Close voicings?

[jazzpazz]

Hello. Im a bit confused about what close voicing really is, and be glad to get some insights from the experts!

From this link Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary (244 Chord Shapes)

Say in the first major 7 chords, I can identify the drop 2 and 3. But the picture 4 and 6 (going left to right) I know are closed voicings. But know anything more about them. Like why are the called closed voicings? I can see I don't drop any chordal notes in those. Are there only 2 of these in major 7? a and d rooted

Same questions also applies in the minor 7 pictures. Yet the picture 4 under the minor 7 seems like a normal minor a rooted shell chord? With the 3rd added? And picture 6 here is drop 2, yet the picture 5 shows a closed voicings? I can see its doubled root.

And why are there only 5 in the dominant section?

Thanks for the help guys. I tried being as clear as I could, do let me know I need to specify something more

[dconeill]

Here's my understanding:

A **close** voicing is a voicing in which the notes are as close together as possible in music notation, usually within one octave.

A **closed** voicing is a chord voicing in which no open strings are used when forming the chord fingering. This phrase might be guitar-specific.

[FRRGC_]

A closed voicing just means the range of all the notes does not exceed an octave. For Major 7 chords 4 and 6, the distance between the lowest note C and the highest note B is a Major 7th, just shy of an octave, while chords 1 and 3 span a perfect 12th (the 5th an octave up) and chords 2 and 5 span a major 10th (the 3rd an octave up) so those four voicings would be considered open voicings. Similarly with the minor 7 chords, number 5 spans exactly an octave which counts as a closed voicing, while the rest all have larger distances between the lowest and highest notes. It doesn't come up here, but its worth noting closed and open voicings can exist for any inversion. If you had a voicing that were degrees 3, 5, 7, 1, that would be less than an octave and count as a closed voicing.

There actually is another Dominant chord that fits with the given chord examples which would be x3235x (degrees 1, 3, b7, 3). I assume it was excluded because it requires a big stretch from your pinky, so some might not call it a *basic* chord. I often use that shape but add the 13 on top by barreing my pinky x32355.

I'll throw in another minor7b5 chord voicing that I use a lot too. Unfortunately you can't use it for C unless you go up an octave, so I'll instead give you an Em7b5. The voicing is played x7533x which are degrees 1, b3, b5, b7, which, unlike any of the m7b5 voicings they showed, is a closed voicing.

[FRRGC_]

After writing all that I just saw dconiell's response and realized I completely forgot about "open chords" on guitar which mean the chord has one or more open strings lol. What I explained in my previous comment is general music theory regardless of instruments, while "open chords" are specific to string instruments. The vocabulary is similar/the same, but the concepts are completely unrelated. For what its worth, I've never heard a chord be referred to as a closed chord because it doesn't contain open strings, but I guess you could call it that.

If you played a C major 7 chord as x3200x it would be an open chord (has open strings) but it would be a closed voicing (does not exceed an octave).

[ragman1]

Hello. Im a bit confused about what close voicing really is

Closed Position Guitar Chords - All Shapes (Not Just Triads)

[frabarmus]

Place your fingers (even randomly and without stretching them) on a piano keyboard, hear the sounds that are generated.
What you get is close voicings. Usually unlike what you naturally get on guitar, due to the nature of Standard tuning.

[jazzpazz]

Thanks guys for clearing this up for me

So there is only one for practical playable closed voicing for the dominant? Since it only listed one.

And is the picture 5 under the minor category the only closed voicing for minor? The picture 4 in the same minor category also seems to be a minor shell chord with 9# if im not mistaken?

[FRRGC_]

So there is only one for practical playable closed voicing for the dominant? Since it only listed one.

And is the picture 5 under the minor category the only closed voicing for minor? The picture 4 in the same minor category also seems to be a minor shell chord with 9# if im not mistaken?

Basically yeah. You can also omit notes like the higher octave of the root in the dominant picture 4 and minor picture 5, which would be a basic shell voicing and in this case, a closed voicing.

For picture 4, the top note is not a #9, but a b3. They are technically the same note, but since a minor chord includes a b3 it just confuses things to refer to it as a #9, especially since a natural 9 is a common extension on a minor chord. If you're thrown off because the note is doubled being played in two octaves, thats fine, you would still call both of them b3. A #9 will only come up on a chord that has a Major 3rd.

