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Typically, what seems to happen at my level (in a no book situation) is that the lead instrument, usually a horn, has a pretty good grasp on the melody, but is more likely to play an interpretation than stick right to the original. The pianist, if there is one, plays the changes he likes - which could be anything. RB changes are most likely, but I know some players who just sort of improvise a reharm on the spot.
It's hard enough for the guitarist to fit in with a busy pianist (a lot are) even if playing changes out of a book. But, with the pianist reharmonizing on the fly and perhaps differently every chorus, laying out looks better and better. If the pianist is playing RB changes, you then deal with the issue that not all the RB's have the same changes. When there was one RB, that wasn't a problem but now there has to be a discussion between guys with different paper books and the electronic tablet guys.
In a band where everybody has big enough ears to know what's "right" and immediately identify what is being played at the moment, this all works out. But not every player can do that reliably. Even so, most of the time, it works out. If I'm the only chord instrument and I'm playing just 2 or 3 notes, there isn't much chance for a major clash. If there's a pianist, I'm likely to defer. If I can't figure out the piano chord, I try to get a couple of notes that work.
Also, the people I play with know the usual standards but nobody wants to play them very much. People want to play more obscure tunes. So, often, knowledge of a recording or composer's chart just isn't there.
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06-04-2019 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by christianm77
I guess another option over Fmin6 is Bb7, which isn’t dissonant at all.Last edited by KirkP; 11-07-2019 at 07:26 PM.
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Originally Posted by christianm77
F/F#dim/C6 [G in bass] G#dim/A9/
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Originally Posted by christianm77
John
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Originally Posted by John A.
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Originally Posted by Kojo27
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Originally Posted by greveost
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Originally Posted by christianm77
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Uncle Joe was a union man out in California, the Bay Area to be exact, I have his Union card someplace...
Anyway, he was a pro grew up in territory bands etc... and they would get these Union books which I have seen and they were kind of like the Real Book only the transcriptions were very rudimental. It was up to the musician to use those books as a map and work up their own Arrangements.
These union books were highly guarded and sold by genre and as a union they paid royalties to the artists whose songs were contained in those books.
I don't know if they were called Union books but as a union member you had access to them and you paid for them as the unions held the rights to these songs as much as ASCAP does these days with royalty fees generated from DJs etc going to the correct copyrighted entity .
Later on the real book came out in which the arrangements and chords were much better, but I think people have gotten away from working up their own arrangements and I believe that has become a stagnanted part of the process in the community as a result.
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Thank you for that fascinating post. I love the first line, sounds like the start of a short story....
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Originally Posted by christianm77
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I had always heard that Gary Burton penned the first Real Book. IDK whether it's true.
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I think the problem is the title!!! If it had been called the " Pointing you in a Jazz like direction Book" or "WinkWinkNodNodBook" or "JazzStuffBook" we might not be getting so concerned)
Will
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Originally Posted by starjasmine
Allegedly the 5th edition handwriting is that of Steve Swallow. The books were sold by word-of-mouth, and back alleys like knock off watches, etc. I got mine in about 1980 by sending $20 cash to an address in Illinois provided to me by my jazz guitar teacher, and received my 5th edition in a plain brown wrapper a couple of weeks later. All very skulduggeryish. That version has some errata pages with corrections to make to various charts.
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Originally Posted by starjasmine
In fairness, most of the mistakes in the RB are of the careless chart preparation variety. But there are some real oddities. I cannot imagine a professional jazz musician getting the charts so incorrect for Four for instance.
So I think it’s more likely that some of the charts may have been from Burton’s pads, and many of them transcribed by talented but slightly careless students. Given the variety of handwriting it seems likely it was a mix of sources.
Anyway I like the mistakes, for me they are part of the history..... of course the newer editions straighten everything out. Makes it a better book, but less interesting.
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To the OP - the real book is definitive. The recorded music is frequently inaccurate.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
But also
F F#dim C/G G#o7 Am D7 G7 can I get a hallelujah?
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Originally Posted by KirkP
Ethan Iverson picks up on this often in his blog. Gunther Schuller described them as mistakes, which Iverson regards as .... a mistake.
Here’s a great example from recent years from a player who certainly is doing it on purpose:
Last edited by christianm77; 11-02-2019 at 07:05 AM.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
TL;DR version is Steve's handwriting does not appear in the Real Book, but his did give some of his handwritten charts of his own tunes to the students who make the original book, and they created new versions of those charts. Steve also wrestled with the idea of giving away his compositions for free in written form, and ultimately decided he'd be better off with them circulating in bootleg form and hopefully then being recorded by people exposed to them through the real book. He doesn't regret that decision in this interview.
To add to the short history on the Official Realbook website, check out this book review about a book chronicling the history of the fakebook:
Peter Spitzer Music Blog: Review: "The Story of Fake Books" and the "6th Edition Real Book"
To the question of the OP, "Who says the Real Book is 'Wrong'", this guy makes the argument that it's time to retire at least the original bootleg version:
It's Time To Get Rid Of Your Real BookLast edited by 44lombard; 11-02-2019 at 05:30 PM.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
Last edited by christianm77; 11-02-2019 at 06:45 PM.
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Originally Posted by christianm77
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Originally Posted by John A.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
John
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Originally Posted by John A.
Jam Session Journal (April 2024)
Today, 02:46 AM in From The Bandstand