Nondiatonic book?

[SoftwareGuy]

I honestly play more melancholic alt/indie rock stuff but everything i do (pretty much) comes from using the 7 notes that are in key. I know there are ways to utilize the other 5 notes and i want to learn. I hear jazz guitarists know theory very well.

My method: loop a chord progression then play scales/dyads/triads over top. Ive been experimenting with adding additional notes like the flatted 5th (blues scale), chromatic parts, the harmonic minor scale, and occasionally (been a while) bebop scales

I know that in a minor progession, the iv and v chords can be major and that sometimes works. I want to know more about stuff like this.

Im pretty much strictly an improvisational guitarist that relies on theory to help me pick what will work and what wont. Just trying to branch out and figure out more ways to utilize those other 5 notes.

I hope this clarifies things

Edit: also i know enough that i could probably figure out sheet music and tabs but learning songs doesnt interest me. I prefer to improvise and was hoping there was something out there that was explained in a way that would be easier to follow for my way of viewing things

2nd edit:

^example of where im at now (improvised jam for my buddy's business' youtube page from a week or so ago)

I sometimes do the same thing. I loop some chords and then explore what things sound like against the chord progression.

There are notes that are 1) diatonic but not in the chord and 2) non diatonic. For each the question is what type of approach sounds good to you and what resolution sounds good. There is much to explore.

[pamosmusic]

Actually in terms of ways to study this type of thing, taking a good look at folk music might be smart. You get simple chords, but sometimes some mode mixture or melodies written in one of a couple common modes. Devices like IV to iv, minor key ending on I (Picardy third) and things like that.

So you can see how that stuff works in the wild.

[bako]

21st Century Guitar by Steve Bloom is a neat presentation all 3 and 4 note structures and all kinds of playable and semi-playeable chord shapes using these notes. A post-tonal approach with chord diagrams on top of the notation. He doesn’t name anything, just codified by its prime form structure. This may or may not be what you’re looking for, but it’s what comes to mind for me from your question.

[wolflen]

It’s simple:

C Major scale has 7 notes: CDEFGAB

That leaves five notes which happen to form Eb Pentatonic Minor: Eb Gb Ab Bb Db

Sprinkle those extra notes like ground chilli pepper for spice. The girls will love you, and you’ll become rich!

Yes!! and experiment .. use each note of the Eb pent scale as another pent scale against C Maj and other C type root chords and all
the chords in the C maj scale..there are alot of ideas in this kind of thinking..circle of fifths/fourths .. minor third..flat five..diminished/augmented scales..

hmmm..I dont know about becoming rich..and the girls,,YMMV

[BreckerFan]

The key to using chromaticism is the contrast between inside and outside playing. It's not so much about the specific notes as it is about how you take a line outside and how you take it back inside, and making sure everything resolves correctly. But the crucial first step is being able to clearly outline the progression you're playing over. Just because all 7 notes are diatonic, that doesn't mean they're all "right" over a chord; using arpeggios specific to each chord and then learning how to resolve those arpeggios into each other will strongly outline the harmony and give more direction to your improvisation. And this isn't just specific to jazz, being able to ground your melodies in the harmony is pretty important for most popular styles of music today. Based on what I heard, I think you should focus on that before delving into chromaticism.

The other crucial step is to listen. It's not about just learning the scales abstractly; unless you can hear the ideas you want to play, they won't really be a part of your playing. Find some music that you like that uses these concepts and get it engrained in your ears. Even better, transcribe it. Trying to learn "non-diatonic theory" in the abstract is a pretty daunting task. Finding a concrete example that you like and that you can absorb will greatly speed up the process.

[alltunes]

Anyone have any suggestions on good easy to follow book on nondiatonic theory? Id prefer something that didnt involve sheet music.

Thanks!

This book may interest you but asking for a book that doesn’t involve sheet music is a big ask. But there are some conceptual ideas in here that may fit what you are looking for.

https://berkleepress.com/guitar/the-guitarists-guide-to-composing-and-improvising/