notes that affect us, notes that we find pleasant, unpleasant, scary, happy etc. and we all have lived different life and have different memories and feelings come out differently.
This is one way to be unique.
I'm sure that many can find that gibberish but I believe it because it happens in my head.
If some one is interested you can join my Facebook group "Creative Concepts for Guitar" and share your own ideas.
Kindest
Mikko
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Beautiful.
I don't hear it as Atonal but wandering nicely through various Chordal Centers ...but who cares what I think ?
Sounds really nice and Modern and 'Harmonically Expanded ' and well played and composed !
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Thank you! And yes I do care what you think. That´s why this video is in this forum. Originally Posted by Robertkoa
I always try to make music that I find beautiful to my ears even when I make "ugly" note chooses. They are there for in reason to make things after that or before that more beautiful.
I wanted this composition to be hew to me and still tonal. I haven't ever composed atonal song. I haven't try to hear it in my head maybe I wouldn't hear it.
Cheers, Mikko
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yeah i guess atonal = attempting to not have a center, while "keyless thinking" would mean more so trying to not be thinking about keys at all, whether in or out. I dig that the original attempt here wasn't to avoid having a tonic.
I think it also could be argued that anything "atonal" that still uses the 12 pitches does in fact have a key center, just the key centers are switching quickly, and it becomes a stretch to justify.
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You couldn't say it better. Originally Posted by JakeAcci
Thank you JakeAcci!
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Yes. And just for me a Key is often too broad of a Concept ( with 6 Chordal Scale Degrees / Secondary Dominants etc etc ) so I try to think of Chordal Regions or Chordal Centers- the Vibe of the Chord and Color of the Voicing because everything flows toward that Chordal Center at phrase endings ... Originally Posted by JakeAcci
And some voicings are beautfully ambiguous and some Chord Sequences are bordering on Atonal because they are continually modulating or ambiguous...but still someone improvising or Singing has to land on a chord tone so I call it a chordal center or region ...
Yes ...I am oversimplifying whether an Aminor 7 is a ii in Gmajor or a i in Aminor ...but hopefully I would react to that AFTER the Aminor 7 chord...or maybe not...lol.
Anyway what I like about the OPs Composition is it has a really nice floating quality...not too dissonant...sounds good feels good.
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Thank you Robertkoa! Nice thinking, It taught me some new things. Originally Posted by Robertkoa
and I completely agree with you. I love to analyze everything but there is moments in my compositions where I just let it flow and don't want to think about the keys, tonic, chordal center...In this little composition I tried to make it wholly with out thinking these things. It was actually hard in some parts. I hope this example helped someone in someway of one's playing.
Here are a lot of amazingly wise people on this site and if you are interested you can join my guitar group in Facebook (Creative Concepts for Guitar). There are great players from my home land Finland and from other countries too that share their ideas for playing and practicing.
Kindest, Mikko
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