The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #26

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    You should look into how people tackle rhythm changes, as this is essentially the same progression. E.g. here’s some ideas from Jens Larsen. He starts with the Barry Harris approach, which is actually to simplify it down to just 2 chords.


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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

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    Parker spent a lot of his early career playing

    Bb | Cm7 F7 | Bb | Cm7 F7 |
    Bb7 | Eb7 | Bb | Cm7 F7 |

    On rhythm tunes

    Later introduced G7 into bar 3... Maybe Ebm in bar 6

  4. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by alltunes
    surely there must be a few guidelines besides what I hinted at in my OP?
    You're still asking 'how to play it'. There's no magic formula. If there was, all you'd do is repeat yourself. I told you, figure out the chord functions and play that: D7 to Gm, Gm to C7, and C7 to F. No formula, just the basic stuff. Which I described as well.

    maj 7th to 3rd 1/2 step motion
    guide tones
    That's a formula. If you follow formulas you'll get trapped in formulas and your solos will sound like formulas. Know your stuff, then you can play anything you like.

  5. #29

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    Okay, last example. Pay attention :-)

    Here are two backings.

    The first one is just F - C7 - F strummed. Completely basic.

    The next one is FM7/D7#9 - Gm9/C7b9 - F6.

    (The treble notes you hear aren't me playing a tune, they're the notes on the top of each chord).

    Then there are 3 lines, moving up the neck. I just played over the strum version 3 times, that's all. F-C7-F. No attempt at any clever stuff. No formulas, just as they came out. Vanilla.

    You hear them both twice, first with the strum, then against the jazz chords.

    You'll see that, although each line is very simple, playing them against the jazz chords gives them a different flavour. And there are no clashes. No notes were planned and no notes were manipulated to suit the jazz chords later.

    The point in this is to realise what the jazz chords are doing. The jazz chord version, although it's much more complex, is only an embellishment of the first one. D7 is a secondary dominant sub for F and Gm7 is the ii of C7, also a sub.

    So people look at jazz chords, like the second version here, and think 'OMG, how the hell do I solo over THAT???!'

    But if they know that it's just F-C7-F, and play that, the problem's over. Of course, as you get better you can pretty it up but the basic groundwork is laid.

    Hope you get the point. It's worth it.


  6. #30

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    Thanks for the example. I agree you can just play with key centers a lot and it will sound good over the jazz chords with accidentals. Imo you have to outline some of the jazz chords as you're playing for it to sound good, jazzy, and sophisticated. Even if you use the key center approach to not get bogged down with changes everywhere. Certainly when I'm practicing I'm going to work the chords to try to make up melodies to outline the changes and not just play notes from 1 key center.

    New member here. I can already tell that I like this forum because of the good players, records, and theory and resources. I've been working theory like in this thread a lot. Where I use inversions both with the chords and arpeggios to keep the 1625 in one spot on the neck to not jump around to root positions everywhere and be able to flow from chord to chord fluently. I'll try to record some examples and write up some diagrams in the future. Where's the Tal Farlow icon? haha jk.

  7. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clint 55
    Imo you have to outline some of the jazz chords as you're playing for it to sound good, jazzy, and sophisticated.
    I know, that's what I meant by 'pretty it up'.

  8. #32

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    Formula: play a pretty melody.

  9. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by alltunes
    Fair enough but surely there must be a few guidelines besides what I hinted at in my OP?

    maj 7th to 3rd 1/2 step motion
    guide tones


    Duly noted though as this little self exploration exercise today has taught me more then my guitar instruction book collecting habit

    As Pierre would say "time on the instrument"
    That's usually what gets me the furthest as well - if I create a good exercise for myself that will be relevant to creating actual music.

    In addition to what I said in my last post, ideally for me for playing 1625 on the spot would be a mix of the key center approach and of outlining chords. Because if all you do is run up and down the arpeggios the whole time it's going to sound crazy. At the same time if all you do is play in F major, it's going to sound lame. Probably have to shed the changes and then be able to play in F and then hit changes at strategic times.
    Last edited by Clint 55; 10-29-2020 at 03:09 PM.