Some bonus facts, a #9 will 99.9% of the time will be found in a Dominant chord, and Dominant chords with a #9 will ALSO sound good with a b9. Generally speaking, a Dominant chord with a natural 9 will lead to a Major chord, and a Dominant with an altered 9 (b9/#9) will lead to a minor chord.

[dconeill]

There seems to be a conflation of "close voicing" with "closed voicing". Similar names, I fear.

But as far as I've been able to tell by searching, the correct term for a chord voiced within a single octave, regardless of instrument, is a "close" voicing. Note also the complementary term "open" voicing, which denotes a chord that is voiced over more than an octave.

The term "closed" voicing appears to be an idiosyncratic, guitar-related term for a voicing that doesn't involve any open strings. It clearly is not in universal use, but it is used by some writers. Similarly, using the term "open voicing" to refer to a chord on guitar that involves open strings is a misuse of the term in comparison to standard usage.

It's unfortunate that the two terms "close" and "closed" are so similar.

Maybe neologisms like "fretted voicing", for chord voicing on guitar that doesn't use any open strings, and "open-string voicing" when unfretted, open strings are used, would be better.

[orri]

Here's my understanding:

A **closed** voicing is a chord voicing in which no open strings are used when forming the chord fingering. This phrase might be guitar-specific.

Is that really every used?
There definitely logic to it, in the sense that open chords (I think the term open chord is more often used than open voicing) are in the open position and use open strings, so what should we call "non-open" chord voicings? There is some logic to saying "closed" instead of "non-open". We do talk about open strings but we don't talk about "closed" strings (AFAIK?). It seem but me that this logic of using "closed" for "non-open" leads us to the wrong conclusion?

I wonder if the term open voicing on piano has the same kind misunderstanding. It might have started with the term "close voicing" which became "closed voicing" and then we needed a term for "non-closed" voicing and came up with "open voicing" (which is a term used on piano). The term "spread voicing" is also used and I prefer it. Spread vs. close feels more descriptive for chord voicings.

[ragman1]

People use these terms in different ways. In other words they're confused. Websites and You Tubes, it's the same. They say Close or Closed at random. Open can mean anything. One guy on a You Tube pronounced Close as Cloze, like Closed without the d.

Don't trust it, not an inch. Have your own understanding but be prepared to interpret and translate depending on who/what you're dealing with. Honestly.

[jazzpazz]

Thanks for answer guys.

Are the chords further down in chapter 3 extensions built on the chords higher up? That would be shell chords, drop 2 and 3. With built I mean using those chords as a base, then just altering them as needed. I thought so at first glance but when inspecting them further it seems like they are their own creation? It could be im just to green to see the patterns tho

And do you guys mostly know all of these chords? Is that kind of where the level is?

[sgosnell]

The word close has more than one meaning. It can mean near, as in 'close to you', or it can mean 'close the door, this isn't a barn'. The spelling is the same, but the pronunciation is different. This is unfortunately common in the English language. My understanding has always been that when used in relation to chord voicing, the pronunciation is with a soft s, meaning the notes in the voicing are near to each other, not more than an octave apart. My degree is in English, not music, however.

[wolflen]

Sometime I teach..one thing I say is.."the guitar is illogical"

Its standard tuning is difficult at best to work around in chord construction and solos.

Chord names and theory explanations can vary widely .. and may only prompt more questions without clear answers..much like a
phone menu to a government agency.

terms like close voicing vs open voicing can be brain twisters to the new guitarist ..

if a store is open you can shop there if its closed you cant

If something is close I can see it .. if its not close..its far?

To someone new to teaching guitar vs music..the challenge to explain what a KEY is and how some chords can be in several keys--oh boy!!

to me..Close voicing is..the chord notes are as close as possible - in the same octave usually. Open voicing - the chord notes may be placed in two octaves

the way to fully understand this is learn basic triads and their inversions on all string sets and positions in all keys

then..four note chords..and the many inversions ..and the learning of open/wide voicings-- some notes may be in one octave and some an octave higher/lower

and the resulting confusion until some study of harmony and voice leading is understood.

jazzpazz-- is is not just knowing the chords but how they work together..this takes alot of time and practice

many of us on this forum know jazz harmony and music theory to some extent..some know much more and are pro musicians.

Dont feel overwhelmed..we all have felt that at some point. Go slow .. digest fully...learn some tunes study how the chords work in them.

hope some of this helps